ECA Misinformation

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eric

Unregistered Supplier
ECF Veteran
Maybe two completely different polls is in order - no nics should get their own poll because that would be an enlightening study.

Heck... Maybe I will learn that survey monkey software and do it up right. Crap. Another project. LOL.

Has the discrepancy been resolved in terms of the seemingly faulty poll that suggested the average vaper vapes 62.8 drags a day?
 

nycsublimegirl

Super Member
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Dec 20, 2008
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the average seems right to me considering all the "social" smokers...or those who already had cut down their tobacco to 3-4 cigs a day... half the smokers i know smoke that little... not everyone was a 1-3 pack a day smoker....


so its not to say many e smokers make take hundreds a puffs a day...while many many only take 10....

it would seem to me as well that many of those who are really big on the forums would be those that are heavier smokers to begin with....
 

LaceyUnderall

Ultra Member
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Dec 4, 2008
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Has the discrepancy been resolved in terms of the seemingly faulty poll that suggested the average vaper vapes 62.8 drags a day?

Eric - Yes. The study in question was a study given to 3000 njoy customers. Based on the answers given, the averages were correct.

Here are the findings:

******
This is one question we asked in a survey sent to 3000 of our users in March
of 2009.

On average, how many times each day do you take a puff of your njoy
electronic cigarette?

25.3% Less than 20 puffs
33.3% 20 to 50 puffs
22.1% 50 to 100 puffs
11.3% 100 to 150 puffs
3.6% 150 to 200 puffs
4.4% More than 200 puffs

62.8 Average puffs per day
******

As NYC pointed out, users on the forum are not likely to be the "average" smoker.
 

Kate

Moved On
Jun 26, 2008
7,191
47
UK
How many people out of 3000 actually responded to that poll?

Are you willing to stake ECA's reputation on it's accuracy?

Is this true and accurate?

Fact: The amount of nicotine in electronic cigarettes is much less than other OTC products.

Tobacco cigarettes and smoking cessation products, like electronic cigarettes and many other non-smoking-related products, rely on consumers to regulate their consumption and use according to manufacturer labeling. No one can control the misuse of products when directions are not followed.

That said, the intake of nicotine from electronic cigarettes appears to be substantially less than acceptable standards already in the marketplace. For instance, the consumption of a tobacco cigarette delivers about 1-1.5 mg of nicotine; with the average US smoker consuming 13.9 cigarettes per day, they consume 14-21 mg of nicotine per day. Depending on the smoking cessation product, labeling suggests consumption of 6-48 mg of nicotine per day.

By comparison, an electronic cigarette cartridge, depending on manufacturer and cartridge style, produces 0-16 mgs of nicotine when fully consumed by approximately 300 puffs. A recent industry study indicates the average electronic cigarette user takes 62.8 puffs per day. This suggests the average electronic cigarette smoker is consuming 3.36 mg of nicotine per day, far less than that typically consumed when using tobacco cigarettes or smoking cessation products.
 
Even if we take a standard cart as 1ml, this would be consumed by more like 60 puffs (not 300).

Not taking sides here, but if 3000 is not the number of respondents, then to mention this figure in the way it is stated will be seen as deliberately misleading.
 
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LaceyUnderall

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Dec 4, 2008
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USA and Canada
No. You are manipulating the facts. The fact is that this has been explained and you just do not like the answer that was given.

You want the ECA to use information off of a forum vs. an industry survey.

But the real issue here is that we have offered to let yourself or RTV fund a survey and the request continues to go ignored, so at this point, we have this industry study to use and that's that.
 

LaceyUnderall

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Dec 4, 2008
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If you are going to make claims then YOU are liable for their accuracy.

You are basically dishonest Lacey and want to deflect the fact that you have no way to justify those figures and claims - note the ones highlighted.

If you can't prove your claims then you shouldn't be making them, it's simple and nobody elses responsibility.

Kate - You have already called me a liar on RTV and now you are doing it here.

You have absolutely no basis for your arguments against this survey anymore now that all of the information regarding the survey has been presented.

And please, stop calling me a liar.
 

ccure

Unregistered Supplier
ECF Veteran
Mar 29, 2009
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It seems to me that this discussion is not working on our common and best interest. E-Cig.

ECA is using the report of a study that was made by Janty and it seems that ECA does not have the total report or can not show it as a request from Janty. So, we do not know the method used for the study and that give us a lot of questions against it results. We are not going to digest those findings until we know who the study was conducted!

Now, ECA funders are mostly USA suppliers and I will assume that they can add more than 3000 regular clients. So they can organize a proper poll/study with their clients. Why you ECA do not organize an Internet poll/study with your clients data base and find out all this questions?

We are supporting ECA (at least in my case) and I think we do deserve some respect if we do not agree with "facts" that ECA is making public.

Do your own research or be able to show the study you are using for those facts, so nobody can say that you are manipulating information.

Just my idea
 

Kate

Moved On
Jun 26, 2008
7,191
47
UK
Right, I must be really stupid, could you please spell it out for me how this:

Eric - Yes. The study in question was a study given to 3000 nJoy customers. Based on the answers given, the averages were correct.

Here are the findings:

******
This is one question we asked in a survey sent to 3000 of our users in March
of 2009.

On average, how many times each day do you take a puff of your NJOY
electronic cigarette?

25.3% Less than 20 puffs
33.3% 20 to 50 puffs
22.1% 50 to 100 puffs
11.3% 100 to 150 puffs
3.6% 150 to 200 puffs
4.4% More than 200 puffs

62.8 Average puffs per day
******

As NYC pointed out, users on the forum are not likely to be the "average" smoker.


... deals with the points in bold on this:

How many people out of 3000 actually responded to that poll?

Are you willing to stake ECA's reputation on it's accuracy?

Fact: The amount of nicotine in electronic cigarettes is much less than other OTC products.

Tobacco cigarettes and smoking cessation products, like electronic cigarettes and many other non-smoking-related products, rely on consumers to regulate their consumption and use according to manufacturer labeling. No one can control the misuse of products when directions are not followed.

That said, the intake of nicotine from electronic cigarettes appears to be substantially less than acceptable standards already in the marketplace. For instance, the consumption of a tobacco cigarette delivers about 1-1.5 mg of nicotine; with the average US smoker consuming 13.9 cigarettes per day, they consume 14-21 mg of nicotine per day. Depending on the smoking cessation product, labeling suggests consumption of 6-48 mg of nicotine per day.

By comparison, an electronic cigarette cartridge, depending on manufacturer and cartridge style, produces 0-16 mgs of nicotine when fully consumed by approximately 300 puffs. A recent industry study indicates the average electronic cigarette user takes 62.8 puffs per day. This suggests the average electronic cigarette smoker is consuming 3.36 mg of nicotine per day, far less than that typically consumed when using tobacco cigarettes or smoking cessation products.

Is this true and accurate?

There is no mention of the alleged 'study' you claim to be quoting. I am not questioning how many puffs you claim is average per day.
 

LaceyUnderall

Ultra Member
ECF Veteran
Dec 4, 2008
2,568
5
USA and Canada
Kinabaloo - 300 puffs is the manufacturers number. Whether this number is 100% accurate or not, it is what the manufacturer claims and it is what we have to go on.

ccure - This was a survey taken by nJoy consumers, not by Janty. The ECA does plan on doing surveys and studies on their own, but right now, what is available are the studies that have been done to date.

I completely understand your concerns. I am working diligently to get a set of questions together that can be run through the lawyers and then set up in a fashion that cannot be manipulated as we all saw with DC's survey. Survey's take time, and usually money. I am willing to contribute my time (which costs me money) to do this. Then, it will be made available to all suppliers who can offer this to their consumers and we can have members of the forum participate. (which including forum members will be interesting as we are not average eSmokers)
 
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