TC beyond Ni200: Nickel Purity, Dicodes; Ti, SS, Resistherm NiFe30; Coefficient of Resistance

[cigatron]

You're not missing it, we don't have that added to any resources yet.

@balazsk has done the most recent work on it. Here is a graph he prepared showing SS 430 and 410, you can use this to create your dna 200 curve. You'll have to guess the exact position on the temperature axis, and convert this to resistance factors.

A simpler way to use for now: Just use a single TCR of 0.00138, which will be exactly accurate at 230°C / 450°F and more than good enough in the rest of the vaping range.

If you normally vape higher or lower than that, you could adjust the TCR down slightly according to where you think the line is on the graph. But tiny differences either way are not going to make a vast difference.



EDIT: reposting the graph image because apparently a quote doesn't show it inline





I do not know the source for the 410/430 data, @balazsk said that @vapealone posted a link to a datasheet that had SS 410 and SS 430, but I can't now find it searching the thread (doesn't come up searching for '410' or '430') The data sheets I have found for 410 and 430 did not have TCR/TFR information.

@vapealone do you think you could add 430 to the spreadsheet, now this wire is in active use?

I will keep searching the thread and google trying to find the source sheet but hopefully vapealone or balazsk can repost it soon.

I was thinking 430 would be the best ss match for my evic but now that I see the flatter and higher tcr of 410 it looks like a better candidate? Wouldn't have to worry so much about not being able to turn my evic down enough?

Sure hope the data is close.

 

[TheBloke]

I was thinking 430 would be the best ss match for my evic but now that I see the flatter and higher tcr of 410 it looks like a better candidate? Wouldn't have to worry so much about not being able to turn my evic down enough?

Sure hope the data is close.

Yes 410 is, on paper at least, better. The higher the TCR the better, assuming the same (or close enough) base resistance.

The issue is availability. We know of no vendors for spool-sized supplies of SS 410. We only know of one for 430, which is Unkamen who only have it in 28G at present.

So yeah if we find somewhere we can get 410 from, it may well be better. But until that time we're limited to 430 in 28G, and 304 in all gauges.

That is unless someone wants to order ~900 feet of it from somewhere like ResistanceWire.com Which isn't too expensive for those in the US, as the minimum order is only $50 + delivery. It's the delivery that makes it a vast cost for us non-USers, often costing more than the $50 wire charge itself.

All that said, I think SS 430 should have just high enough TCR to be usable on all Titanium mods, even those that don't underheat:

• 200°F = 93°C in Titanium mode equals 205°C / 401°F on a SS 430 coil at TCR 0.00138.
  • Therefore, at least in °F mode, you will have available on any accurate Titanium mode a full range of TC temperatures.
• In °C mode, starting at 100°C, the lowest coil temp available is 222°C.
  • Which still sounds fine to me, I vape at 230°C minimum.

All that assumes a perfectly accurate Titanium mod. On an underheating mod like the Joyetech, the range will be greater: 200°F might be, let's say, 180°C / 350°F instead of 200°C/400°F.

 

[TheBloke]

Then again, I have in my hand a 26G / 0.40mm coil of the fabled NiFe52 (actually it's Ni55/Fe ?) and it's just as non-springy as SS 304 - and therefore much better in that respect than SS 430 and Titanium - with a much higher TCR (0.004), and resistance nearly as high as Titanium.

Dry burnable, non-springy, highly accurate, TC vapeable on all mods.

The Holy Grail? The dream wire is here? Is there any downside? Yes of course there is.. with this particular wire anyway.

More on that later as I'm going out

 

[Dobo]

How could you go out knowing there's a NiFe52 to be played with?! (and all the thread-lurkers biting their nails in anticipation)

Then again, I have in my hand a 26G / 0.40mm coil of the fabled NiFe52 (actually it's Ni55/Fe ?) and it's just as non-springy as SS 304 - and therefore much better in that respect than SS 430 and Titanium - with a much higher TCR (0.004), and resistance nearly as high as Titanium.

Dry burnable, non-springy, highly accurate, TC vapeable on all mods.

The Holy Grail? The dream wire is here? Is there any downside? Yes of course there is.. with this particular wire anyway.

More on that later as I'm going out

 

[BigEgo]

The Holy Grail? The dream wire is here? Is there any downside? Yes of course there is.. with this particular wire anyway.

More on that later as I'm going out

I can tell you one downside -- it has nickel in it.

 

[jazzvaper]

I have calculated the TFR values for @Landman, I think he has tried it and the numbers are OK.

"Temperature (degF),"Electrical Resistivity"
32,0.968646865
68,1
80.6,1.008250825
170.6,1.077557756
260.6,1.145214521
440.6,1.285478548
620.6,1.432343234

If you would like to use this just save it in notepad as *.csv.

Thank you @balazsk for the data. We need, however, to get a housekeeping matter out of the way.

1. I copied and pasted the data into "Text Edit" the Macintosh version of Windows "Notepad". Alert to potential differences I made sure to save the format as "plain text". Nevertheless eScribe complained about the format (must be two columns, &etc.)

So, I went back to the MAC side of the house, so to speak. Opened the file, where, of course, it opened in Excel. Saved the file, without any changes, whereupon (back in Windows) the *.csv loaded without complaint. Though, I am not sure I prefer it to the "Special" file as a single data point: 0.00138 loaded yesterday. No biggie. I will check the comparison further when I have more time.

2. I now have both a Windows 8.1 and Windows 10 installed with VirtualBox. The needed fix for VBox is GOOD. EScribe appears to be more responsive in Windows 10.

 

[dsidab81]

You could also enter the points into Escribe directly...although hovering your mouse to the exact temp F can be tricky!
Bring up a custom temp curve, select Split, hover above the temp, right click and you can type the correction. Once all the points are entered, you can save as a CSV.

I've also uploaded a copy of the CSV I entered from balazsk's info to this link....
https://audiology.sharefile.com/d-s8de359585654ffab

 

[jazzvaper]

You could also enter the points into Escribe directly...although hovering your mouse to the exact temp F can be tricky!
Bring up a custom temp curve, select Split, hover above the temp, right click and you can type the correction. Once all the points are entered, you can save as a CSV.View attachment 491136

I've also uploaded a copy of the CSV I entered from balazsk's info to this link....
https://audiology.sharefile.com/d-s8de359585654ffab

Thanks @dsidab81 I knew that. [emoji6] I wanted to see how eScribe handled the rounding of the data.

Fairly straight-forward, to two digits as we learned in elementary school...

"Right click", you say [emoji15] it's a one button mouse. I am still working on the Windows-MAC mouse equivalents in VirtualBox/Windows. I finally got the Alt+F4. Be patient with me. Once upon a time I was not only platform agnostic but platform fluent. [emoji41]

 

[dsidab81]

Thanks @dsidab81 I knew that. [emoji6] I wanted to see how eScribe handled the rounding of the data.

Fairly straight-forward, to two digits as we learned in elementary school...

"Right click", you say [emoji15] it's a one button mouse. I am still working on the Windows-MAC mouse equivalents in VirtualBox/Windows. I finally got the Alt+F4. Be patient with me. Once upon a time I was not only platform agnostic but platform fluent. [emoji41]

Sorry I should have recalled your one mouse button limitation! If you were to need to make other csv's different wire types, you can always manually edit the csv I uploaded with Open Office, Google Sheets, and whatever office you may have.

 

[tchavei]

Thank you @balazsk for the data. We need, however, to get a housekeeping matter out of the way.

1. I copied and pasted the data into "Text Edit" the Macintosh version of Windows "Notepad". Alert to potential differences I made sure to save the format as "plain text". Nevertheless eScribe complained about the format (must be two columns, &etc.)

So, I went back to the MAC side of the house, so to speak. Opened the file, where, of course, it opened in Excel. Saved the file, without any changes, whereupon (back in Windows) the *.csv loaded without complaint. Though, I am not sure I prefer it to the "Special" file as a single data point: 0.00138 loaded yesterday. No biggie. I will check the comparison further when I have more time.

2. I now have both a Windows 8.1 and Windows 10 installed with VirtualBox. The needed fix for VBox is GOOD. EScribe appears to be more responsive in Windows 10.

This usually has to do with the encoding.

Unix / Linux / Mac uses Unix encoding while Windows uses DOS.

The most apparent difference is that the ending char (line end) is CRLF while in Unix it's only LF

If escribe is looking for CRLF do determine end of row, it won't work for Unix encoded files.

Regards
Tony

Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.

 

[jazzvaper]

^^^ Uh-huh, that's why I saved the file in MAC Excel. It is smart enough to be X-platform. [emoji6]

 

[jmarkus]

first coil in unkaman ss430 seems pretty great. ohms seem more stable than my ti experience. once coil attached, seems to hold shape (stiffer, albiet springy) better than ti. the tcr and curve provided seem to work almost the same as far as i can tell. dry cotton started yellowing around 460, dropped temp to 450 and its working really great. i did a low wattage 600f dry burn to clean wire after i cleaned with iso. dirty like the ti, grey streaks on the paper towel. lovin it, time will tell.

 

[f1vefour]

I put unkamen SS430 in the cart and forgot to check out....been waiting for days for it to arrive. That blows.

 

[Vapin Dave]

first coil in unkaman ss430 seems pretty great. ohms seem more stable than my ti experience. once coil attached, seems to hold shape (stiffer, albiet springy) better than ti. the tcr and curve provided seem to work almost the same as far as i can tell. dry cotton started yellowing around 460, dropped temp to 450 and its working really great. i did a low wattage 600f dry burn to clean wire after i cleaned with iso. dirty like the ti, grey streaks on the paper towel. lovin it, time will tell.

I have found the opposite, TI for me is more stable. Weird!

 

[jmarkus]

i usually get at least a .01 ohm shift down in refinement on ti. so far i havent seen the ss budge?! weird indeed.

 

[dsidab81]

i usually get at least a .01 ohm shift down in refinement on ti. so far i havent seen the ss budge?! weird indeed.

Dumb question are you referring to DNA 200 refinement.? When exactly does that take place? I cannot find anything in the spec sheet

 

[f1vefour]

I put unkamen SS430 in the cart and forgot to check out....been waiting for days for it to arrive. That blows.

Definitely got it ordered this time

 

[jmarkus]

Dumb question are you referring to DNA 200 refinement.? When exactly does that take place? I cannot find anything in the spec sheet

dna40 and 200. it always refines atty ohms as it sits if the ohms arent locked.

 

[f1vefour]

Does it help the springiness if you preheat the SS430?

 

[dsidab81]

dna40 and 200. it always refines atty ohms as it sits if the ohms arent locked.

Cool good to know. Not having a tc mod before this was a new term to me. For some reason I was thinking I had to get it into sleep or a soft reboot to do this.