Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[ShowerHead]

I have long thought that if I were a vender I would have a box option to select at check out that would automatically populate a form email to each and every major supporter and those on the fence who could become a supporter in congress. Why would I do this? Because it's in my businesses best interest?

Not entirely.

More so to stoke and encourage the passion of the vaping community to do no less then make their voices heard.

I am hopeful.

vape on.

Gee, I hate to intrude with reality, but form letters and emails go nowhere in DC and likely in state capitals.

Staffer- Oooh! Senator, a constituent just took the time to click a checkbox while buying something!
Senator- Well then, alert the press and call for a special session to consider this.

You have around 535 people who make laws, usually at the directive of their staffers. Some in fact do write laws, most are too busy preening for the press and raising cash for their next election.

You are not going to have any law considered that will stop the enormously powerful, rich, long connected do-gooder groups. American Lung Association, Heart, Cancer, etc, etc. You think tobacco companies are the enemy? Nope, look at the people who rant and rave to the public at every chance. "Candy flavor e-cigs is killing our precious children" "Teens are being disfigured by exploding e-cigarettes' "Martian invasion helped by flavored e-cigs".

These fine charitable groups are in every town in the US. In these towns they have as board members the editors and station owners of the local media. They get huge amounts of money from federal and state governments. They get a good chunk of change from the public. They have enormous credibility with the public and the politicians. They are knee-jerk against vaping.

Local Reporter- Congressman, the American Lung Association says that vaping will neuter dogs and kill all the fish, how do you intend to vote on removing proposed common sense FDA restrictions on that industry?

Congressman- Well Jennifer I stand with the experts at the FDA and other groups in keeping our children safe from the tobacco companies. The ALA is a favorite charity of mine and recently I co-sponsored a bill sending their fine scientists more money to do the hard work of ending death.


You want to do something that may help you keep some choice in your life, agitate for term limits. First you'd get rid of the doddering fools that are currently there. Second, the changing faces would not have time to establish their fiefdoms and the lobbyists wouldn't have decades to compromise them.

 

[beckdg]

So you'd rather leave vaping under the auspices of the Tobacco Control Act (and hence the Deeming) until we can get a better bill?

Come now! You know better. Taking charge completely is my preference. AND it's possible even at these late stages.

Just not with the group we're working with.

Who is likely to introduce a better bill? When? What are its chances of passage?

If done properly? Who cares, they'll all be thrown out or enforcement won't be funded.

But too, also...

If we're to accept this, that would be a good question to look forward to.

As the pendulum just switched back to a favorable direction.

Heck, I don't think Hunter's bill has much chance; realistically I expect it to languish in some committee.

Another reason unrelenting support seems ridiculous to me.

As am I.

That solves the problem for you, me, and many of the regulars here on ECF. But it does not solve the problem for the majority of present and future vapers out in the wild.

Hence my firm stance.

However, the Hunter bill would solve the problem for most of them, which is why I support it, despite the fact that it's not perfect.

I understand.

I just don't agree.

We could do more.

MUCH more.

With the right guidance and advocacy.

One with a passion for success instead of the beaten down depression of imminent defeat.

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

 

[Lessifer]

Anyone know if cole-bishop was stripped out of the temporary funding bill?

 

[Qew]

Anyone know if cole-bishop was stripped out of the temporary funding bill?

Scroll down to bottom of page 2.
http://democrats.appropriations.hou...les/wysiwyg_uploaded/FY17 Omnibus Summary.pdf

 

[HBcorpse]

Scroll down to bottom of page 2.
http://democrats.appropriations.hou...les/wysiwyg_uploaded/FY17 Omnibus Summary.pdf

"Requested file not found"

 

[DavidOck]

Huh, worked for me...

"The omnibus does not include:

The Omnibus does not include a House provision allowing thousands of unregulated
tobacco products to escape full FDA review."

 

[Qew]

"Requested file not found"

Sorry, I don't know what is up with the link. Here's what it says in part...

The Omnibus does not include a House provision allowing thousands of unregulated tobacco products to escape full FDA review. The House provision would have exempted e-cigarettes, little cigars, cigarillos, hookah, cigars and other products from the Tobacco Control Act’s pre-market review requirement, allowing products to escape regulations and requirements that Congress enacted to protect the public health from the nation’s leading preventable cause of death.

The Omnibus does not include a House provision exempting “premium cigars” from the Tobacco Control Act’s pre-market review requirement.

 

[Fozzy71]

Anyone know if cole-bishop was stripped out of the temporary funding bill?

yes, it was according to one of my vape feeds (casaa?) on facebook

edit: riding my slow pony today

 

[CMD-Ky]

I like this.

Gee, I hate to intrude with reality, but form letters and emails go nowhere in DC and likely in state capitals.

Staffer- Oooh! Senator, a constituent just took the time to click a checkbox while buying something!
Senator- Well then, alert the press and call for a special session to consider this.

You have around 535 people who make laws, usually at the directive of their staffers. Some in fact do write laws, most are too busy preening for the press and raising cash for their next election.

You are not going to have any law considered that will stop the enormously powerful, rich, long connected do-gooder groups. American Lung Association, Heart, Cancer, etc, etc. You think tobacco companies are the enemy? Nope, look at the people who rant and rave to the public at every chance. "Candy flavor e-cigs is killing our precious children" "Teens are being disfigured by exploding e-cigarettes' "Martian invasion helped by flavored e-cigs".

These fine charitable groups are in every town in the US. In these towns they have as board members the editors and station owners of the local media. They get huge amounts of money from federal and state governments. They get a good chunk of change from the public. They have enormous credibility with the public and the politicians. They are knee-jerk against vaping.

Local Reporter- Congressman, the American Lung Association says that vaping will neuter dogs and kill all the fish, how do you intend to vote on removing proposed common sense FDA restrictions on that industry?

Congressman- Well Jennifer I stand with the experts at the FDA and other groups in keeping our children safe from the tobacco companies. The ALA is a favorite charity of mine and recently I co-sponsored a bill sending their fine scientists more money to do the hard work of ending death.


You want to do something that may help you keep some choice in your life, agitate for term limits. First you'd get rid of the doddering fools that are currently there. Second, the changing faces would not have time to establish their fiefdoms and the lobbyists wouldn't have decades to compromise them.

 

[Lessifer]

The real question:

How else could you be willing to accept it?

It would be the STARTING POINT of a one sided compromise in a constant legislative push across all levels of legislation.



GRAS for inhalation?

AFAIK, there's one (or not much more) way to extract WTA.

ONE trade secret.

How many trade secrets are there to extracting and/or manufacturing our flavors?

AEMSA's stance against WTA is hypocritical, random and proprietary within itself.

Unless we see flavors banned and returning to acceptable under their watch as each flavor concentrate divulges their processes and trade secrets.

I can't believe it takes a retired judge to get this when faced with a compromise (only on our part) somewhat less than our last proposed compromise.

We're playing a game of pick your poison and there's a low hanging, shiny apple.

And nearly every member here must be named Eve.

I see it.

And I still can't believe it.

Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk

It does make less sense when you edit what you quoted...

I did acknowledge that GRAS is for consumption, not inhalation, but it is something.

To me, the starting point, now, is the current law that will wipe out the industry if nothing is done to change it. Do I wish we would have been fighting for a clean slate from the start? Absolutely! Do I wish our advocacy groups were focused on more than changing the grandfather date? You know I do.

 

[snork]

I'm sorry, but I don't see WTA not being immediately approved as "devastating".

Well I do and never have appreciated the jackwads at AEMSA appointing themselves the arbiters of all good.

 

[JustWondering1]

Contact: Gregory Conley
Tel: 609-947-8059
Email: gconley@vaping.org
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
May 1, 2017 at 2:00 pm EST
Democrat Leaders Celebrate as Industry-Saving Cole-Bishop Amendment Is Killed in Budget Deal

House and Senate Democrats boast about keeping vapor industry on path to prohibition


WASHINGTON, DC -- Yesterday, leadership in the U.S. House and Senate struck a deal on an omnibus government funding bill to keep the government operating through October. Much to the disappointment of millions of vapers and 10,000-plus small business owners, the Cole-Bishop Amendment -- a critical bipartisan policy provision to save the vapor industry from prohibition by the FDA -- was not included in the final bill.

Democrat leaders, who hold a great deal of power in budget negotiations due to the 60-vote threshold in the Senate and the unwillingness of some House Republicans to vote for spending bills, immediately celebrated their 'victory' over small businesses and ex-smokers.

"We have eliminated more than 160 Republican poison pill riders," boasted House Minority Leader Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA). Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-VT), the senior Democrat on the Senate Appropriations Committee, similarly celebrated the deal. Rep. Nita Lowey (D-NY), the ranking Democrat on the House Appropriations Committee, included Cole-Bishop among the list of riders that Democrats were proud to have removed from the final bill.

"It is absolutely shameful that Democrat leaders stood in the way of this job-protecting amendment from becoming law," said Gregory Conley, President of the American Vaping Association, a nonprofit that advocates for the continued availability of vapor products.

"Democrats are setting themselves up to experience a reality check on vaping in the November 2018 mid-term elections," said Conley. "The FDA's deeming ban is set to take effect less than three months before Senate Democrats have some of their toughest election fights in years. Just as vapers helped re-elect Senator Ron Johnson, vapers will vote out Senators who stand by idly as harm reduction products are yanked from shelves."

Conley cautioned that while Democrat leaders ultimately sunk the Cole-Bishop Amendment, it would be a mistake for vapers to blame the entire party. As of today, six House Democrats have sponsored a standalone version of the Cole-Bishop bill.

Despite the disappointment, Conley has an important message for vapers and harm reduction advocates -- the fight is far from over.

"We must redouble our efforts, focusing on not only Congress, but also the executive branch," said Conley. "If Congress refuses to act, President Trump and Health & Human Services Secretary Tom Price must act to avert this oncoming disaster for public health and small businesses."

Last week, a letter signed by over 2,000 business owners was sent to Secretary Price requesting that he take immediate action to repeal, halt, or dramatically delay the FDA's push for vapor prohibition. Additionally, in-store campaigns in vapor retail stores have led to thousands of individual consumer letters being sent to Secretary Price.

If enacted, the Cole-Bishop Amendment would have modernized the predicate date for newly-regulated 'tobacco' products under the Family Smoking Prevention & Tobacco Control Act. The failure to pass this measure means that all vapor products that have come to market since February 15, 2007 -- every single vapor product being sold today -- will have to retroactively undergo a potentially multi-million dollar approval process to remain on the market.

Last year, the Royal College of Physicians released a landmark study estimating vaping to be at least 95% less harmful than smoking. Additionally, earlier this year, the University of Victoria’s Center for Addictions Research of BC published a report strongly disputing the idea that vaping is acting as a gateway to smoking for adolescents.

# # #

About the American Vaping Association

The American Vaping Association is a nonprofit organization that advocates for policies that encourage the growth and sustainability of small- and medium-sized businesses in the rapidly growing vaping and electronic cigarette industry. The AVA was founded by Gregory Conley, a consumer and industry advocate with a long track record of advocating for vapor products dating back to 2010.

We are dedicated to educating the public and government officials about public health benefits offered by vapor products, which are battery-powered devices that heat a liquid nicotine or nicotine-free solution and create an inhalable vapor. The AVA is not a trade group and does not speak for any particular business, including our industry sponsors.

 

[Lessifer]

I get it, Democrats are against vaping, not arguing against that generalization. Was there a unified Republican front in favor of Cole-Bishop? Perhaps I don't fully understand the power of the Democrat minority on the hill but, if people felt this was something worth fighting for, it would have been included.

Not to mention the fact that changing the grandfather date is the very least we could be demanding.

 

[JustWondering1]

I get it, Democrats are against vaping, not arguing against that generalization. Was there a unified Republican front in favor of Cole-Bishop? Perhaps I don't fully understand the power of the Democrat minority on the hill but, if people felt this was something worth fighting for, it would have been included.

Not to mention the fact that changing the grandfather date is the very least we could be demanding.

I agree! To me, Cole-Bishop, is a safety net, until we come up with more substantial & comprehensive legislation.

I can't imagine that there wouldn't have been a number of Republicans willing to support this bill. This really stinks.

 

[zoiDman]

I agree! To me, Cole-Bishop, is a safety net, until we come up with more substantial & comprehensive legislation.

I can't imagine that there wouldn't have been a number of Republicans willing to support this bill. This really stinks.

Sometimes things like Cole/Bishop server a purpose that is Different than the Stated Intent.

Because putting Cole/Bishop into an Spending Appropriation was a Very Long Shot at best. And was kinda Slated to be Cut from the Beginning.

But what something like Cole/Bishop can do is to Generate Legislative Momentum and to Demonstrate Voter Support. Which can be followed up by Stand-Alone Legislation.

How Effective was this? I Dunno? Seems like Advocacy is Lower Now than before Deeming was Released. Much Lower.

And follow on Legislation? If this Thread lately is any indication of what Vapers want, and what they will Support, then I don't think there will be any Passable follow on Legislation.

And we just kinda go the way the Wind Blows at the FDA. Which might be OK? Or it might be Not much Change.

 

[Bronze]

Contact: Gregory Conley
Tel: 609-947-8059
Email: gconley@vaping.org
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
May 1, 2017 at 2:00 pm EST
Democrat Leaders Celebrate as Industry-Saving Cole-Bishop Amendment Is Killed in Budget Deal

House and Senate Democrats boast about keeping vapor industry on path to prohibition


WASHINGTON, DC -- Yesterday, leadership in the U.S. House and Senate struck a deal on an omnibus government funding bill to keep the government operating through October. Much to the disappointment of millions of vapers and 10,000-plus small business owners, the Cole-Bishop Amendment -- a critical bipartisan policy provision to save the vapor industry from prohibition by the FDA -- was not included in the final bill.

Democrat leaders, who hold a great deal of power in budget negotiations due to the 60-vote threshold in the Senate and the unwillingness of some House Republicans to vote for spending bills, immediately celebrated their 'victory' over small businesses and ex-smokers.

"We have eliminated more than 160 Republican poison pill riders," boasted House Minority Leader Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D-CA). Sen. Patrick Leahy (D-VT), the senior Democrat on the Senate Appropriations Committee, similarly celebrated the deal. Rep. Nita Lowey (D-NY), the ranking Democrat on the House Appropriations Committee, included Cole-Bishop among the list of riders that Democrats were proud to have removed from the final bill.

"It is absolutely shameful that Democrat leaders stood in the way of this job-protecting amendment from becoming law," said Gregory Conley, President of the American Vaping Association, a nonprofit that advocates for the continued availability of vapor products.

"Democrats are setting themselves up to experience a reality check on vaping in the November 2018 mid-term elections," said Conley. "The FDA's deeming ban is set to take effect less than three months before Senate Democrats have some of their toughest election fights in years. Just as vapers helped re-elect Senator Ron Johnson, vapers will vote out Senators who stand by idly as harm reduction products are yanked from shelves."

Conley cautioned that while Democrat leaders ultimately sunk the Cole-Bishop Amendment, it would be a mistake for vapers to blame the entire party. As of today, six House Democrats have sponsored a standalone version of the Cole-Bishop bill.

Despite the disappointment, Conley has an important message for vapers and harm reduction advocates -- the fight is far from over.

"We must redouble our efforts, focusing on not only Congress, but also the executive branch," said Conley. "If Congress refuses to act, President Trump and Health & Human Services Secretary Tom Price must act to avert this oncoming disaster for public health and small businesses."

Last week, a letter signed by over 2,000 business owners was sent to Secretary Price requesting that he take immediate action to repeal, halt, or dramatically delay the FDA's push for vapor prohibition. Additionally, in-store campaigns in vapor retail stores have led to thousands of individual consumer letters being sent to Secretary Price.

If enacted, the Cole-Bishop Amendment would have modernized the predicate date for newly-regulated 'tobacco' products under the Family Smoking Prevention & Tobacco Control Act. The failure to pass this measure means that all vapor products that have come to market since February 15, 2007 -- every single vapor product being sold today -- will have to retroactively undergo a potentially multi-million dollar approval process to remain on the market.

Last year, the Royal College of Physicians released a landmark study estimating vaping to be at least 95% less harmful than smoking. Additionally, earlier this year, the University of Victoria’s Center for Addictions Research of BC published a report strongly disputing the idea that vaping is acting as a gateway to smoking for adolescents.

# # #

About the American Vaping Association

The American Vaping Association is a nonprofit organization that advocates for policies that encourage the growth and sustainability of small- and medium-sized businesses in the rapidly growing vaping and electronic cigarette industry. The AVA was founded by Gregory Conley, a consumer and industry advocate with a long track record of advocating for vapor products dating back to 2010.

We are dedicated to educating the public and government officials about public health benefits offered by vapor products, which are battery-powered devices that heat a liquid nicotine or nicotine-free solution and create an inhalable vapor. The AVA is not a trade group and does not speak for any particular business, including our industry sponsors.

In other words they are celebrating their continued control over our lives.

I get it, Democrats are against vaping, not arguing against that generalization. Was there a unified Republican front in favor of Cole-Bishop? Perhaps I don't fully understand the power of the Democrat minority on the hill but, if people felt this was something worth fighting for, it would have been included.

Not to mention the fact that changing the grandfather date is the very least we could be demanding.

Republicans don't fight because the Democrats and their adoring press will blame a shutdown on them. GOP is too afraid. Like I've said...Democrats are destructive and Republicans are worthless.

 

[trying]

In order for a spending bill to pass, be it this 2017 or the 2018 budget requires 60 votes in the Senate.
Getting at least 8 Senate Democrats to vote for something they consider pro-tobacco is a though sell.

 

[Eskie]

The fact that Cole Bishop got tossed out is certainly disappointing. As the Hunter bill is still potentially pending, and Gottlieb is currently being voted on by the Senate, both executive and legislative relief are still courses available. However, I disagree with any suggestion that the goal should be no regulation whatsoever. It is unrealistic, bound for failure, and simply untenable to achieve. Is there any legal activity or product not subject to some basic (or very complex) regulation? Is vaping somehow "gifted" that it is not subject to any government oversight? If that's the goal, disappointment is not only the outcome, but regulatory oversight in excess of what was opposed to start.

And lets not forget, there's nothing stopping states from levying all sorts of excessive taxes, which can be just as destructive as any federal regulation could possibly be.

 

[Bronze]

In order for a spending bill to pass, be it this 2017 or the 2018 budget requires 60 votes in the Senate.
Getting at least 8 Senate Democrats to vote for something they consider pro-tobacco is a though sell.

Not always. A simple majority in certain circumstances (reconciliation) can be enuf to pass a spending bill. Theoretically only those items that reduce deficits.

 

[zoiDman]

In order for a spending bill to pass, be it this 2017 or the 2018 budget requires 60 votes in the Senate.
Getting at least 8 Senate Democrats to vote for something they consider pro-tobacco is a though sell.

Very True.

BTW - Here is something I posted about a Year ago.

To be Honest with you, I Don't Like when things are Inserted/Amended into a Budget Appropriations knowing that there Isn't Interest in Holding Up the Budget/Shutting Down the Government over it.

But we as Vapers have Gotten the Short End of the Stick it seems at EVERY Step along the way.

And this is Kinda Do-or-Die at this point.

House Committee Passes Amendment