MYTHS and FACTS about Batteries + mods

[kinabaloo]

Two batteries using the same technology but with different mAh ratings ... the main difference will be longer life between charges. Put another way, after some period of time the one with the higher mAh rating will have a higher voltage remaining, on and off load.

There IS a performance increase in the higher mAh rated battery from the very first second; how much depends on the ratings - one would not tell much much of a difference between 1000mAh and 2000mAh but between 100mAh and 200mAh it would be noticeable. The reason is internal resistance. For a given range of batteries (same technology inside), bigger capacity will imply lower internal resistance meaning lower voltage drop under load and more current (hence more power).

In brief, a higher mAh battery will give longer life, better performance for longer and slightly better performance from the very first vape.

(There are some lithium batteries with high mAh designed for backup power that use a different chemistry and cannot supply a high current. These aside, there is a small advantage in power from the very beginning with a higher capacity battery, though it is over time that the slower decline in charge means that the performance difference becomes greater.)

 

[geeker]

What is a Super-T, and a T1? I know what all of the others are, but I guess I got here too late to ever see those, and the terms are too short for a board search. Thanks.

 

[CaSHMeRe]

1. Were Warp's claims actually logically debated here? I didn't see that anywhere.
A: To a certain extent ... much got cluttered, much like his post.

2. What did the side rants about "made from scratch" have anything to do with "MYTHS and FACTS about Batteries + mods"? Seems like that should have been another thread altogether.
A: Amen, and I completely agree ...

3. Why do we have to resort to name-calling people? Is this junior high?
A: Name calling makes people feel powerful

4. Noah from Innovapor made a comment on another thread a few days ago and was blasted by a few for being sarcastic (I didn't see the sarcasm...). However Cash has been blatantly argumentative, condescending, and rude in this thread. Why has no one mentioned this? Remember Cash, all readers are possible clients.
A: I'm not entirely sure where I have been argumentative, condescending, and/or rude, unless otherwise called for. I definitely remember that all readers are possible clients, but don't expect someone to sit quiet while their rep and product are being crapped on ... If it was an honest review, that's one thing and people have every right -- this was not that.

Hey Try ... See Red

 

[CaSHMeRe]

What is a Super-T, and a T1? I know what all of the others are, but I guess I got here too late to ever see those, and the terms are too short for a board search. Thanks.

geeker, here ya go:
Super T Manufacturing

 

[gjrhine]

What confuses me is some of you people talk like the price of something should be based on what it costs to make.

 

[kinabaloo]

Think of the batteries we are familiar with, the 1.3/1.5 type.

AAAs use in very small power required devices like MP3 players.
AA bigger, can power a portable CD player (higher current with a small motor).
C and D batteries are required for the highest power consuming devices.

For these common batteries, the max current required is usually the main determiner of what battery is used in the design rather than battery life.

Same thing with lithiums, even though even a small lithium's max current capability is higher to begin with - physically bigger battery in a range will have greater max current capability as well as longer life (as it holds more charge).

 

[dumwaldo]

Oh knuts peter this has all gone way out of control.

Anybody want a helli vaper for $5.68?
DealExtreme: $5.68 9-LED 12000mcd Flashlight with Bike Mount (3*AAA)

Some people take what others have made and try to act like they invented something and some people actually make something. Its up to you to decide who is who.

DW

 

[bri1270]

I can't believe this thread hasn't been shut down yet with some of the offensive language that's been tossed around. What happened to the mods in this place?

 

[kinabaloo]

You can't start your car with a pack of 8 AA batteries, not even once!

 

[warp1900]

Sigh.

I may be rather new here, but I have to say I'm very disappointed in this thread. Maybe someone can point out some answers to some questions I have:

1. Were Warp's claims actually logically debated here? I didn't see that anywhere.
2. What did the side rants about "made from scratch" have anything to do with "MYTHS and FACTS about Batteries + mods"? Seems like that should have been another thread altogether.
3. Why do we have to resort to name-calling people? Is this junior high?
4. Noah from Innovapor made a comment on another thread a few days ago and was blasted by a few for being sarcastic (I didn't see the sarcasm...). However Cash has been blatantly argumentative, condescending, and rude in this thread. Why has no one mentioned this? Remember Cash, all readers are possible clients.

It's a sad day for this vaper. I feel like my perfect little online world of friends and sharing has been tarnished.

Shame on you.

Tryp

I am sorry Trypwyr, i wish the original writer of a thread would be able to "moderate" in it, but unfortunately, that is not possible. Many manufacturers need their egos stroked frequently.
Maybe i should have just "closed" the thread right after i posted it, but as much as i knew this one would cause severe vowel contortions
to some, i was not expecting the speed at which all this happened.
The side rants were started by others and carried throughout, Cash is a manufacturer and he does not like anyone any mention of his products that might be contrary to what he wants people to believe.
The truth is he entered this thread with a veiled bellicose attitude right from the start and when others started talking about his own product, he just went ballistic.

I hope your future experiences here at the forum are less confusing and annoying.

Thank you for taking the time to read my thread and posting your opinion.

 

[wv2win]

with the SD what you claim is not accurate, because most likely your original DSE801 battery is not working normally. If it did you would get the same but for shorter period of time.

In the case of the prodigy, you SHOULD get more because it works at 5V compared to 3.7v form the original battery or the SD.

You can ask trog himself and he will tell you the same thing.
He openly tells his customers that the SD is for people that need longer lasting battery power and a better looking and stronger case.
NOTHING else. He might have a bad temper, but he is honest about his product, unlike the people who do reviews about it.

Manual switches V.S. auto switches do MAKE a difference, because manuals don't have a cut off like auto switches do.

On the SD in comparison to the 901, if I use the same atomizer on each, I will get one or two good hits off of the 901 and the third will be less and so on. With the SD, I will get the same good hit for hours. Basically, as trog has always said, the batteries in the standard PV just diminish so quickly that it is not worth the trouble.

On manual vs auto, there just isn't any comparison at all. When I read some post by those who state they get good throat hit from an auto super mini such as the RN4081, that is just plain one of two things: BS or they just don't understand what throat hit is.

Auto PV's are not really vaping IMO, it's just trying to vape and doing it poorly.

 

[warp1900]

All else being equal - a 150maH Li ion battery and a 750maH Li ion battery will vape exactly the same on the first few puffs.

Where the difference begins to show is after some number of puffs. The initial 4.2 volts on the batteries will go down towards the minimum allowed for the protected battery. The 750maH will maintain a higher voltage than the 150maH battery, as time goes by. The higher voltage will cause more current to flow, thus more wattage into heat. When the 150maH battery has drained down to3 volts, the 750maH battery will still be up at 3.7 volts.

Agree and very good addition to the real purpose of this thread.
Thank you

 

[SharonLM]

OMG no way Sharon, it is only directed to who deserves it and that is NOT you.

That was sweet Warp and thank you and WhateveR I sure haven't forgot you, I'm waiting for the sleeve!!!!!

 

[wv2win]

Two batteries using the same technology but with different mAh ratings ... the main difference will be longer life between charges. Put another way, after some period of time the one with the higher mAh rating will have a higher voltage remaining, on and off load.

There IS a performance increase in the higher mAh rated battery from the very first second; how much depends on the ratings - one would not tell much much of a difference between 1000mAh and 2000mAh but between 100mAh and 200mAh it would be noticeable. The reason is internal resistance. For a given range of batteries (same technology inside), bigger capacity will imply lower internal resistance meaning lower voltage drop under load and more current (hence more power).

In brief, a higher mAh battery will give longer life, better performance for longer and slightly better performance from the very first vape.

(There are some lithium batteries with high mAh designed for backup power that use a different chemistry and cannot supply a high current. These aside, there is a small advantage in power from the very beginning with a higher capacity battery, though it is over time that the slower decline in charge means that the performance difference becomes greater.)

Now, THIS post makes sense. Greater capacity means better, more consistent performance over time with less drop in power.

 

[kinabaloo]

Minimike is almost right - but there will be a difference from the very start.

Max capacity and max current are different measures, but in a given range of batteries, when one increases the capacity the max current is also increased, but the difference becomes increasingly small as it approaches the limit for that particular chemistry.

 

[warp1900]

Oh knuts peter this has all gone way out of control.

Anybody want a helli vaper for $5.68?
DealExtreme: $5.68 9-LED 12000mcd Flashlight with Bike Mount (3*AAA)
ARE YOU POSTING THIS LINK THINKING I HAVE SOMETHING TO HIDE?
LOL
Some people take what others have made and try to act like they invented something and some people actually make something. Its up to you to decide who is who.

DW

One more knucklehead that doesn't understand that i don't sell anyhting?

Welcome to the club.
Where did i claim i invented anything?
All my mods and or ideas are posted for anyone to copy, perfect or just ignore.
Do you have a personal problem about it or me directly?
Feel free to PM and we can talk about it, quit filling the thread with more useless unrelated garbage.

 

[DarkriftX]

I am a fan of altsmoke and we regularly chat on irc (#vapors on irc.xeromem.com) so when someone was doing a review of his Silver Bullet and started choking to the point of near death (well, it looked like it anyways) from a relatively small hit, I wanted to know why. Having just built my own flashlight mod and tested it out with 2x 3.0v cr2 batteries and getting a harsh taste, standard throat hit and med-low vapor I did not understand what caused the differences. I am/was under the impression that the OP (yeah, I love your RCA connectors too) was basically correct in the 3.7 = 3.7 = 3.7 = 3.7 = 3.7 arguement. I also asked altsmoke (not to put down his product, but because I WANTED TO KNOW!!) why his mod *seemed* to hit so much harder to a hardened vaper compared to a standard 510 or to my 6v mod. We came to the conclusion that there was no reason and he basically admitted that these mods are just a battery holder. You then have to look at the battery holder and ask why the price? Well there is high quality construction that has to be contracted out and lots of work to coordinate the build process. The design (and patent fees), warranty costs, shopping cart software, merchant account etc. Those all add up to make these cost more. While I myself would NEVER shell out that kind of cash for a battery case because I can build one myself, If I couldnt I would put a bit of thought into the SB.

Halopunker (spelling?) is (in my opinion) a nice guy and does not seem to be out to rip anyone off. He is selling a product he worked hard on building for a profit. If you choose to buy one, great, if not, whatever. If I were to charge for one of my screwdriver mods, I would probably charge like $40 or so. That is a lot more than I spent on the parts but the time it takes to make it and test it and ship it would require me to make at least that much to pay for my time.

I think all of you should stop fighting now because you are all arguing the same point, just from different perspectives.

 

[warp1900]

You can't start your car with a pack of 8 AA batteries, not even once!

LOL kina

 

[WhateveR]

hmmm .... walking a fine line WhateveR ... Considering you accused even me and the Prodigy of somehow stealing your design .....

Trog - The Pioneer of big batt PV's
Everyone else, including YOU and ME are simply afterthoughts ....

sorry, but I am no afterthought...

Look I'm not taking anything away from you... we both know how much work this all is... we can agree to disagree... I take pride in my work... I'm not saying I am the only one... I am only pointing out that I was first... that is all...

how is this a fine line?

 

[dumwaldo]

On manual vs auto, there just isn't any comparison at all. When I read some post by those you state they get good throat hit from an auto super mini such as the RN4081, that is just plain one of two things: BS or they just don't understand what throat hit is.

Auto PV's are not really vaping IMO, it's just trying to vape and doing it poorly.

Maybe some people just know how to work their equipment better than you do.