Why are you using such large amounts for an experiment? Wouldn't it be better to break things down so that you'll have plenty of extract from tried and true methods and small batches for the experimental stuff?
Pipe tobacco and Cigar extraction
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Well i consider the "cold maceration" (just letting em sit at room temp) to be the control. Everything else is a comparison to that. The original thought was to just run 8 kinds of tobacco using 3 methods (cold / hot / pga) and compare them but, i forgot the extra vanilla. Made 2 of the "mellow" in heat form" only did 5 out of 8 as pga...plans changed. I should have enough variety of enough mixes to get an idea one way or the other on what works and what doesnt. Ounce of tobacco costs me a few dollars , 150cc's pg/vg some pocket change.
After 18 months of extracting I have found that using no more than 80 mls of solvent to cover an ounce of tobacco produces the best tasting extract. Using more than 80 mls becomes exponential taste wise. The more solvent, the flatter the taste. I found this with both hot or cold methods. More so with the cold method.
Hmm. Id have to tamp down some of these blends for coverage at 80 but ill do that on the next round. Your documentation is the reason im confident in the cold macerations as my controls.
Heat maceration taste test
C1 series 50/50 pg/vg , 8 pipe blends , 2 ryo's and one blend of captain black with a generic black cavendish at a 50/50 ratio of concentrate.
I ran 7 flavors for taste tests among some friends and decided to call it in.
3 bottles of each flavor mixed at 20%, the first bottle was concentrate pulled immediately after the heat maceration (no extra time) , one bottle was made of concentrate that had been allowed to sit at room temperature for one week after the initial heating, final bottle 2 weeks.
the captain black / black cavendish had 4/5 of volunteers choose the 2 week hands down. One volunteer couldn't decide between the 2 and 1 week.
Imported whiskey - (imported + domestic tobaccos and scottish whiskey) 4 chose the 2 week maceration and one person prefferd the concentrate that had been pulled immediately after heating.
baja blend - (burley and virginia with green river black cavendish) - completely inverted! , some extra folks walked into the b&m and took part, 5 participants chose the baja that had not been left any longer than the initial 24 hour heating. 2 chose the 2 week, no one prefferd the 1 week.
captain black - one preferred no time, one preferred one week and 3 chose the 2 week.
Prescott valley vanilla- (burley and virginia with black cavendish) , 5/5 chose the 2 week.
Ryo1 - 2 chose 1 week, 3 chose 2 week.
ryo2 - another outlier, 3 chose the 1 week, one chose 2 week, one chose no extra time (heat only)
I had freshly ground coffee in a jar for the volunteers to sniff in between tasting, testing was done with participants blind to the age of what they tasted, using mech mods running duel coils at .3 ohm with japanese cotton.
I saw enough preference with the pipe tobaccos for 2 weeks to conclude that this should serve as a decent baseline (IMO) for heat maceration. I left a number of sample bottles with the shopkeep and mixed the remaining 0 day and 7 day samples back into the main batch of concentrate (which I am now micron filtering, before testing I had simply ran it through an aeropress)
A note on that, I have 2.5 micron and 10 micron, I should have used the 10 first and then the 2.5, the filtering is down to a drop every 5 seconds on some of these. The hand pump I purchased in basically useless, If anyone knows how to setup a buchner funnel and flask with a vacuum pump machine pm me.
I'll probably get to the PGA extracts next week (taste test wise, the concentrates are in my freezer), I also started 2 more batches last week, series D1, one set of 6 will be
left in the slow cooker for 6 hours allowed to cool to room temperature and then put back
for another 6 hours, the second set 12 hours straight, these will then be allowed to steap
at room temperature. 1 oz tobacco mixed with 100ml pg (per boomerdudes
recommendation...actually he said 80 but I round up) We have
sedona - golden virginias, rich burleys and smooth black cavendish with creamy vanilla
bisbee - vanilla burley, virginia and green river tobaccos
black velvet - fire cured cavendish, with vanilla, chocolate and whiskey
prickley pear - aged american burley, flue cured virginias topped with cognac
the prescott valley vanilla and
the baja blend
~Signing off~
Nanu Nanu
Post Script : I'm waiting on a large shipment of bottles but if anyones interested in trying one of these just let me know.
C1 series 50/50 pg/vg , 8 pipe blends , 2 ryo's and one blend of captain black with a generic black cavendish at a 50/50 ratio of concentrate.
I ran 7 flavors for taste tests among some friends and decided to call it in.
3 bottles of each flavor mixed at 20%, the first bottle was concentrate pulled immediately after the heat maceration (no extra time) , one bottle was made of concentrate that had been allowed to sit at room temperature for one week after the initial heating, final bottle 2 weeks.
the captain black / black cavendish had 4/5 of volunteers choose the 2 week hands down. One volunteer couldn't decide between the 2 and 1 week.
Imported whiskey - (imported + domestic tobaccos and scottish whiskey) 4 chose the 2 week maceration and one person prefferd the concentrate that had been pulled immediately after heating.
baja blend - (burley and virginia with green river black cavendish) - completely inverted! , some extra folks walked into the b&m and took part, 5 participants chose the baja that had not been left any longer than the initial 24 hour heating. 2 chose the 2 week, no one prefferd the 1 week.
captain black - one preferred no time, one preferred one week and 3 chose the 2 week.
Prescott valley vanilla- (burley and virginia with black cavendish) , 5/5 chose the 2 week.
Ryo1 - 2 chose 1 week, 3 chose 2 week.
ryo2 - another outlier, 3 chose the 1 week, one chose 2 week, one chose no extra time (heat only)
I had freshly ground coffee in a jar for the volunteers to sniff in between tasting, testing was done with participants blind to the age of what they tasted, using mech mods running duel coils at .3 ohm with japanese cotton.
I saw enough preference with the pipe tobaccos for 2 weeks to conclude that this should serve as a decent baseline (IMO) for heat maceration. I left a number of sample bottles with the shopkeep and mixed the remaining 0 day and 7 day samples back into the main batch of concentrate (which I am now micron filtering, before testing I had simply ran it through an aeropress)
A note on that, I have 2.5 micron and 10 micron, I should have used the 10 first and then the 2.5, the filtering is down to a drop every 5 seconds on some of these. The hand pump I purchased in basically useless, If anyone knows how to setup a buchner funnel and flask with a vacuum pump machine pm me.
I'll probably get to the PGA extracts next week (taste test wise, the concentrates are in my freezer), I also started 2 more batches last week, series D1, one set of 6 will be
left in the slow cooker for 6 hours allowed to cool to room temperature and then put back
for another 6 hours, the second set 12 hours straight, these will then be allowed to steap
at room temperature. 1 oz tobacco mixed with 100ml pg (per boomerdudes
recommendation...actually he said 80 but I round up) We have
sedona - golden virginias, rich burleys and smooth black cavendish with creamy vanilla
bisbee - vanilla burley, virginia and green river tobaccos
black velvet - fire cured cavendish, with vanilla, chocolate and whiskey
prickley pear - aged american burley, flue cured virginias topped with cognac
the prescott valley vanilla and
the baja blend
~Signing off~
Nanu Nanu
Post Script : I'm waiting on a large shipment of bottles but if anyones interested in trying one of these just let me know.
So the aromatics came through great but the more subtle blends seem "wanting" , even the aromatics however pale in comparison to commercial NET's . I'm thinking 2 weeks post heat steep was a premature time to pull the tobacco , what say you elder diy'ers? a full 4 weeks?
I have tons of supplies coming in so I'm also going to play around with longer heating times at lower temperatures (an initial 6 hours of the "heat" setting and then 72, 96 and 120 hours of "warm" consecutively) , i'll be using some pipe blends from a local smoke shop that I used back in my early college days when I was poor
I have tons of supplies coming in so I'm also going to play around with longer heating times at lower temperatures (an initial 6 hours of the "heat" setting and then 72, 96 and 120 hours of "warm" consecutively) , i'll be using some pipe blends from a local smoke shop that I used back in my early college days when I was poor
Now, now. No cut & paste double posting. It's against some kinda rule somewhere.
So the aromatics came through great but the more subtle blends seem "wanting" , even the aromatics however pale in comparison to commercial NET's . I'm thinking 2 weeks post heat steep was a premature time to pull the tobacco , what say you elder diy'ers? a full 4 weeks?
I have tons of supplies coming in so I'm also going to play around with longer heating times at lower temperatures (an initial 6 hours of the "heat" setting and then 72, 96 and 120 hours of "warm" consecutively) , i'll be using some pipe blends from a local smoke shop that I used back in my early college days when I was poor
Thats true. Anyone in the net part deux is probably in here but probably not vice versa. To keep on point did you find any discernable differwnce between aromatics and non aromatics you've used?
I think you'll find in time, that you won't be buying any or many more commercial NET's, well, that's what I found, YMMV.
Make sure you are not mixing the extract too strong with PG/VG/nic, that can really wreck a flavor. 12.5% works well for me in an RDA, but it also depends on how much solvent you use in the maceration for a given amount of tobacco, and the blend characteristics.
There's other advantages too, in that you are not limited to the choices of commercial vendors, and also some commercial vendors use a particular NET as a base to add other flavorings to. I prefer the raw blend flavor by far, and the mixing of blends has interesting possibilities once you get familiar with them. Also the economic advantages, lets say you buy 4 x 30ml NET flavors for $60 plus shipping. That same $60 could get you around 10 tobacco types of 1 oz each, plus enough PG/VG/nic, to make well in excess of a gallon of vapable NETs. If your hit ratio was only 50% (like vs dislike) then you would easily have over half a gallon of good NET, of your favorite 5 blends out of 10...half a gallon is over 2000ml for your $60, compared to the commercial offerings of 120ml for $60. These are rough figures but should be in the ball-park.
Ian,
That's my experience, too.
I stopped buying retail NETs more than a year ago. Same applies to almost all non-tobacco retail juices. I DIY most everything now, with the exception of a couple retail juices I can't replicate closely enough and still like to have in my stash.
And yes, with NETs the savings from making one's own extracts versus buying retail juices or extracts are not merely significant, but downright astonishing.
Tatiana Night Cap - Vanilla over Marcona almonds, Cafe Arabica and cocoa.
Hand-rolled in the Dominican Republic, made with Dominican fillers grown from Cuban-seed, draped in an Indonesian wrapper.
2.5 um filtering almost done. Will mix up a sample later today. Combination of Heat Assist and Cold Maceration. Initial mix heated to 150f for 36 hours and cold maceration one month, yesterday. Aroma of nuts, coffee and chocolate, it's all there. I hope it tastes as good as it smells. Two other Tatiana flavored extracts turned out fantastic. Tatiana Rum and Tatiana Cognac. Good day, all!
Hand-rolled in the Dominican Republic, made with Dominican fillers grown from Cuban-seed, draped in an Indonesian wrapper.
2.5 um filtering almost done. Will mix up a sample later today. Combination of Heat Assist and Cold Maceration. Initial mix heated to 150f for 36 hours and cold maceration one month, yesterday. Aroma of nuts, coffee and chocolate, it's all there. I hope it tastes as good as it smells. Two other Tatiana flavored extracts turned out fantastic. Tatiana Rum and Tatiana Cognac. Good day, all!
Yes, macerated extractions really are easy. I've often marveled at the detailed questions people ask on the various home extractor threads about the "best" or "right" ways to produce extracts, as if the process were brain surgery or rocket science.
Sounds wonderful.
I think the whole line of Tatiana Flavored Cigars taste great. I haven't decanted Fusion Frenzy or Sweet euphoria yet, but if they taste as good as the rest of the lineup it will be $8 well spent.
So. Did a taste test with aome of the individual tobacco Concentrates then mixed at 20% to roughly 60/40 pg/vg. Magnificent
a little cornell / diehl latakia
a little more cornell / diehl granulated perique
then some newminster straight virginia and a good heaping portion of mcclelland biteless burley
a little cornell / diehl latakia
a little more cornell / diehl granulated perique
then some newminster straight virginia and a good heaping portion of mcclelland biteless burley
Where do you find the Tatiana individuallly at?I've been searching around a bit,and all i have found are full boxes or i think they had 10 packs.
Cool,thanks.That is the very first place i looked when i seen Boomerdude post about them before.I must have spelled it wrong because nothing came up for them at all,so i've been looking on a few other cifar sites i used to buy from and they either don't sell them or like i said only have full boxes.I'm glad pipes has them,i have a full list of stuff i want to pick up from them,so i will add a few of these on.
How do the flavors in the Tatiana cigars go as they steep long term? Do they lose their flavors over time?
Here's another place but they couldn't accept my credit card
Tatiana
Here's another place but they couldn't accept my credit card
Tatiana
I get mine here : PipesAndCigars.com - Pipe Tobacco, New Pipes, Estate Pipes, Cigars - PipesandCigars.com
Down under, I don't know.
I haven't gone past about three months with any particular one as they're all vaped by then.
Down under, I don't know.
I haven't gone past about three months with any particular one as they're all vaped by then.
How do the flavors in the Tatiana cigars go as they steep long term? Do they lose their flavors over time?
Here's another place but they couldn't accept my credit card
Tatiana
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