The lady who caught on fire

[kiwivap]

Anyone learning anything from all this!?!

Not really. I already knew not to charge batteries unattended. I don't use a car charger because I don't want to have to deal with a problem while driving - same reason I don't vape a passthrough in the car.
But... since people have also had batteries explode at home, what are we supposed to learn? Don't vape anywhere?
This is one incident. We don't even have all the info or know what the actual cause was. Was it avoidable -that's a moot point.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

When you plug your charger into the USB port on a computer, the output to the charger is no more than 5 volts.

Most wall charging adapters also output no more than 5 volts to the charging circuitry (read the unit's label to be sure).

A car cigarette lighter may or may not deliver 5 volts and is more likely than not to deliver a higher voltage. That's gonna fry the circuitry in the charger, probably shorting it, and delivering all the power that battery wants to go into critical mass.

 

[tj99959]

Not really. I already knew not to charge batteries unattended. I don't use a car charger because I don't want to have to deal with a problem while driving - same reason I don't vape a passthrough in the car.
But... since people have also had batteries explode at home, what are we supposed to learn? Don't vape anywhere?
This is one incident. We don't even have all the info or know what the actual cause was. Was it avoidable -that's a moot point.

That's a no brainer, the battery went into thermal runaway. So now we need to do the R&D to find ways to prevent it. Like maybe demanding that manufacturers start using better quality/type of cells in their products, better protection ckts, etc,etc. We the consumer are the ones that can drive unsafe products from the market place by refusing to use them. We are the ones that need to demand safe products, not the nay-sayers.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

Unattended electronic cigarette charger explodes, car catches fi - CBS 5 - KPHO

From the link:

What's missing from this picture?

See hint at the bottom and turn this page upside down.











ʇno llnd noʎ 'uəəɹƃ oʇ uɹnʇ ʇɥƃıl pəɹ uəɥʍ

 

[kiwivap]

That's a no brainer, the battery went into thermal runaway. So now we need to do the R&D to find ways to prevent it. Like maybe demanding that manufacturers start using better quality/type of cells in their products, better protection ckts, etc,etc. We the consumer are the ones that can drive unsafe products from the market place by refusing to use them. We are the ones that need to demand safe products, not the nay-sayers.

Yeah - but what I was saying is we don't know why. There's a reason for thermal runaway - and we don't know if it was the charger or there was a fault in the battery itself - or both. I think it was obvious what I meant. Since we don't even know what charger and pv were involved what exactly are we demanding - better products from who? Do you see my point here? I agree with wanting to be safe, but who should we be communicating this to, and about what products? If we just say "we want safe pvs" we will get a response back saying "our pvs are safe". If we know a particular line is faulty then we can get something done - as has happened with the original Smoktech telescope, and with the Groove.

 

[kiwivap]

From the link:


What's missing from this picture?

See hint at the bottom and turn this page upside down.

There are two different things being discussed here. That picture is not the incident the OP was referring to.

 

[e23slack]

Don't start that bit of misinformation. That lady was burned so badly she had to have numerous skin grafts.

Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[kiwivap]

When you plug your charger into the USB port on a computer, the output to the charger is no more than 5 volts.

Most wall charging adapters also output no more than 5 volts to the charging circuitry (read the unit's label to be sure).

That's going to depend on which country you are in.

A car cigarette lighter may or may not deliver 5 volts and is more likely than not to deliver a higher voltage. That's gonna fry the circuitry in the charger, probably shorting it, and delivering all the power that battery wants to go into critical mass.

It shouldn't do. It should simply pass through a certain amount to charge the battery - same as if plugged into a wall socket. 12 volts is the common standard in cars, but some also have 5 volt outlets in them.
Question - which kind was the lady charging her ecig on?

 

[tj99959]

Don't start that bit of misinformation. That lady was burned so badly she had to have numerous skin grafts.

Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Now we're talking about 3 incidences

 

[tj99959]

Now we're talking about 3 incidences

One being 20 years ago


Oops, did that wrong

 

[kiwivap]

Now we're talking about 3 incidences

So don't drink hot coffee in the car while vaping. Got it.

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

There are two different things being discussed here. That picture is not the incident the OP was referring to.

I understand. There are two different incidents. In the one I grabbed the photo from, the battery almost certainly would have gone thermal whether it was attended or not, because there's no indicator on the charger to tell the user that it's time to disconnect. That is nothing but user error.

That's going to depend on which country you are in.



It shouldn't do. It should simply pass through a certain amount to charge the battery - same as if plugged into a wall socket. 12 volts is the common standard in cars, but some also have 5 volt outlets in them.
Question - which kind was the lady charging her ecig on?

I disagree that the voltage required by the circuitry is country dependent. Almost all of these battery and charger systems come from a few manufacturers, all of whom are using similar or identical circuit boards, and all of whom are required to label their devices to indicate input and output. For the eGo systems that are so common (that's what both of these appear to be), the input to the charger is specified at 5 volts and the output to the battery is specified at 4.2 volts. These are on the labels of the chargers that are sold with eGo systems. I can't speak to the voltages for other systems, as I am 100% eGo right now. See below:

Charger Label:

Wall Adapter Label:

I think the issues are similar in both incidents, both of which might have been avoided if there was better labeling and warnings printed on the packaging or provided in user manuals. Every electrical or electronic device I have purchased in the last 4,567 years has about five pages in the front of the manual with warnings about improper use and the consequences.

We would both probably agree that these things should have manuals with warnings included. Everything else does.

Where we might disagree is whether, absent said manual, the two consumers should have made at least a college try at self-education. I think they should have. You may differ, and that's Ok.

 

[kiwivap]

I disagree that the voltage required by the circuitry is country dependent.

That is not at all what I was saying. You have what I meant completely wrong. The voltage output from the outlet will differ from country to country. Look it up. Your pictures are nice, but you are actually not addressing what I was saying. You don't know that these were "ego chargers" - you're guessing here. The voltage through the actual outlet they are plugged into can differ in different countries.
The car won't necessarily "fry" the charger. Car outlets are designed for plugging stuff in, and charging. They are commonly 12 volts and newer cars also have extra 5 volt outlets.
Question, again - which kind did the lady plug her ecig into?

 

[Coastal Cowboy]

That is not at all what I was saying. You have what I meant completely wrong. The voltage output from the outlet will differ from country to country. Look it up. Your pictures are nice, but you are actually not addressing what I was saying. You don't know that these were "ego chargers" - you're guessing here. The voltage through the actual outlet they are plugged into can differ in different countries.

No, I don't know for sure whether they're eGo or not. However, given their ubiquitousness and the appearance of the devices, it's a safe assumption to make. They look like eGo's. At any rate, both of these incidents happened in the United States, so the country to country variation does not apply. Those devices were supposed to be as shown in the labels I posted.

The car won't necessarily "fry" the charger. Car outlets are designed for plugging stuff in, and charging. They are commonly 12 volts and newer cars also have extra 5 volt outlets.
Question, again - which kind did the lady plug her ecig into?

Oh, yes they can fry the charger. The adapter (wall or car) has circuitry inside that is designed to limit the output voltage. For eGo charging systems, the adapter has circuitry to limit output to 5 volts and the charger itself has circuitry that limits output to 4.2, given the specified input of 5v. That is what I was trying to show in the pictures.

If the adapter is plugged into something that exceeds the voltage of the specified input (120 - 240v AC for wall, 12-24v DC for car), there is a high likelihood that the circuitry limiting the output will be damaged. In a lot of cars, especially those with alternators that aren't working properly, you can get a LOT more than what's specified. That's how car batteries themselves can be fried and how electronics in the cabin can melt down.

If the adapter is then delivering something greater than 5v, then the circuitry in the charger can be damaged, meaning that potentially much more than the 4.2v are delivered to the battery. Thermal meltdown is the result. I don't know that this is what happened, but I'm betting that it is.

We don't know what these two ladies plugged their chargers into, but exploding batteries mean that somewhere between the cars' outlets and the batteries, at least one circuit got fried and too much current was delivered.

And, BOOM went the battery.

 

[kiwivap]

No, I don't know for sure whether they're eGo or not. However, given their ubiquitousness and the appearance of the devices, it's a safe assumption to make. They look like eGo's. At any rate, both of these incidents happened in the United States, so the country to country variation does not apply. Those devices were supposed to be as shown in the labels I posted.

That wasn't the original point about the countries though. The original point was the output from outlets can differ in countries but the chargers don't all fry. Yours is not a safe assumption to make. A lady was injured from an exploding ecig - if you don't have the facts don't make them up. Making them up is not helping anyone. You've done a nice job of explaining how an ecig might go wrong, but it is not a safe assumption to make that two separate incidents were the same because you want them to be.

Oh, yes they can fry the charger.

Lets look at what I said - The car won't necessarily "fry" the charger. And that's correct - it won't necessarily. If it were a given there would not be any car chargers - we'd all know any time you charged something it would get fried. So no - it isn't necessarily the case, as in no, it doesnt always happen and no, it isn't the expected outcome.

The adapter (wall or car) has circuitry inside that is designed to limit the output voltage.

Agreed. You aren't telling me anything I don't know here.
I've snipped the stuff speculating about what might have happened.

We don't know what these two ladies plugged their chargers into, but exploding batteries mean that somewhere between the cars' outlets and the batteries, at least one circuit got fried and too much current was delivered.

As I've been saying - we don't know. And no, we can't say it was definitely too much current through the charger - that is pure speculation. You cannot even say both were caused by the same thing. You don't know if the battery was faulty. Batteries have been known to explode when receiving the proper charge. It may have had a hard short for all we know. You are making up a reason here. And you keep ignoring this question:
Car outlets are designed for plugging stuff in, and charging. They are commonly 12 volts and newer cars also have extra 5 volt outlets.
Question, again - which kind did the lady plug her ecig into?

 

[mcol]

Media has a tendency to not find out or to leave out the actual facts, and just run with speculation.

 

[Heavyrocker]

The car was a Dodge ''Charger''.....making no wonder it blew up.

 

[Myk]

I'm sorry but I'm going to blame the one who left the battery charging in a car in AZ. She needs to be sentenced to have "STUPID" tattooed across her forehead. Nothing more needs to be said about her.

The other one's comment of, "This thing just exploded when Jennifer was using it in the manner it was intended to be used" is obviously lawyer talk as is her claims of PTSD. She's fishing for money.

Yes it is the manner it was supposed to be used, or maybe it wasn't. Did the manufacturer supply the car adapter or did she pick that up herself either on her own or from the vendor? I don't know of any ecig kits that come with car charging adapters. The actual faulty part could be the battery circuit, the car adapter or the car USB port if that's what it was. But the real fault is the end user for not knowing batteries can go up in flames at any time.

I charge my eGo-C batteries in the manner they are intended to be used, but being a smart person I have them in a cast iron pot so if they do catch fire the flames will go up instead of setting something else on fire, and I hang around so I can hopefully hear them go and shut the power off.
Just because someone makes something or sells something doesn't remove the responsibility to be smart about using that something from the end user.

 

[kiwivap]

Yes it is the manner it was supposed to be used, or maybe it wasn't. Did the manufacturer supply the car adapter or did she pick that up herself either on her own or from the vendor? I don't know of any ecig kits that come with car charging adapters.

Some of my pv kits came with car chargers. I still have them somewhere. We don't know that it was an ego. But yes - there are ecig kits or lines that include car chargers. Commonly sold. Lots of people will have these Myk. For example Greensmoke sell car chargers for their ecigs- and a lot of people use Greensmoke.
BTW - the photo of the one from Arizona - I have a charger looks similar to that too. There isn't meant to be light on mine - the light on the end of the ecig goes out when its fully charged. In the photo in the news article it can't be seen if the ecig had that as its an after photo - and the end of the ecig is missing. So I wouldn't say user error when part of the ecig isn't visible to be able to see.

 

[Heavyrocker]

We may have copycats now charging batts unsafely and trying too make a buck.