Fear from FDA, Family Members, etc That Vaping is Long Term Substitue for Other Addictions

[RosaJ]

I wish things in life were "black and white" and there was always a clear "winner or loser" in every argument. I've lived long enough to know that is not the case. You will spend a long time of your life trying to convince others to your way of thinking and even when you bombard them with facts, chances are your won't win them over to your side.

Some people are set in their ways and in the end it turns into a clear struggle of having a psychological need to win regardless of the facts.

I remember when I was younger how important it was to get validation from my elders to be "right" about my decisions in life. Today, it is obvious they enjoyed wielding authority over me.

Good luck to you on your journey.

 

[grandmato5]

At this point in your vaping, you ARE replacing one addiction for another. You are still addicted to nicotine. There are no scientific studies you can use to invalidate that fact for you right now. It IS a vaild argument to say against those are are against vaping that you have replaced a harmful addiction with a LESS harmful addiction at this point in your vaping career. Vaping hasnt been around for very long, its impossible to have long term scientific studies without years of research and so far there havent been many years to produce those long term studies. The CASAA website is the best place to find current information based on short term studies that proves the value of switching to vaping over smoking.

Personally I can say I've vaped for 3 years and I have NOT been addicted to nicotine for two and a half years. I'm a statistic that says once I completely freed my body of all the other chemicals in cigarettes nicotine was no longer addictive for me. I in no way think that everyone's body would react as mine did, BUT I am proof that for at least some people that is a fact. My medical records are my short term proof that while only utilizing minimal levels of nicotine because i want to and see value in it, not because I have to, my body has recovered from the effects of smoking for over 35 years in the exact same fashion as someone who quit all nicotine use for 3 years.

Its entirely up to you if you choose to eliminate your use of nicotine because of your disapproval of all things you feel are an addiction. Good Luck.

 

[Boiler]

"Addiction" is a loaded term, and not the same as a "dependence" on a nicotine.

 

[jazdale]

If a cigarette could be made with zero nicotine, would that be a safe cigarette?

The public can't disconnect nicotine from the truly harmful substances of a burning leaf.

 

[cramptholomew]

I see a LOT of nicotine addiction fear being slung around. In articles, mostly. What I don't get is why anyone cares? And why someone "has to put a stop to this addiction immediately". I mean, nicotine is NOT [insert highly addictive illegal substance that has the potential to decimate every aspect of your life here]. AND, vaping is NOT cigarette SMOKING. The powers that be have allowed the use of tobacco with its many KNOWN harmful side effects to continue - even though it's been PROVEN to cause those detrimental health effects. Is that an allowable addiction? I thought the ANTZ were screaming about SMOKE, not addiction. And, in vaping's case, how does MY nicotine addiction affect them, or ANYONE, if the vapor is proven to be non toxic? Why should anyone think that they are bestowed with the power to prevent me from making my own decision to be addicted to nicotine, if that addiction does affect anyone - including myself? Ugh. I hate people who think they need to save the world from everything that's enjoyable. Miserable people that need their power fix, and need everyone else to exist in misery with them.

Just do what you want to do. Make your own decisions - but don't do harm to others. If other people aren't willing to give you that freedom, then maybe you don't need those people in your life. As Clint Eastwood said in Grand Torino, "Get off of my lawn!"

 

[Bill's Magic Vapor]

What others think about me is not something in my direct control, nor do I want that responsibility, and, frankly, it's none of my business. I find it exhausting trying to get everyone to agree with my POV, so I gave up on it a long time ago. Others are lagging behind, apparently have more energy than I now have, and can continue "the good fight."

Here's how I handle the dilemma you describe, though. I agree with them. Yes, I'm addicted. But, based on the research that is known, vaping is not harmful, and/or certainly less harmful than smoking. I may even elaborate, if I care enough about their "concern." No one has ever died of a nicotine overdose when used as we do, to my knowledge, and I've searched for this answer. Lung cancer represents 30% of all cancer deaths. Nicotine is in our food chain, so if you like your vegetables, you're ingesting nicotine. Nicotine is now commonly used in the treatment of a dozen diseases and therapies, with no known side effects. I am certainly doing less harm than smoking, and their "support" is appreciated.

In truth, if I'm doing something that is good for me, like substituting vaping for smoking, and anybody wants to give me too hard a time about it, particularly judging me morally, I tend to spend a lot less time with them; friends, family or otherwise. I need to take care of myself, because apparently, no one else is going to do that for me. If, after I explain the truth, as I understand it, and as can be found on this forum, and "these people" still want to judge me, then the problem may not be me, or what I'm doing, it may be just them. Most smokers are not "conformers." We tend to be rebels, to one extent or another. I suppose there are the victims as well, but most of us didn't care about what people thought when we were smoking, at least not enough to quit. And if we couldn't quit, for whatever reason, and we have now found a way to quit, by vaping, and others are not supportive of us, we still must be true to ourselves, try and explain the truth as we know it to others, and the rest is OUT OF OUR HANDS....period.

I understand your need for a counter argument. How about your health, your life, one step at a time, a little credit where credit is due, or even mind your own business, when necessary. The fact is that you might not be able to satisfy other people's requirements of you, no matter how well intentioned, and why should you even have to? Or want to? Sometimes we just have to agree to disagree, and there is no "winner." I don't waste a lot of time trying to get people to agree with my POV. I have one, they have theirs. Sometimes there is common ground, sometimes there is not. I don't live my life based on their POV, I have my own mistakes to make, just as they do. If I focus on them, then I'm making the same mistake they are making. These are my own "big boy" decisions, whether anyone else agrees with me or not. I find in vaping that I am far more respectful toward others, than they have ever been toward me, and I prefer it that way. My two cents before I have had my first cup of coffee.

 

[Talyon]

I don't really care what others think of my Vapeing, and the ones that do matter support me.

I don't have any plans on quitting Vapeing. I might lower because it's my choice the nic level, but I won't be dictated to about using Vapeing as a quitting aid and follow a plan etc etc.

Vapeing is my choice and doesn't hurt others. I'm sticking with it.

 

[wv2win]

The FDA no longer suggests a time limit on how long to use most of the Big Pharm NRT products. Using nicotine gum for years, for example, is now accepted as being fine. Which is ironic sense nicotine gum is now linked to stomach issues.

If you think your friends points are valid, then you should just quit using any of these products. I don't see the problem.

 

[wv2win]

Is this another classic "hand-wringing" thread where another noob makes a long dissertation and then disappears to never comment on the replies??? This is getting all too familiar.

 

[Robino1]

The e-cig helps me in two ways. It helps the habit I developed for over 35 years and it satisfies my body's need for nicotine. The longer I vape, the less nic I need. Vaping will not increase your need for nic unlike other drugs that are illegal. People that vape, or even smoke for that matter, will not be in such a frantic place to get their next fix of nic. We don't steal or hurt people to try to get that fix.

Your relative that got headaches when she stopped drinking her Pepsi was her body coming off her caffeine addiction. It had nothing to do with the sweetener.

God, there's so much going through my mind and I can't articulate it.

I have traded one way of feeding my addiction AND habit with another that is less, MUCH less, harmful to me and those around me. I do not vape the way I smoked. When I smoked, there was a beginning and an end to the cigarette being smoked. There is no beginning or end that is timed so very neatly like with a cigarette. I take a vape, set it down. Minute later....take a vape, set it down. Sometimes I get busy. Work for a couple of hours, take a break and vape. The only difference, I now have to look at a clock. There is no end to let me know when my break time is over.

As my nic mg lowers, I find that I do not vape more, nor do I vape less. I'm finding that it is my HABIT that keeps me vaping. Now, tell me this. If you were not feeding the HABIT, what would you be doing instead? I know what I would be doing. I did it every other time I tried to quit smoking. I would be feeding my mouth. Guess what that would have led to? Health issues from being morbidly obese. I choose to feed my HABIT with vaping. If I get down to zero mg, I will still feed my habit that I managed to refine for 35 years over a 52 year life span.

Nicotine is not a concern of mine. I thank god every day that my family, and my husbands family, all see this as a positive. Not one of them has ever asked when I was going to quit vaping. I should mention that Mr. Robin's family are ALL never smokers. Not one of them has ever tried cigarettes. And that totally blows my mind.

My 82 year old MIL even thinks that banning ecigs in public is, in her very own words, stupid.

As someone earlier pointed out, the FDA has even come out and reversed their stance on NICOTINE. They no longer say that you must not use nicotine replacement therapies after the 12 weeks. They have approved long term use of nicotine gums, patches etc...

Nicotine has been linked for so long with cigarettes, it was never really studied on its own merit. It is beginning to be and the results that are coming out are good. There are valid uses of nic in the medical field such as treating Alzheimer's, ADD and intestinal issues. Nicotine is NOT the bad drug that was portrayed. It is the way that it is delivered to the end user that was the bad thing. Cigarettes, when burned, cause the chemicals in them to release toxins. Nicotine is just one of the many chemicals in cigarettes.

If it was just nicotine that you are addicted to, it would be much easier for you to make the switch from smoking to vaping. Think about that for a second.

You are still smoking a few a day, by your own admission. Don't you think there is SOMETHING else in those cigarettes that keep you going back and reaching for them?

 

[AttyPops]

"Addiction" is a loaded term, and not the same as a "dependence" on a nicotine.

My limited understanding is:

When discussing substance addiction (rather than actions...aka internet addiction, sex addiction, etc) the dependence is usually a sub-set of addiction.

However, I disagree with the video in many (but not all) situations: 1) Nicotine is not always being used to medicate...it can be...but isn't in all cases and 2) I don't think vaping is 100% harmless or has absolutely zero consequences...physically, financially or socially.

Thus on the addiction scale...vaping and caffeine are on the .01 % harmful end and "breaking-bad-drugs" are on the 100% harmful end.

This is mitigated for those that have a medical condition where they actually benefit from the nicotine and are better off with it than without it. In that case, it's beneficial and wouldn't qualify as an addiction but rather, probably, a dependence. Although there are people that can give up nicotine easily too and develop little if any dependence.

Is Physical Dependence The Same As Addiction? - ABC News

 

[RosaJ]

Is this another classic "hand-wringing" thread where another noob makes a long dissertation and then disappears to never comment on the replies??? This is getting all too familiar.

I wonder this also. Some posts I guess are intended to "stir the pot."!? Sometimes I feel like someone says jump, and I unconsciously ask how high? Must work on just cruising through the forum without getting involved...

 

[Spazmelda]

Is this another classic "hand-wringing" thread where another noob makes a long dissertation and then disappears to never comment on the replies??? This is getting all too familiar.

He's made several replies on this thread already.

 

[kottonmouth401]

The way most people see it that I have talked to is that is still an addiction and if there is no long term goal of getting off the addiction you are

1.) transferring one delivery system for another with admittedly the possible health benefits...but you are still an "addict"
or 2.) Transferring the addiction to a delivery system that is potentially more addictive than the original in which case the health benefits may or may not out way the psychological dependencies associated with the addiction.

This might not be very relevant to the main point of this discussion, but I have to to take exception to any claim that vaping is "potentially more addictive" than smoking. Personally, i feel much less "addicted". When i have to, i can easily go 4 hours without taking a puff, and i feel okay about it. Back when i was a smoker, if i had just gone 4 hours without a cigarette...well, lets just say i wouldn't be very pleasant company.

 

[Jo Patterson]

Never mind - I'm going with what AgentAnia said - see below

 

[AgentAnia]

People presenting the "but you're still addicted" or the "you're just exchanging one addiction for another" are usually operating under two specific (and usually unquestioned) assumptions: 1) They know what "addiction" is; and 2) Addiction is bad, per se.

Before getting into a discussion/argument about whether or not *I* am addicted, at all, or whether I'm *addicted" to vaping or nicotine or whatever, I believe it behooves me to question the person raising the topic about how he or she is defining addiction and why addiction (all addiction) is bad. Separating addiction to a substance from addiction to behavior is also called for, IMO.

I would go so far as to posit that *everyone* is addicted to something, or many things. Cell phones? Shopping? Coffee? Religion? Rx pain medications? Video games? Controlling the behaviors of others? It all depends on how you define addiction.

Reacting on the offensive ("Oh, you think I'm still addicted? How do you define addicted?) usually stops the conversation faster than reaction defensively.

Personally, my two alternative responses are 1) (for people I care about, a simply "Thank you for caring." 2) All others: "Non of your effing business, now go away."

(I totally agree with wv2win...)

 

[RosaJ]

People presenting the "but you're still addicted" or the "you're just exchanging one addiction for another" are usually operating under two specific (and usually unquestioned) assumptions: 1) They know what "addiction" is; and 2) Addiction is bad, per se.

Before getting into a discussion/argument about whether or not *I* am addicted, at all, or whether I'm *addicted" to vaping or nicotine or whatever, I believe it behooves me to question the person raising the topic about how he or she is defining addiction and why addiction (all addiction) is bad. Separating addiction to a substance from addiction to behavior is also called for, IMO.

I would go so far as to posit that *everyone* is addicted to something, or many things. Cell phones? Shopping? Coffee? Religion? Rx pain medications? Video games? Controlling the behaviors of others? It all depends on how you define addiction.

Reacting on the offensive ("Oh, you think I'm still addicted? How do you define addicted?) usually stops the conversation faster than reaction defensively.

Personally, my two alternative responses are 1) (for people I care about, a simply "Thank you for caring." 2) All others: "Non of your effing business, now go away."

(I totally agree with wv2win...)

Precisely! I'm addicted to eating, sleeping, and breathing. I'm an addict as I can't live without them. I will give up vaping before I give those up.

 

[k3vin]

at least 2 other posters have alluded to the fact that the FDA APPROVED PATCHES LOZENGES AND GUMS FOR UNLIMITED USE...UNLIMITED MEANS ANOTHER WAY TO GET NICOTINE FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE IF YOU SO CHOOSE.

Sorry for caps but that needs to be understood.Now I come to my part.

I tell people I have stopped doing what I set out to do which is to QUIT SMOKING...period end of story.Smoking was destroying my health.. If I had a Patch on my A@@,a lozenge in my cheek and chewing a piece of nic gum.Would they be asking when I was going to quit that? My experience is that they dont..

I love my nicotine,and I dont ever plan on quitting vaping.It is my personal contention/opinion that when someone inputs a chemical into their brain for decades,changes take place that are permanent.I dont believe in all,but welcome to the world of genetics,Predisposition and all.

Whats funny is I was reading on the FDA site a few days ago,and I read where the FDA considers tobacco usei.e. smoking to be a "DISEASE" ,similar to what they say alcoholism is. anyway I dont want to digress away from my point,and my point is.

IF YOU HAVE QUIT SMOKING,THEN YOU WIN,iF YOU USE A PATCH,A LOZENGE OR A GUM,OR JUST QUIT COLD TURKEY..YOU WIN!!!!!

And lets not forget..Everyone HAS SOMETHING in their life that has more control over them than it should..

If vaping is my only one. Then again I WIN!!!!


I apologize for the long-winded post,and the soap-boxish type reply,but ADULTS who dont smoke and/0r give us grief for vaping instead of using a patch a lozenge or gum,need to grow up.

 

[Robino1]

at least 2 other posters have alluded to the fact that the FDA APPROVED PATCHES LOZENGES AND GUMS FOR UNLIMITED USE...UNLIMITED MEANS ANOTHER WAY TO GET NICOTINE FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE IF YOU SO CHOOSE.

Sorry for caps but that needs to be understood.Now I come to my part.

I tell people I have stopped doing what I set out to do which is to QUIT SMOKING...period end of story.Smoking was destroying my health.. If I had a Patch on my A@@,a lozenge in my cheek and chewing a piece of nic gum.Would they be asking when I was going to quit that? My experience is that they dont..

I love my nicotine,and I dont ever plan on quitting vaping.It is my personal contention/opinion that when someone inputs a chemical into their brain for decades,changes take place that are permanent.I dont believe in all,but welcome to the world of genetics,Predisposition and all.

Whats funny is I was reading on the FDA site a few days ago,and I read where the FDA considers tobacco usei.e. smoking to be a "DISEASE" ,similar to what they say alcoholism is. anyway I dont want to digress away from my point,and my point is.

IF YOU HAVE QUIT SMOKING,THEN YOU WIN,iF YOU USE A PATCH,A LOZENGE OR A GUM,OR JUST QUIT COLD TURKEY..YOU WIN!!!!!

And lets not forget..Everyone HAS SOMETHING in their life that has more control over them than it should..

If vaping is my only one. Then again I WIN!!!!


I apologize for the long-winded post,and the soap-boxish type reply,but ADULTS who dont smoke and/0r give us grief for vaping instead of using a patch a lozenge or gum,need to grow up.

If you think that's long winded......have you looked at a few of our other posts?!?!?!?!
Yours is short by comparison

 

[AgentAnia]

Alert: Am in "random thoughts popping into head, which may or may not connect to other random thoughts similarly popping" mode.

Thought: It occurs to me that people expressing the "you're still addicted" argument are playing the shame card. Anything other than "Way to go!" is disparaging your accomplishment, dismissing it as ineffective or unworthy, and implying that I should be ashamed. I, for one, refuse to be shamed! And I will make that *very* clear to anyone who tries that on me. If you are a person who places much importance on what other people think of you, then you'll need to find your own strategies for dealing with them. My strategy is to come back with "Nope. No shame here! I'm delighted with me! And I'm soooo sorry you can't be delighted with me too!"