The FDA and hardware (questions)

[DC2]

How are these Faceless people who Whisper in the Shadows?

And what Agenda do they Serve? And Power do they Wield to Achieve their Goals?

You could start with the World Health Organization.
I'm sure an investigation from that starting point would yield a lot more players in the game.

Or you could just look at the CDC and the FDA.
Or the Robert Woods Johnson Foundation.

There's a nagging little notion in my head, though, that all of what's happening is a collision of separate and semi-related conditions rather than some Machiavellian scheme drawn up in a dark back room in hushed tones.

How about it's both?

Take that and all the disparate and separate special-interest groups who fight the BAD stuff, add the government, and it's just a case of piling-on. Their specific interests may cross paths, but this does not specifically imply conspiracy or collusion - that's an inference drawn on our part, since we are, effectively, the group subject to the greatest impact and are sensitive to our rights of lifestyle and choice being threatened.

You're fairly new here.

It's not an inference, but a proven fact.
They are all colluding against us, from top to bottom.

The Big Pharma revolving door with the FDA, and vice versa.
The Government handouts to the ANTZ and other "non-profit" alphabet soup groups.
The Big Pharma handouts to the ANTZ and other "non-profit" alphabet soup groups.
The corruption of science by those that seek to influence the masses.
The MSA money being drained by this scourge of vaping, and how to stop the bleeding.
The fact that Big tobacco helped write the FSPTCA.
The mainstream media, for whatever freaking reason they are such a huge and willing part of this whole mess.

It's a conspiracy I tell's ya!!
No, it's just business as usual, since the dawn of man.

Even Grog, the Caveman King, gave the best caves to those that supported him.

 

[haleysdadda]

All mail is subject to inspection in our post-9/11 world, and if that box went through an x-ray machine and they saw contraband in it, they wouldn't need a warrant to open and inspect it. Probable cause laws allow them to circumvent a warrant in the event they believe a law is being broken.

Which (as I figured out after rereading orig post) is exactly what happened here! Although I don't agree with the taxation laws in Ar.! They are the law of the land & must be enforced! @curiousJan you were right! And I apologize if I said you were wrong! My fault for not reading completely what was written!

 

[zoiDman]

...

I have never said otherwise. I was conspiring how things might go if left
alone to juxtapose that against why the FDA can't let vaping survive in
it's present form.
Regards
Mike

So All that Stuff you Posted was Based on what you Know will not Happen?

OK.

 

[Yiana]

Not at all. We had a basement in the last house we rented before buying this one, and pretty much all the houses in that neighborhood did too. However we wanted no stairs to negotiate, so we bought a house built on a "slab" (concrete). Thus we have no worries about radon or mold (in that last rental house, mold ruined a huge amount of stuff we had stored in the basement!).

But lots of houses in the south have basements!

Andria

I must've been not looking hard enough. I never saw one in Atlanta but crawl spaces. I thought it was perhaps because of the clay. Here in Tennessee or at least middle Tennesse where I live I haven't seen any yet. I thought it was due to rock. I'm originally from the midwest where it is more unusual to have a house on a slab. We're looking to buy a house here this coming year and it would please me to no end if I found one with a basement

 

[Rossum]

I don't have a problem with it. But it makes it much harder to prepare for the future. Unless one has a freezer the size of a house.

Not really. One cubic foot equals 28 liters. My wife's chest freezer is 25 cubic feet. My little under-counter freezer is 2.1 cubic feet. Now of course, you're not gonna fit 28 actual liters of nic in round bottles in a 1 cubic foot foot of space, even but if you figure 2/3 wasted space (which is probably on the high side) due to packaging inefficiency, I figure can still fit 15+ liters in that little freezer.

 

[zoiDman]

You could start with the World Health Organization.
I'm sure an investigation from that starting point would yield a lot more players in the game.

Or you could just look at the CDC and the FDA.
Or the Robert Woods Johnson Foundation.

How about it's both?

...

Does Anyone really take the WHO seriously? They seem to have a Long History of being Marginal at Best.

Yeah... The CDC can Rant and Rave about how Bad e-Cigarettes are. And have. But they kinda had to Change their Tune when the UK Department of Health came out with findings that seemed to Counter much of what Dr. Frieden has been Preaching.

The FDA is the Wildcard.

 

[haleysdadda]

Not really. One cubic foot equals 28 liters. My wife's chest freezer is 25 cubic feet. My little under-counter freezer is 2.1 cubic feet. Now of course, you're not gonna fit 28 actual liters of nic in round bottles in a 1 cubic foot foot of space, even but if you figure 2/3 wasted space (which is probably on the high side) due to packaging inefficiency, I figure can still fit 15+ liters in that little freezer.

That settles it! when Vapocolypse hits half of us are going to your house the other half are going to @roxynoodle !LOL!

 

[zoiDman]

That settles it! when Vapocolypse hits half of us are going to your house the other half are going to @roxynoodle !LOL!

BYOF

(Bring Your Own Funnel)

 

[Yiana]

I live in an apartment right now, and we got a small freezer , I have one 100 mg liter broken down and 400 ml 100 mg liter broken down. I plan on getting more. I just wish I had a bigger freezer. I may store more in my in law's freezer when they get back in three months. I make stuff for her now so I want to be plenty stocked. And hell, even if the nic degrades years from now all I would need is a test kit to see what strength it is and adjust the caculator accordingly. Right?

 

[Rossum]

That settles it! when Vapocolypse hits half of us are going to your house the other half are going to @roxynoodle !LOL!

I told you I'm not sharing with anyone who had a chance to prepare and didn't.

 

[AndriaD]

What Nicotine Base do you have?

128mg/ml ?

100mg/ml. My usage is about 72ml of that per year.

Andria

 

[AndriaD]

I live in an apartment right now, and we got a small freezer , I have one 100 mg liter broken down and 400 ml 100 mg liter broken down. I plan on getting more. I just wish I had a bigger freezer. I may store more in my in law's freezer when they get back in three months. I make stuff for her now so I want to be plenty stocked. And hell, even if the nic degrades years from now all I would need is a test kit to see what strength it is and adjust the caculator accordingly. Right?

ecigexpress.com has those nic test kits for about $6.

Andria

 

[Rossum]

100mg/ml. My usage is about 72ml of that per year.

Your arithmetic is off. 5mg/ml * 5ml/day * 365 days/year = 9125 mg/year, or 91.25 ml of 100mg base.

 

[Douggro]

It's not an inference, but a proven fact.
They are all colluding against us, from top to bottom.

The Big Pharma revolving door with the FDA, and vice versa.
The Government handouts to the ANTZ and other "non-profit" alphabet soup groups.
The corruption of science by those that seek to influence the masses.
The MSA money being drained by this scourge of vaping, and how to stop the bleeding.
The fact that Big Tobacco helped write the FSPTCA.
The mainstream media, for whatever freaking reason they are such a huge and willing part of this whole mess.

It's a conspiracy I tell's ya!!
No, it's just business as usual, since the dawn of man.

"The best conspiracy is one that can never be proven to exist."
I do remember that line (paraphrased) from Conspiracy Theory. Still, the nagging thought still exists for me. I seriously doubt that even a portion of the groups involved have formed some sort of secret cabal to conspire and collude against us. They all are fighting to protect their specific portion of the fiefdom, pursuing their own agendas.

Our brains are wired to take pieces of information and put them into some sensible order. We try to fit new things into that which we already know. As such, I can see where it's an easy jump to conclude that there has to be some type of collusion going on. Lacking the hard evidence to prove it, however, leaves me to believe that this is just a coincidental alignment of disparate agendas at the same time to produce the Perfect Storm against vaping.

 

[AndriaD]

Your arithmetic is off. 5mg/ml * 5ml/day * 365 days/year = 9125 mg/year, or 91.25 ml of 100mg base.

I just figured it again, and actually it's 90ml (150ml of juice per month, 7.5ml of 100mg nic)-- what had thrown it off was that I still had the WTA figured in -- I zeroed it out for the calculation, and yeah it's about 90ml per year.

So a liter would last slightly more than 11 yrs. Might actually be about 11.5; I don't actually vape a full 5ml everyday; it's usually about 4.5ml. (135ml per month instead of the 150 I used for the calculation)

Andria

 

[DC2]

"The best conspiracy is one that can never be proven to exist."
I do remember that line (paraphrased) from Conspiracy Theory. Still, the nagging thought still exists for me. I seriously doubt that even a portion of the groups involved have formed some sort of secret cabal to conspire and collude against us. They all are fighting to protect their specific portion of the fiefdom, pursuing their own agendas.

Our brains are wired to take pieces of information and put them into some sensible order. We try to fit new things into that which we already know. As such, I can see where it's an easy jump to conclude that there has to be some type of collusion going on. Lacking the hard evidence to prove it, however, leaves me to believe that this is just a coincidental alignment of disparate agendas at the same time to produce the Perfect Storm against vaping.

I still say it's both.

But I also say that if they are not meeting, talking, or at least trading notes...
Then they are far more stupid than I suspected they are...

And I never suspected for one second that they were even slightly stupid...
No matter how much Andria likes to claim that they are.


The fact is, all of the items I posted are evidence that collusion is taking place.

It's taking place between (A) and (B) and between (C) and (D) and between (D) and (A) and between...
Well, you get the picture.

The only question seems to be are (A) and (B) and (C) and (D) and (E) all getting the same "room" at the same time.
I think that's a moot point, but I still tend to believe that they are rather than that they are not.

 

[crxess]

A friend of mine that lives in Ar had his $160 worth of mail order juice confiscated at the PO last week, even in the rush & bulk of Christmas mail... in an unmarked / no vape shop reference or labeling on the box anywhere.
With a note saying your package was confiscated due to violation of SB 978

Well, I hate that your Friend got popped, but it is(or should be) a known risk to attempt to circumvent prevailing Law.

Yes, some seem to be wearing Blinders. The Future is indeed Bleak and we will be tested at minimum, Punished at worse. I assume worse.

*Perhaps it was the lovely aroma from the package that drew interest in its contents*
sorry

Oops, meant to include:
http://www.atc.ar.gov/Documents/LCM.pdf
The notification should have stated - ACT 1235, not SB 978 as that was the Bill Before passing.

 

[Tommy-Chi]

Decided
As of any Deeming Date
My Gear is all being Reclassified as Aroma Theropy Devices and Liquids.
I love the Smell of Cappuccino in the Morning, refreshing Caramel/Cream during a long day and oh, the scent of Butterscotch in the evening.

Seriously, I will be picking up at least 2 Liters more 100mg Nic if/when MFS does another discount. Christmas interfered this month.
I already have enough to last my lifetime, but I have family and friends I will gladly assist in avoiding the Debacle ahead.

Great news ALL! I've just spoken to friend of mine and he is going to see if he or one of his subcontractors can employ me in the new year. He said it's a done deal...fingers crossed!

CHA-CHING! I'm going to spend as much as I can on vape gear...and that comes to around $1,000/month. I wonder how much nicotine and gear I can buy with that! The mind boggles...

 

[Yiana]

"Just cuz you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you." Words I live by. Just comes naturally to me.

 

[AndriaD]

I still say it's both.

But I also say that if they are not meeting, talking, or at least trading notes...
Then they are far more stupid than I suspected they are...

And I never suspected for one second that they were even slightly stupid...
No matter how much Andria likes to claim that they are.


The fact is, all of the items I posted are evidence that collusion is taking place.

It's taking place between (A) and (B) and between (C) and (D) and between (D) and (A) and between...
Well, you get the picture.

The only question seems to be are (A) and (B) and (C) and (D) and (E) all getting the same "room" at the same time.
I think that's a moot point, but I still tend to believe that they are rather than that they are not.

I've never said they aren't cunning -- but they're stupid enough to think they can get this cat back in the bag, when this particular cat has already escaped and is now snarling angrily at them, ready to scratch their eyes out if they try to get it back in that bag.

Cunning is scheming frantically to try and get control of a situation that they were too stupid to see coming.

Andria