Deeming Regulations Are In Effect
- Thread starter Bob Chill
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<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<this is want IM worried about and if something explodes and someone gets hurt it will give the FDA more ammo to strengthen regs
Yep think about how bad it is with cig butts all over the place wait till you have mountains of disposable plastic tanks filling up landfills, littered all around or choking the poor dolphins in the ocean.
I also think it is a great idea to test the waters by putting a huge effort into just getting a simple unflavored base approved. Maybe a group effort from a bunch ejuice manufacturers pulling their resources to this one PMTA and if it does not get approved that would do a lot of damage to the claims the FDA is making about it not being a ban.
Interesting article and survey out of the UK focused on the effects of the regs:
New Study Of E-Cigarette Users Finds Implementation Of FDA Deeming Rule Could Create A Black Market For Vaping Products And Drive Users Back To Tobacco
New Study Of E-Cigarette Users Finds Implementation Of FDA Deeming Rule Could Create A Black Market For Vaping Products And Drive Users Back To Tobacco
Sad statement on our nanny state. If I'd had the choice at 12 years old to vape instead of smoke I'd be in much better health today.
I agree partially we cant change the past so there is no point in looking back and trying to figure out what we could have done different but I much rather see a minor vape then smoke but don't ask me to buy anything for them
I hate to point out the obvious, but if you had no way to buy either cigarettes or vape products when you were 12 you would likely be in much better health today as well.
I don't mind pointing out the obvious, it has been illegal for decades for minors to purchase cigarettes, yet teens start smoking every day.
On that same note, I was just reading through the thread on the various age verification methods vendors are using, and I wanted to ask something of the people participating in that thread but didn't want to derail it, so I figured I'd ask here. We now have vendors, even some foreign vendors, asking for information like parts of SSN or to send selfies with our DL visible. Does everyone still think that age restrictions are reasonable? Keep in mind that, to date, there is no evidence of harm or development of addiction to vapor products.
I'm still in favor of it, although I think an argument can be made for not having age restrictions. Also with younger kids there may be developmental issues with nicotine. While I would likely agree that nicotine, by itself isn't quite as addicting as was once thought, I still think it's addicting. You don't see a lot of vapers, giving it up, although you do see some. I wonder what will happen to all the kids who took up vaping if vaping gets banded. As for the age verification, I haven't had to go through one yet, but some sound pretty silly and easy to fool.
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I think you were referring to the thread that I started and thank you for your consideration that you might derail it.
To answer your question about age restrictions...I think it's silly. If a minor wants something he/she will get it somehow. In this case a parent's SSN would get them in. Kids don't care or maybe don't realize that they are risking their parents to identity theft. I guess a selfie holding your driver's license would be a way of verifying but again would put them at risk of identity theft. Neither option is acceptable to me. Did I answer your question?
So many of us vapors have lowered our nic intake down to 3mg and I wonder what would happen if we THOUGHT we were vaping nic but there really was no nic in our juice. Maybe we aren't addicted physically but are addicted mentally. Just a thought.
Yeah, that would be interesting to see. I think my wife started vaping more when I bought some lower nic juice. I guess I could give her 0 nic without telling her and see what happens.
Of course, quite a few of those vapors that started at 12mg were vaping 5 mL per day @ 7 watts at the start and are now sub-ohming 3mg nic, but going through more juice.
There is a difference between developing addiction and maintaining one. Anyone who smoked was exposed to much more than nicotine. For many of us, the nicotine is enough to keep the majority of the withdrawal at bay. Never smokers exposed to nicotine, absent tobacco, have not been shown to develop an addiction though this has only been observed tangentially via experiments designed to investigate other uses for nicotine. As for developmental issues, the only study(ies) that suggest that effect were performed on rats. There are millions of adult smokers who started in adolescence who are "anecdotal" evidence that the idea is hogwash.
Yeah, there's enough going on in that thread already, this topic didn't need to be discussed there. I appreciate you starting that one, as I am one of those who won't be giving out part of my SSN or my DL#. My wife's debit card was just used to pay for a LYFT ride in San Francisco the other night, while we were both home, so I'm not keen on giving out more info than is absolutely necessary. There are less obtrusive age verification services. No vendors should have been scrambling to get them in place. They've been asking for this for years and three months ago EVERYONE was told it was going to be required.
My debit card was used to buy a tractor in a country I've never been to.
I sure could use a tractor though. 
You're welcome. I felt there was a need for a list like this so people wouldn't have to find out after they spent a lot of time shopping just to find out when they checked out that the vendor wanted unacceptable ID. I had already gone through 2 vendor's checkouts just to have to cancel my orders. That kinda pushed my buttons.
Were these studies dealing with Alzheimer's disease? If I remember correctly, there was some studies with nicotine, but I don't know the details. It does seem that non-cigarette tobacco users (pipe, cigar, etc.) are much less addicted than cigarette users. As for developmental issues, I was thinking more about preadolescent children and what might happen if there's not regulation and the parents perceive ecigs as safe. Maybe a long shot, but with what some parents do, I wouldn't be all that surprised.
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Alzheimer's and parkinsons, in both human and animal studies.
I won't say it would be impossible, because people will do any number of insane things, but I would think a parent allowing their preadolescent child to use a vaporizer would be exceptionally rare. If you're instead worried about second hand exposure, there haven't been many studies, but early results show numbers, if I recall correctly, around 1/5000 of the exposure level of the actual user. At least that was for vaporizer specific pg. Nicotine itself people already have in their blood, from the food they eat.
I wasn't so worried about second hand exposure, more the parent who lets his/her child play with their vape because they thought it was safe and there were not laws, so how was she/he to know? I guess at least put warning labels on it.
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I know you're not going to save every kid, just look at all the children who are cooked in people cars every year. I'm in favor of parental licensure. That's what you do if you really want to "save the children."
That's what you do if you really want to "save the children."- Status
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