Fsusa to start spectro-analysis of e-juice?
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I love what Judge Judy would say in a case like this, "If it doesn't make sense, it's not true."
I don't know what is and what isn't true but I do know that a lot of it just doesn't make sense. I was under the impression he was planning on testing all eliquid in the US, "testing all fluids available in the United States" since that's the word he uses for eLiquids. Now people are saying he just meant flavorings? hmmmm
I don't know what is and what isn't true but I do know that a lot of it just doesn't make sense. I was under the impression he was planning on testing all eliquid in the US, "testing all fluids available in the United States" since that's the word he uses for eLiquids. Now people are saying he just meant flavorings? hmmmm
I've read some comments on here, but nothing that actually seemed to result in a conclusion. Here's an MSDS for vanillin. Vanillin is in natural vanilla. Actually if you look through the MSDS of many flavourings they contain warnings about potential for irritation through skin contact, inhalation etc. For example Ethyl Maltol (a very common flavouring) has the same type of warnings - http://www.sciencelab.com/msds.php?msdsId=9923991
Well, if he finds a way to do true testing I am all for it but "spectro-analysis" isn't going to cut it because it doesn't exist. I would like to see:
- Testing of random batches of juice, (not hand picked and delivered to the lab)
- A neutral outside agency who has no interest in the outcome, (not paid by FSUSA or any other supplier)
- A real test that has meaningful results such as GC/MS
I posted a couple questions in the mistress nomad announcement thread that have been glossed right over... And also commented on the OSHA hype, which is actually laughable, since every business with employees MUST pass OSHA inspections as the bare minimum to open their doors... Hardly worth bragging about.
I liked FSUSA juices I have tried in the past, but I am certain I will never spend a dime on them after this level of hype.
In my opinion they are stupid if they don't know the difference in testing and inspection methods, or dishonest if they do.
I feel sorry for mistress nomad, actually.
I liked FSUSA juices I have tried in the past, but I am certain I will never spend a dime on them after this level of hype.
In my opinion they are stupid if they don't know the difference in testing and inspection methods, or dishonest if they do.
I feel sorry for mistress nomad, actually.
I know. Everything has a warning. If you look at any of the Christmas decorations bought in the US this year - I don't know if the labels get sent to the UK - there will, most assuredly, be a label that says "WARNING: This product contains chemicals known to the State of California to cause cancer and birth defects or other reproductive harm." Those labels are on practically everything, not just Christmas related - I just use that as an example because many people will be buying Christmas decor.
We also have to have warnings on the hot coffee that we buy that says "WARNING: Contents may be hot".
It just seems sad that poor old vanillin is no longer in the spot-light anymore.
Like you, Zen, I've bought from FS in the past and won't buy from them now. It started for me when the diacetyl issue came up and the way he handled it by closing the thread. It seems like a pattern and I find it alarming that everyone doesn't see it. I sure would like to know what the other vendors think of his tactics.
Like my grandma used to say, "Birds of a feather flock together."
Like my grandma used to say, "Birds of a feather flock together."
I suspect other suppliers are busy behaving like the adult professionals they are and simply taking care of their business and customers without the need for all the silly drama and manipulative BS.
BTW, I'm a former FSUSA customer, too. Unfortunately, all the craziness that seems to surround them has left a bad taste in my mouth. I don't feel comfortable purchasing from them anymore.
BTW, I'm a former FSUSA customer, too. Unfortunately, all the craziness that seems to surround them has left a bad taste in my mouth. I don't feel comfortable purchasing from them anymore.
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Thats exactly why I find it hard to believe that he somehow thinks it will prove any type of safety. I think I read somewhere in his subforum that he wanted to put an end to the diacetyl question by proving it safe, or something to that effect.
What would be the point, the chemicals that are in the flavorings are already documented. I dunno if he would spend 30K if he simply couldnt get ahold of the documentation.
Sorry, I found the quote that gave my that impression and highlighted the part that made me think that.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/freedom-smoke-usa/139874-david-did-you-make-claim-4.html
What would be the point, the chemicals that are in the flavorings are already documented. I dunno if he would spend 30K if he simply couldnt get ahold of the documentation.
Sorry, I found the quote that gave my that impression and highlighted the part that made me think that.
http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/forum/freedom-smoke-usa/139874-david-did-you-make-claim-4.html
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I need to make a correction in the spirit of full disclosure... I have never purchased from FSUSA, I have tried several of their juices that others have purchased, and was going to place an order this week.
But things have changed...
When I see claims about certified labs testing ejuice it raised a red flag with me because I have been involved with companies that have had products tested by independent certified labs, and the commercial labs exist to make a profit.
I would trust the findings of a federal lab performing double blind tests, and so would the FDA... Anything less is a marketing tool.
I may have been born at night... But I wasn't born LAST night... This company is scaring me, I will never ingest anything they produce again, and others are free to do as they so choose. I won't support it with my cash, nor will I trust them with my life.
In fact... They're behaving nearly EXACTLY like a big tobacco company.
I feel the same way. First they seemed ignorant of the fact that some of thier flavoring from Flavourart contained diacetyl when Flavourart had the relevant info on thier site. FSUSA went on to remove these flavourings from thier site. Then, the big deal with the OSHA inspection. Then, the spectro analysis with no details. I am not feeling comfortable with all this and I placed an order with them a few days ago. I probably will still try thier juice but I do not like thier aproach and i am suprised more forum members are not feeling the same way.
This is just what bigger companies try to do to reduce competition from smaller companies. Many of the safety, environmental, ect. laws created by congress are at the behest of lobbyists from big business. The idea is that the smaller companies will not have the financial resources to comply so they will go out of buisiness and new start-ups will not enter the market. This is just the same tactic but at a much smaller scale.
I totally agree with this ,WOW !!! Now I'm going to do one of two things, either go back to smoking because of all this bad stuff I might be inhaling or get a early start on placing tomorrows order with FSUSA.
If I thought everything that came from this vendor were true I would be all for this attempt to change the industry, but I'm skeptical at best. It's easy to do online background checks on people and there's much information that's public record. Anyone interested I would suggest a search on any supplier they put their trust in. I do this before seeing a new doctor so why not for someone we trust our lungs to? It IS a new age of transparency and we don't have to rely strictly on what someone tells us. I belong to an online sleuthing site that has some great resources.
I keep wondering why people keep saying its better than analogs, as if that is your only other option. There are plenty of diacetyl free vendors, and this vendor FSUSA doesn't have to spend 30 grand to tell us which of their flavors have it and which don't they could come out TODAY and let us know that simply by alerting customers to which juices contain flavorart juices that contain diacetyl. Why in the world is anyone defending them for not releasing this information, who thinks being in the dark on this issue is better regardless of the impact of diacetyl on the lungs.
Only Freedom Smokes knows which flavorart flavors go into which FSUSA juices, they are just doing a song and dance in lieu of releasing information they already have. We know which flavorart juices have this, flavorart isn't exactly hiding it they list it on the website.
Is diacytle dangerous? Well that is something I guess FSUSA will have to think about, I wouldn't sell a product for inhalation that had it. I think the evidence is good enough that it could be dangerous and the last consumer to get Bronchiolitis obliterans sued the store that sold him the diacetyl product (pop corn), you can bet in 13 years if someone gets pop corn lung who vapes FSUSA juice the complete lack of warning on their website will come back to haunt them.
Only Freedom Smokes knows which flavorart flavors go into which FSUSA juices, they are just doing a song and dance in lieu of releasing information they already have. We know which flavorart juices have this, flavorart isn't exactly hiding it they list it on the website.
Is diacytle dangerous? Well that is something I guess FSUSA will have to think about, I wouldn't sell a product for inhalation that had it. I think the evidence is good enough that it could be dangerous and the last consumer to get Bronchiolitis obliterans sued the store that sold him the diacetyl product (pop corn), you can bet in 13 years if someone gets pop corn lung who vapes FSUSA juice the complete lack of warning on their website will come back to haunt them.
Exactly! They already know which of their juices contain Diacetyl and refuse to release the information! That's why I believe this is a marketing ploy. There are a lot of members who are angry at FSUSA for denying their products contain Diacetyl...then downplaying the dangers and finally locking the threads about it. They have been loosing money because of their response\actions and have made up this "spectro" testing farce to try and gain back trust. It's not gonna happen here.
FSUSA...you already know which juices contain Diacetyl....please release this information.
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This is why I will never purchase from them. I did once..then the thread was closed related to diacetyl. That alone was a red flag...too much drama happening with this vendor...its called diversion....at the very least...I am so glad I am not a sheep.....
I saw similar PR tactics from another vendor that was number 1 several months back. It backfired on him and he lost a lot of customers. Unfortunately there will always be new members that the fans can convert to their favorite supplier but I think most people are smarter than they are given credit for being. I sure hope so.
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