And yah has to know, yes yah does, that "The Vaperman" yeah he has to stay in business too,, yeah the Vaperman he gots to make a living, the one you know, the one, The Vaperman, the guy who sells us all our supply. I dont think the Vaperman wants to go to war tho, I think hed rather be alive..................
Are we going to win this war?
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Well, I have to say I am cautiously pessimistic...
Reading the bolded part in your post, I was reminding myself of swedish snus. It has been used long enough to be proven maybe as safe as the e-cig... it is legitimised in Sweden... and yet, despite the obvious health benefits, despite the fact that Sweden has the lowest tobacco-related ilnesst rate in Europe, that did not stop the nay-sayers from banning it in the first place, not even from keeping that ban in the last 08th October...
"they can read the writing on the wall and they care about what the electorate wants". It's true, if we do actually care to write in that wall! One thing that is bugging me, for example, is the European Free Vaping Iniciative: Apart from Germany (Congratulations !!), one outsider could not tell that vaping is really as widespread as we want 'them' to believe...
Take the example of Portugal, for instance: The forum where I posted the link to EFVI, more that two weeks ago, has 2100+ members. Currently, there are less than seventy signatures from Portugal... Spain seems to be on the same track...
That's what really grinds my gears... most of us will shout and whine about having our 'rights' about to be taken away, but they cannot even be bothered to give ONE signature on behalf of themselves! If they can't be bothered even to do THAT, how on Earth can they be bothered to spread the message, so that OTHERS can help too...??
(OK, sorry... rant over...
)
I agree and it is intimidating to new Vapers such as myself. Can also assure you from where I am standing we are a Minority. Every day I stand in front of the SFO Airport in what I affectionately call my Toking Lounge (Smoking Area). As an example, last week I purposely looked for Vapers and saw 4 in comparison to the 100's upon 100's of Analog users. This week so far I have seen 2 Vapers.
I am preparing myself with supplies to last a Year if not slightly longer (My plan is to get to 0 MG Nicotine Level).
The hypocrisy of the situation is frightening also. We want you to quit Smoking but we really don't because we have become too accustomed to your Sin Taxes. So lets add in the " Chillun " as Senile Old Don writes and make sure we punish you further.
If my plan succeeds I will be waving a large single digit to this hypocrisy.
It would be extremely unfortunate if other Analog users could not make a similar Easy Transition such as myself to get off of the Analogs.
I am gonna make it simple... I am not positive we are going to win... I don't think we are going to necessarily lose either. My opinions may all change in 2016 though... Just went and filed my taxes yesterday... at the end of my filing, something came up... when it did I was literally speechless for approximately 5 minutes. I could not believe it... 2014 no health insurance, 290 i believe owed... 2015 i cant remember but it was approx 500-1000 range... 2016 it was approximately 3000 not sure if that was just for me, if it was based on various income levels but thats just insane...
things like this can happen... doesnt leave much faith for other venues
edit clarification: when i am mentioning the amounts for various years this is what the will be owed when people do not have health insurance under obama care
things like this can happen... doesnt leave much faith for other venues
edit clarification: when i am mentioning the amounts for various years this is what the will be owed when people do not have health insurance under obama care
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I'm not sure why more people don't realize this. The B&M's will profit from this more than anyone. Why do you think so many are popping up despite "the looming FDA regulations?" They're already "taxing" the hell out of everyone with their $1 per ml juice and their $10 CE4's. The "war" is to keep Internet sales alive. The government is going to tax liquid. There's no way around that. They'll tax pre filled cartridges. They won't be able to ban APV's and toppers.
B&M's are not your friend. They're not on "our side." Banning internet sales is going to make them rich.
That's not the only legislation out there.
Our nearby cities are banning B&M's, banning indoor sampling, banning use where smoking is not allowed. THOSE things hurt the B&M's, as would banning of flavors. The prices I've seen at my local B&M aren't that bad for anything but really tiny parts, I'd LIKE to be able to go look at things, play with them, learn.
And the indoor/outdoor vaping bans will cut down on the market size, which hurts any vendor, not to mention how it affects smokers.
where do you live that you're getting tax returns for 2016 already?
so im not getting tax returns for 2016, its more of a warning this is what the charges will be... i apologize i was not clear and will edit...
under obama care if you dont have health insurance you are subject to fines, your tax return being one of the things that gets fined... those are the projected fines, i guess...
There will be at least a lull to the attacks once heavy taxation is in place to replace the lost tobacco revenues.
The future of e-smoking nicotine is advertising-restricted, locally purchased, federal, state, and locally taxed, tobacco flavored, disposable e-cigarettes and pre-filled/non-refillable cartomizers deemed substantially equivalent by the FDA, containing no more than about 40 mg of nicotine per unit, used wherever smoking is permitted, by a consumer who is paying fifty percent more for health insurance and disqualified for some employment as a result of nicotine use.
Vaping without nicotine may continue to be a hobby by cloud-blowers, flavor aficionados, vapers who've weaned themselves off nicotine, and those who use vaping as an adjunct to nicotine gum or patches.
Vaping without nicotine may continue to be a hobby by cloud-blowers, flavor aficionados, vapers who've weaned themselves off nicotine, and those who use vaping as an adjunct to nicotine gum or patches.
It turns out there IS a test for whether or not you are actually smoking. It's a carbon monoxide test. That has to be a battle too. Oddly, BP would probably side with us on that one now that the FDA has approved NRT for long-term use.
Tobacco premiums, which were limited to 20% prior to the ACA (now up to 50%), are windfall profit for insurance companies. They don't just care if you smoke anymore, they now care if you use ANY tobacco product. The CO test only covers smoking. Current testing methods capture smokes, dip, chew, snus, and now e-liquid nicotine, all recreational tobacco products. The collateral damage to NRT gum, lozenge, patch, spray, inhaler users is in effect free marketing for Big Pharma's prescription bupropion and varenicline, and even more profit for insurers. It'll be a cold day in hell before they switch to CO testing or BP encourages them to do so. Nicotine vapers shouldn't bother grasping at that straw.
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I'm a big believer in climate change, but I grant you it will probably take several years at least.
A good start would be for ALL vapers, especially those on ECF, to join and support CASAA. I hope you are a member and that everyone who reads this thread is either a member or will now join CASAA. I think your idea of going on the offensive is a good one. BUT, going on the offensive requires MONEY.
Getting op-eds into local papers, informing local media and encouraging them to run positive stories, cost nothing but time.
For campaigns that cost money - crowdfunding!
Have you joined CASAA? It's a good place to get information for those op-ed's and providing information to local media. We have no chance at all if we do not unite.
I'd like to add that you don't have to drink any CASAA kool-aid, "joining" just means signing up for email alerts for your state. There are 2 email choices I clicked, some folks only click 1. One is "general CASAA email" and the other is the state or states for which you want alerts.
That's it. It's free, though donations can be made separately, whether or not one joins. Also, obviously, being a member does not empower us to speak for CASAA, that's only the Board and a couple of designated (and famous) scientists.
Unfortunately, that sounds a lot easier than it is.
The media is far more ANTZ-friendly. They know and trust them and they don't know or yet trust us. We do ask for coverage of our side, but they rarely give it. We've been working on changing that. The past 12 months have seen far more media coverage of our side than ever before. CASAA now gets calls and emails from some media looking for our statement on issues or inviting us for interviews several times a month. But before that could start happening, we had to create a name for ourselves. It is still a work in progress. So, unfortunately, it is still not an easy task getting papers to publish our op-eds, letters to the editors or running positive stories.
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