The Pyrex SS hybrid Wick

[cyclotron]

This will heat the juice inside the tank.

The above post indicated the filament would be 8.5mm which would remain in the top part of the tube. I don't think there would be any more heating of juice inside the tank than pretty much any other method discussed or even the current method with coil on SS.
That's my opinion of course.

 

[Cloud Wizard]

The above post indicated the filament would be 8.5mm which would remain in the top part of the tube. I don't think there would be any more heating of juice inside the tank than pretty much any other method discussed or even the current method with coil on SS.
That's my opinion of course.

agreed, just added another scratch drawing with tank fitment.

 

[Damian Duncan]

Yeah added drawing shows your concept better.

 

[JPoodles]

Initially, I was scared of the quartz shattering. It turns out that fused quartz is used in microwave heating elements and can handle much wear and tear. But that doesn't solve the exposed coil concern. Airflow can still diminish the heat build and condensation can collect and burn.
I wanted to see if ceramic was, in fact, not feesable as some have said. It seems that, in smaller applications, ceramics ability to absorb heat and transfer it evenly may help our cause. I think these micro tube and micro rod heating elements could be viable. I found them whilst researching thermal conductivity of ceramics. The heating coil is embedded in the ceramic and uses the ceramics heat absorbing quality to creat a less intensified point of heat. A ss wick could be wrapped around the rod or the tube could be used like a cap on a solid wick. The best case scenario would be a band(not a current product). It would leave wick open at bottom and top of it for vapor production and act similarly to our current coil setup. This would have to be developed but they seem willing to do so (only for mass production ?) Just a thought

http://www.rauschert.de/cms/front_content.php?idart=85&client=1&changelang=2&lang=2

 

[Bocephus]

Think some of you are overthinking this a bit to much. Anything you coat on the coil is going to get hot enough to at the very least make weak steam from condensation dripping onto it. no different than a steam room with the hot rocks. Most rebuildables I have seen have the center hole positive with a screw or nut so I see no reason why you could not make a small steel or aluminum disk that slides,screws or sits on that center post some how with a open hole where the very end of the glass/wick pokes out for the vapor that would pretty much stop the condensation drops from hitting it.

As long as it is not touching the cap or coil in any way I do not see a problem. Would would in effect be making a third chamber of sorts and allow condensation to flow around down to the bottom of the cap. Just a thought.

 

[JPoodles]

I started that post awhile back and it looks like there is another line of thought processing now. No disrespect CloudWizard-looks good!

 

[Cloud Wizard]

I'm liking the idea of an internal heater so that vapor comes off the entire outside of the wick, even if being generated at the heat transfer along the inside surface area. If it works it would solve all the original requirements (no need to oxidize SS, eliminate hot spots/burning, clean, etc) without the current air flow (or coil cooling) limitations from encapsulating the wick in a coil wrapped sleeve. Another plus is that there'd be no need to modify the current gennie design (except maybe needing a bigger wick hole on some (the DID already has a 3.5mm hole).

That having been said, I certainly get the feeling there is more to Dan's idea if there were a complete redesign around the concept.

 

[Nurzrachit]

If a coil was embedded within the fused quartz it could have a mesh encapsulation. My bet is in a year smoktech will be mass producing and selling like vivi nova heads.

 

[Dearth Vapir]

Caught up and subbed! Cool thread indeed.

Still having trouble with coils shorting to SS mesh wicks after several weeks and many attempts, so the basic tube idea would be a huge boon for me.

Anyone got a UK source for fused quartz tube in 3mm OD yet?

Checked all the links provided and came up with several myself (incl. the folks that do the interesting ceramic stuff as well for thermocouples etc.), but the min. order quantities etc. put it all way outside my price range - ugh...

Got my second CHID/CHENESIS yesterday, and as usual it was useless out of the box with a very tiny bit of coarse SS mesh as very hollow tube/wrapped loosely, and with very loose coils indeed - wrapped a 500 mesh SS wick and this time tried a double layer overwrap of coarser grade mesh for it's apparent greater ease of oxidisation, wrapped a 29g coil around that - still got issues with it though - UGH!

Any help in getting a bit of the FQ tube here in the UK wold be greatly appreciated.

Be well folks,

DV

 

[Damian Duncan]

The chinese make a heating element that can do this job I have sourced them on alibaba for pellet heaters.

Maybe contacting one of those suppliers and giving required ohms and size could see some easily made 10mm heating rods.
Worth looking into, would then just be a matter of changing like once a year.

Here is a ebay link to the one used in a pellet heater for reference
eBay Australia: Buy new & used fashion, electronics & home d

 

[Big Screen D]

Anyone try it from the inside out yet? General idea would be to use a fully isolated coil inside a hollow wick. That way the air blowing on the wick would not cool the coil and alleviate the "volcano" effect.

View attachment 153940

View attachment 153951

P.S. sorry for the kindergarten art. Lost my stylus so had to fat finger on the iPad. Yellow blobs would be some kind of plug (anyone know what type silicon could be used in the ends?)

I'm going to just use JB Weld for the prototype. Silicone would surely burn for the top plug. May have to leave a pin hole up top if air expansion is enough to crack the glass, but we'll see. The negative leg can just come up through either the fill hole, or another drilled hole in the atty base.

Last evening, I wrapped just two layers around a 14ga needle I had laying around which is roughly the diameter of capillary tubes. 500 wicked VG impressively well even with the wick only 1/4" into juice at the bottom. May need another layer or two once we can try this out, but my thinking is it is best to find the least number of layers needed to provide adequate wicking in order to minimize the heat sink effect.

Interestingly, there was no volcano effect noted from the tube at all even with the wick aflame. So it may turn out to be unnecessary to plug the tube at all.

BTW. 325 would not wick at all. Didn't try 400 once pleased with the 500.

 

[mre777]

That would seem to minimize the thermal resistance and lag. Perhaps even aluminum foil could be used assuming it doesn't mess with the wicking of the mesh. (BJ..?) We routinely use plain wicks over the mesh. Not coating the coil would allow for reuse...not boding it to the wick and coating...insert another treated wick into the coil. It may not dry burn as well inside a 'paint tube,' but maybe it would be okay with a prolonged burn. Let the poop-sheet fellows weigh in on the toxicity and/or vapor from the coating.

Lowes has about the same product by Rustoleam - Quart -


Shop Rust-Oleum Quart Interior/Exterior Flat Black High Heat Paint at Lowes.com

I did look at some of the msds sheet for a few of these and they mostly seem to only cover the paints in there wet state, however Krylon has a high temp paint and their web page says all their paint is non toxic once dried. So a few coats and a good long set time then maybe a few hits from the heat gun and this may work. Foil is a good option as the buffer too. All of the assembly could be done on a rod or drill bit then removed and used in the same manner as the FQ would be.

 

[dsy5]

I'm going to just use JB Weld for the prototype. Silicone would surely burn for the top plug. May have to leave a pin hole up top if air expansion is enough to crack the glass, but we'll see. The negative leg can just come up through either the fill hole, or another drilled hole in the atty base.

I'm not sure what temperature is required to get the Pyrex to become workable, whether the no resistance wire would be able to withstand that heat, but the bottom could maybe be pinched closed like an incandescent bulb is.

 

[perlionsmitnick]

FWIW, I forget who it was, but some guy tried the coil encapsulated in ceramic years ago in the beginning of vaping and it didn't work out as hoped. Now if a coil was in quartz, like a light bulb, sealed at each end with ceramic in a vacuum it may be worth a try.

 

[Cool_Breeze]

I did look at some of the msds sheet for a few of these and they mostly seem to only cover the paints in there wet state, however Krylon has a high temp paint and their web page says all their paint is non toxic once dried. So a few coats and a good long set time then maybe a few hits from the heat gun and this may work. Foil is a good option as the buffer too. All of the assembly could be done on a rod or drill bit then removed and used in the same manner as the FQ would be.

Yes, saw about the Krylon (spray) paint. Good idea to do around a drill bit 1st. Might be a little delicate, but perhaps doable. Hmmm...smallest brass tubing I have here is about 5/32"/4mm. Did I recently notice that Lowes now has brass hobby tubing..?

 

[dsy5]

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, as the purpose of this discussion is to raise ideas on improvement. That said, before getting into all kinds of theories on insulation with various toxic or non-toxic materials, maybe we should see if the thinner walled tubing will really require said modifications. Even Dan had noted it neither improved nor degraded the performance. The need for the tubing to do testing with is critical. Dan had mentioned something about having some thin walled stuff - I wonder if he has tried any yet? Dan, oh Dan?

I like the coil-inside-a-tube concept if the coil can be made to press tightly against the inside of the tube. If not, I'm afraid the heat transfer may be less than desirable. Perhaps ribbon wire wrapped on a slighty larger form prior to insertion?

Don't get me wrong guys, I'm not criticizing anybody's ideas, I just think we need to slow down a bit and wait to see what we're really up against.

 

[dsy5]

Yes, saw about the Krylon (spray) paint. Good idea to do around a drill bit 1st. Might be a little delicate, but perhaps doable. Hmmm...smallest brass tubing I have here is about 5/32"/4mm. Did I recently notice that Lowes now has brass hobby tubing..?

Ace Hardware.

 

[mre777]

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, as the purpose of this discussion is to raise ideas on improvement. That said, before getting into all kinds of theories on insulation with various toxic or non-toxic materials, maybe we should see if the thinner walled tubing will really require said modifications. Even Dan had noted it neither improved nor degraded the performance. The need for the tubing to do testing with is critical. Dan had mentioned something about having some thin walled stuff - I wonder if he has tried any yet? Dan, oh Dan?

I like the coil-inside-a-tube concept if the coil can be made to press tightly against the inside of the tube. If not, I'm afraid the heat transfer may be less than desirable. Perhaps ribbon wire wrapped on a slighty larger form prior to insertion?

Don't get me wrong guys, I'm not criticizing anybody's ideas, I just think we need to slow down a bit and wait to see what we're really up against.

But.. but.. I'm sooooo bored waiting for my tubing I don't think i even got a shipped notification, just an order notification. I want it now! This holiday weekend was probably the worst time to start doing this lol. I've got lota ideas to try once it gets here thanks to the people contributing to this thread. Once people start getting their tubes this thing is gona blow up.. Dont forget to take pictures and document your findings there will be a test at the end of the year

 

[JPoodles]

For the encapsulated idea- would it be better to create something smaller, say 3-5 mm long. The reduced space could heat up faster. The leads could come from one end like the pellet heaters and the wick could be made to house it at the top then be solid down into tank. There are many food grade high temp silicones for sealing and this step by step has some good ideas.
Corrosion Resistant Micro-Bath Heater

 

[Cloud Wizard]

I have 2.5mm Pyrex coming. With a 3.5mm wick hole I should be able to get at least 3-4 wraps of #500. I'm also wondering if since I use 0.999% silver NR wire maybe I can just plug top and bottom with a small drop of melted silver. Would rather it be a vacuum in the tube but don't have that kind of equipment (although could probably rig a 1 gallon pickle jug with a shop vac if not soldering the bottom plug).

Also, thinking about drilling a 2.5mm indent in the DID base that would allow the glass tube to be inserted to make a pressure contact with the NR wire at the bottom.

I'm still thinking about ease of use and sounds simple to just have one wire connection at the top and one at the bottom. As long as the NR wire never makes contact with SS mesh there'd be no shorts