TC: Any reason against it?

[440BB]

Things sure can get heated in this thread.

I wish there was some way to let cooler heads prevail.

Ironic humor anyone?

 

[BillW50]

Why it is embarrassing to setup TC to vape exactly like power mode? I would think many would like this. In TC terminology this is called power dominant. And a vaper wouldn't be able to tell the difference between TC and power mode configured this way. The TC that people normally try is called temperature dominant and then they complain it doesn't vape like power mode. Of course it doesn't.

If I can't tell the difference anyway in the first place, then logically it follows that it can't be better so what's your point? If I can ride my bicycle without training wheels, then logically it follows that I don't need training wheels, but if, on the other hand, riding my bicycle without training wheels is causing me to fall flat on my face, then that's when the story fully changes.

Whoa! Use your head man! If it vapes just like power mode and also prevents you from burnt hits... that is a HUGE PLUS! This is what most vapers hate and that science warns us about the dangers of vaping.

But there are some really dense people out there and they claim they like that nice burnt taste. Well then burnt hit protection wouldn't be for them then. So are you one of them?

 

[Brewdawg1181]

A few pages back, this was informative, then slightly entertaining. But just tuning back in and....what kind of contest is this?

And why does it smell like urine in here?

I'm exercising my right to change channels. This is too much like the internet.

 

[BillW50]

The whole idea is to mitigate the risks also in the rarest event that the safety mechanisms that are built into the manufacturing process, the safety inspections of both that and the batteries themselves, or the safety mechanisms that can be built into the batteries themselves (PTC, CID), might somehow fail. But in order to force a battery to just blow up in someone's face without there being any prior warning signs of any kind whatsoever (sizzling/hissing, smoke, etc.) it normally needs to be abused/mishandled really significantly very hard, and, the chance of a battery explosion under normal usage/circumstances, despite it isn't completely nonexistent, is really very very microscopic indeed, at least if the batteries are manufactured by "the big 4" (Samsung, LG, Sony, Panasonic/Sanyo). But pushing a battery harder means increasing the risk of the battery venting. Battery venting is not the same thing as thermal runaway, but can still nevertheless also be dangerous.

No that isn't true. A lithium cell can blow up in your face without any abuse from the user whatsoever.

Jay Whitacre, a professor of materials science and engineering at Carnegie Mellon University, told Wired in 2015: "There is no way to tell when buying, since the catastrophic failure likely will not manifest until the battery is fully charged and discharged several times."​

So for a manufacture to sell safer cells especially for vaping, they must do extra testing and temperature testing. Those cells design for vaping (Aspire is one brand) actually does this. Plus uses thicker and tougher wraps. Companies like Samsung, LG, Sony, Panasonic/Sanyo does not sell cells designed for vaping. So they don't bother.

 

[BillW50]

A few pages back, this was informative, then slightly entertaining. But just tuning back in and....what kind of contest is this?

And why does it smell like urine in here?

I'm exercising my right to change channels. This is too much like the internet.

Really? Jay Whitacre, a professor of materials science and engineering at Carnegie Mellon University smells like urine?

 

[dripster]

Whoa! Use your head man! If it vapes just like power mode and also prevents you from burnt hits... that is a HUGE PLUS! This is what most vapers hate and that science warns us about the dangers of vaping.

But there are some really dense people out there and they claim they like that nice burnt taste. Well then burnt hit protection wouldn't be for them then. So are you one of them?

If I can vape in power mode without burning anything, which, like I already explained multiple times up thread, I can, logically it follows that TC can't help me to prevent burning anything, as I already am preventing that perfectly myself. So then it's still just a waste of my time to dial in the TC settings. (Even, if it takes only a minute or so to dial it in.) But I guess they never taught you that in the army or at Philips, huh?

 

[BillW50]

If I can vape in power mode without burning anything, which, like I already explained multiple times up thread, I can,

Of course you can. And so can I. But there are times you will get distracted.

logically it follows that TC can't help me to prevent burning anything, as I already am preventing that perfectly myself. So then it's still just a waste of my time to dial in the TC settings. (Even, if it takes only a minute or so to dial it in.) But I guess they never taught you that in the army or at Philips, huh?

Of course they did. And people are all human (unless you're a divine spirit). As I've seen professional ballplayers who plays flawlessly 99% of the time. Then that 1% of time shows up and they make a silly foolish mistake. I've seen engineers do it, pilots, vapers, etc. Unlike you perhaps, but I trust in no human. As they will always make a mistake sooner or later.

 

[TrollDragon]

TC was never designed for large mass coils in the first place...

 

[dripster]

No that isn't true. A lithium cell can blow up in your face without any abuse from the user whatsoever.

Jay Whitacre, a professor of materials science and engineering at Carnegie Mellon University, told Wired in 2015: "There is no way to tell when buying, since the catastrophic failure likely will not manifest until the battery is fully charged and discharged several times."​

So for a manufacture to sell safer cells especially for vaping, they must do extra testing and temperature testing. Those cells design for vaping (Aspire is one brand) actually does this. Plus uses thicker and tougher wraps. Companies like Samsung, LG, Sony, Panasonic/Sanyo does not sell cells designed for vaping. So they don't bother.

I never said they can never blow up in your face without any abuse from the user whatsoever. Just that the chance of it happening is really very very tiny.

As for Aspire, their batteries are even more useless to me than TC is. They're just leaps and bounds behind the best performing batteries, like, for example, this:
Bench Test Results: Aspire Unrated 1800mAh 18650...now using a different battery, performs worse
My preferred 18650 battery right now is the Samsung 20S, and, I used to prefer the VTC5A and VTC5D before I made the switch. (The Samsung 24S could have been a better upgrade from the VTC5A for me than the VTC5D was, but the 24S has never been available to me, and it still isn't.)

 

[dripster]

Of course you can. And so can I. But there are times you will get distracted.

Nah. I never get distracted whilst vaping, as I always remember to put my mod down before I continue to read your posts.

Of course they did. And people are all human (unless you're a divine spirit). As I've seen professional ballplayers who plays flawlessly 99% of the time. Then that 1% of time shows up and they make a silly foolish mistake. I've seen engineers do it, pilots, vapers, etc. Unlike you perhaps, but I trust in no human. As they will always make a mistake sooner or later.

I'm not a divine spirit. I'm more into using all kinds of purely evil stuff that you'll never be capable to understand:

 

[BillW50]

I never said they can never blow up in your face without any abuse from the user whatsoever. Just that the chance of it happening is really very very tiny.

Tiny or not and if it is your face, it is a very big deal.

As for Aspire, their batteries are even more useless to me than TC is. They're just leaps and bounds behind the best performing batteries, like, for example, this:
Bench Test Results: Aspire Unrated 1800mAh 18650...now using a different battery, performs worse

Yes Mooch and I disagree on a few points. He rates cells higher than I do. And as far as Aspire being under performers. Stick a Samsung 20S in the same heat chamber for two months and you would be surprised how the performance goes downhill. But then it is virtually a sure bet that Samsung 20S won't blow up in your face after a few recharges.

 

[BillW50]

I'm more into using all kinds of purely evil stuff that you'll never be capable to understand:

And I am just the opposite. I am always siding on good. Good that you will never be capable to understand.

 

[KurtVD]

I've been vaping in TC mode for just an afternoon, but for now I'm completely sold. All I need now is better/different wire: 30ga is a pain to work with, especially in my RTA, and I would like to try SS316. Which thickness do you recommend?

 

[flavourchaser]

Which RTA are you using?
What issues are you getting?
I use SS316L 22ga from fasttech for TC on my RDA and RDTA.

 

[KurtVD]

Which RTA are you using?
What issues are you getting?
I use SS316L 22ga from fasttech for TC on my RDA and RDTA.

I have a Vandy Vape Berserker Mini RTA. It's a great RTA, but due to its size (22mm), the coil can't be too large, or it doesn't fit. My NI200 wire is 30ga, and that's too thin for the Berserker, I can't get more than 0.2 resistance or the coil gets too large, plus I don't like to work with such thin wire. I also have KA1 24ga, that seems like a good size, would that be ok for SS316 too?

 

[Brewdawg1181]

Really? Jay Whitacre, a professor of materials science and engineering at Carnegie Mellon University smells like urine?

Sorry - forgot to click "Unwatch Thread"

But what I meant was that this thread has become a ...... contest, hence the "what kind of contest is this", and mention of a urine smell.
To quote someone from the last page:

It isn't really hard to understand.

 

[Myk]

I've been vaping in TC mode for just an afternoon, but for now I'm completely sold. All I need now is better/different wire: 30ga is a pain to work with, especially in my RTA, and I would like to try SS316. Which thickness do you recommend?

I have a Vandy Vape Berserker Mini RTA. It's a great RTA, but due to its size (22mm), the coil can't be too large, or it doesn't fit. My NI200 wire is 30ga, and that's too thin for the Berserker, I can't get more than 0.2 resistance or the coil gets too large, plus I don't like to work with such thin wire. I also have KA1 24ga, that seems like a good size, would that be ok for SS316 too?

I like 26ga SS316L, about 3.25" will get you .5Ω which is the right range for good TC controls.

Actually getting .2Ω with NI200 is pretty good, and because you have 30ga. See where I said ~3" of 26ga would be .07Ω. That ~4" would take ~10" of 26ga.

 

[DPLongo22]

Just get a Prova...

Oh, wait. Wrong thread.

Wrong year too, nows that I thinks about it.




ps: This thread is FREAKING AWESOME!

 

[ShowerHead]

I have a Vandy Vape Berserker Mini RTA. It's a great RTA, but due to its size (22mm), the coil can't be too large, or it doesn't fit. My NI200 wire is 30ga, and that's too thin for the Berserker, I can't get more than 0.2 resistance or the coil gets too large, plus I don't like to work with such thin wire. I also have KA1 24ga, that seems like a good size, would that be ok for SS316 too?

You might find 24ga too thick for the tank. But, since you have it, give it a whirl. If you don't like the results, pick up some 27ga and perhaps some 26ga I've found 27ga is a nice balance between too thin to work with and to get reasonable resistance and to thick to get the coil I'm wanting.

 

[tailland]

My 2cents

I thought 2 theoretical aspects of TC to be attractive:
(1) constant coil temp = constant vapor quality and longer coil lifetime
(2) contant coil temp = power throttling = saving power over time

My experience so far is limited to the VTwo Mini (stock + arctic fox firmware), but my results so far:
Not really.

Nickel coils are not an option for me. I don't trust that material to be heated and inhaled.
The SS316 mode on the stock firmware worked reasonably well.
The SS316 mode on the arctic fox firmware didn't work consistently, changed its behaviour arbitrarily.
The TCR mode worked reasonably well on both, although getting the right values for your coils isn't as easy as it sounds before you actually try it (and it won't get any easier, if you wrap your own coils in a RDA/RTA).
And when it worked, the rather moderate temperature of the vapor encouraged me to take longer hits, rendering all potential power savings null and void.

Right now, I run ProC1 and C1-S coils in my Procore (@Espion), and both are Kanthal coils, so TC is no option anyways. Doesn't matter. I get along very well with running them at 35-45 Watts (recommended are 55-65) at an average puff time of 2.5-3.0 secs. Right now, I wouldn't change a thing.