Should ALL reviews be compared to the Provari?

[Pinggolfer]

Well I believed in the product I think is the best enough to lay my money down for it, it's easy to shout USA, USA and then not put your money down, anyone can do that.

If you read all the reviews on the Provari and then read complaints if there are some, you can judge which is best. USA or not it's way more positive then negative when it comes to the Provari. You have it in your mind those who own them are screaming USA, USA.

 

[K_Tech]

Then I've actually never read a review that was valid. There are devices that don't fit my (extremely small for a man) hand. They feel terrible.

I never want to hear another Provari user discuss taste, either, as that's obviously invalid. Quite apart from the fact that the math will show the wire simply can't respond that quickly. The latency time is far too high for the oscillation to make any real difference.

And ugly is an aesthetic quantity. The Provari is simply fugly. It doesn't need to feel bad, to me the VAMO is fugly for other reasons (but I still have one). My everyday, running-around Volt X2 is aesthetically fairly neutral to my tastes, except for the blue LED which is, to me, full on fugly.

I could go into proportions, familiarity of design, color choices, color meanings, Form Follows Function rules, and so on. I don't. I just rate it on the beautiful to pretty to attractive to neutral to unattractive to ugly to fugly scale.

That's actually why I like PBusardo's reviews, because he goes into the technical, usually in the latter half of his reviews. I also like the reviewers that will go into detail about why they like or dislike a particular device ("It feels funky" isn't a valid assessment, in my opinion).

But I'm a facts and numbers kind of guy when I'm listening to someone else. To a point I respect the fact that they think something is pretty, but I'm the only beholder whose eye matters when it's my credit card on the line.

 

[KenD]

If you read all the reviews on the Provari and then read complaints if there are some, you can judge which is best. USA or not it's way more positive then negative when it comes to the Provari. You have it in your mind those who own them are screaming USA, USA.

You are rambling. Ref Minor was very clear in stating that the country a device is manufactured in does not in itself factor in when assessing the quality of a device. The device should stand on its own merits (that is to say, the provaris that exist are no better or worse due to being manufactured in the US). Favouring devices manufactured in the US, or some other country depending on your choice, is totally fine, but that should not, by itself, be a factor when assessing the quality of a device. I don't understand what you're trying to convey with "USA or not it's way more positive then negative when it comes to the Provari. You have it in your mind those who own them are screaming USA, USA".

And, you're still not getting the point that different people have different needs and any one device cannot fulfil all possible needs. The provari may be "best" according to tests (depending on the criteria of those tests) but that doesn't mean that it's the best in actual usage for every potential vaper. Earlier in this thread I posted my views on why the provari isn't the best device for me. That doesn't make me a hater, ignorant, or anti-American - it simply means that I have particular needs that the provari doesn't fulfill.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk

 

[MorpheusPA]

That's actually why I like PBusardo's reviews, because he goes into the technical, usually in the latter half of his reviews. I also like the reviewers that will go into detail about why they like or dislike a particular device ("It feels funky" isn't a valid assessment, in my opinion).

But I'm a facts and numbers kind of guy when I'm listening to someone else. To a point I respect the fact that they think something is pretty, but I'm the only beholder whose eye matters when it's my credit card on the line.

Data is fine, and I quite like output graphs myself. However, if a review contained only those and never showed the device, I certainly wouldn't buy it sight-unseen. It could be the size of a baseball bat...or incredibly fugly. Or both.

Plus if somebody the size of P. Busardo said "It weighs a ton and feels huge in my hand," then I'd know off the top that it's not for me. For that matter, if it looks large in his hand, it's not going to work for me and I don't need to go find the specific dimensions.

 

[Myrany]

Well I believed in the product I think is the best enough to lay my money down for it, it's easy to shout USA, USA and then not put your money down, anyone can do that.

As the proud owner of 2 REO grands I can vouch for the solid construction and excellent customer support of REOsmods. They HAPPEN to be US made. Interestingly enough being US made was not a factor in my choice to be a REOnaut. It was function and durability all the way.

I can totally understand someone wanting to purchase something locally made. It makes getting the item serviced much simpler and it does support the local economy.

Outside of that I am not sure why where something is made matters all that much in the age of internet and global economys.

 

[yorkiegirl]

I've tried my cousin's and I found the Provari to be large, overly bulky, and the balance felt strange. Plus the fact that it's got that ugly thing going on, and I didn't consider it so ugly it's cute. It's just ugly.

After some fiddling and a lot of clicking, we managed to get it to produce the same vape as my $30 Volt X2, but I still had to push the manual button instead of the device detecting that I wanted a vape automatically.

So I'll say no for that reason. My goals in my vaping life just aren't Provari-compatible, and most of the vapers I know or I've converted are the same. We're looking for ease of use, consistent vape, and no hassle when we're otherwise occupied.

We're not mod people. Comparing non-mods to mods would be a terrible idea.

Mod people will have to chime in on what they think about comparisons there, but my little Volt X2 has entirely different functionality and goals in life than the Provari does.

I'm sorry but I'm not sure what Provari you tested because the Provari is definitely not large or bulky for a mod. I'm a woman and if I wrap my hand around my Provari like I'm making a fist I can completely conceal it except for a little small part peeking out at the bottom and I have the standard size. There is no fiddling with a Provari. Each time you push the fire bottom you get consistency. Vapor production has a lot to do with the juice and the topper that you are using. I'm not one to defend any mod. Everyone should use what they feel is right for them but what was said about the Provari is incorrect.

 

[Dana A]

My 2 favorites are the Rio and the Provari. I sold my Rio cause I like VV but if I likes mechs a Rio would be where it's at for me. But other people have different favorites. I don't think you can measure a bottom feeder against a tube mod or a mech against VV or VW. It just wouldn't work. To me the Provari is the end all be all holy grail but that's just me. Other people have different holy grails.

 

[MorpheusPA]

I'm sorry but I'm not sure what Provari you tested because the Provari is definitely not large or bulky for a mod. I'm a woman and if I wrap my hand around my Provari like I'm making a fist I can completely conceal it except for a little small part peeking out at the bottom and I have the standard size. There is no fiddling with a Provari. Each time you push the fire bottom you get consistency. Vapor production has a lot to do with the juice and the topper that you are using. I'm not one to defend any mod. Everyone should use what they feel is right for them but what was said about the Provari is incorrect.

Size six ring, five and a half inch wrist...smaller than most women's hands.

It's not incorrect, you just didn't happen to have the same experience. Wonderful. But to say I'm "wrong" because you don't happen to agree is really rather ridiculous.

 

[six]

... but if I likes mechs a Rio would be where it's at for me. I don't think you can measure a bottom feeder against a tube mod or a mech against VV or VW. .

Couple of things - 1) REO has a VV Grand. That's just FYI in case you want to revisit bottom feeders.

2) VV vs VW. Well, since they are the exact same thing, I think they should be directly compared. I'm still not really sure what convinced people that VV and VW are different. Math proves they are not.

 

[yorkiegirl]

Size six ring, five and a half inch wrist...smaller than most women's hands.

It's not incorrect, you just didn't happen to have the same experience. Wonderful. But to say I'm "wrong" because you don't happen to agree is really rather ridiculous.

Everyone has a right to their own opinion but all anyone has to do is search these forums and other forums which will back up the Provari and it's performance. Provari and inconsistencies don't go together. Provape backs the Provari with a 1 year warranty and 2nd year can be purchased at a very reasonable price. How many other companies can do that and not feel the backlash from all the warranty repairs? These things are built solid and chances are the warranty will never have to be used. It may not be the thing for you or the next person which is very understandable but saying that you had to do a lot of fiddling and clicking to get a Provari to perform as well as a Volt X2 seems very hard to believe. The Provari doesn't have a cult following for no reason. If you were offended by my post then I apologize. I don't advocate for any mod but you also won't see me talking bad about one either especially one that I don't own. I try to give everyone a chance to make their own decisions. What might not work for me may be great for someone else and vice versa.

 

[generic mutant]

...
2) VV vs VW. Well, since they are the exact same thing, I think they should be directly compared. I'm still not really sure what convinced people that VV and VW are different. Math proves they are not.

Hmm... I think we've been through that. No they're not...

V != W



It's perfectly legitimate to say you don't see the need for variable wattage. I don't particularly either; although I do prefer using it, I'd be happy with a VV device too.

But pretending adjusting the input parameter is the same thing as adjusting the output* parameter isn't helpful.


* fair enough, it's not really the output - vapour quantity / temperature is the output, but it's a close proxy.

 

[Capt.shay]

Just buy an MVP and be done with it.

 

[six]

Hmm... I think we've been through that. No they're not...

V != W



It's perfectly legitimate to say you don't see the need for variable wattage. I don't particularly either; although I do prefer using it, I'd be happy with a VV device too.

But pretending adjusting the input parameter is the same thing as adjusting the output* parameter isn't helpful.


* fair enough, it's not really the output - vapour quantity / temperature is the output, but it's a close proxy.

This would probably be better in a different thread... but I'm going to go ahead anyway. They are the exact same thing. Ohms law is ohms law.

Beyond the pie chart, let's get right after it. The audio guys talk about "golden ears" (people who can hear far outside normal human ranges). The food guys talk about golden tongues (people with palates so refined as to catch even the most subtle nuances of texture and flavor)... which would apply here if it was possible. In the case of vapers, it just isn't possible. Pop the bridge out of your atty. Don't put any juice in it and put it on any PV you have handy. Push the button. How long did it take for the coil to get red? Is the moment it gets red the top of the temperature it will put out? Let off the button. How long did it take for the glow to go away? How cool is it when the read goes away? How much thermal mass exists? - Repeat with juice. Repeat with alcohol. Repeat with a blob of glue, bit of wood, or chunk of your hat, feathers from your pillow.... or whatever. It will be pretty much the same and only different in mass, but thermal mass brings up a whole new set of questions itself. Sorry. There are a thousand factors involved in heating and cooling anything. Just those I asked questions about should make a pretty solid point about the fact that the bizarre hype about VW is just bizarre hype.

VV and VW are the same thing. Ohms law does not change because of marketing.

 

[MorpheusPA]

Everyone has a right to their own opinion but all anyone has to do is search these forums and other forums which will back up the Provari and it's performance. Provari and inconsistencies don't go together.

I hate to say it, but I now understand the annoyance with the Provari fanboi (fanchik in your case) club.

It's ugly, it's heavy, it feels weird. These were the things I observed. That's not inconsistency, it's bloody poor aesthetic design.

Provape backs the Provari with a 1 year warranty and 2nd year can be purchased at a very reasonable price. How many other companies can do that and not feel the backlash from all the warranty repairs? These things are built solid and chances are the warranty will never have to be used.

Where did I comment on the warranty? I said it's heavy, it's ugly, and it feels weird. I don't care how good the warranty is on a product I won't use because it's not well-designed and doesn't fit well in my hand.

It may not be the thing for you or the next person which is very understandable but saying that you had to do a lot of fiddling and clicking to get a Provari to perform as well as a Volt X2 seems very hard to believe.

You might have asked. We had to turn the voltage down to 3.6, which is what I'm used to and where my liquid tastes good to me--and happens to be what the Volt X2 puts out. Without, I should add, being heavy, ugly, or fitting poorly in my hand. Which was my only criticism about the Provari.

The Provari doesn't have a cult following for no reason. If you were offended by my post then I apologize. I don't advocate for any mod but you also won't see me talking bad about one either especially one that I don't own. I try to give everyone a chance to make their own decisions. What might not work for me may be great for someone else and vice versa.

The reason I don't own one is because, having tried it, it's heavy, it's ugly, and it fits poorly in my hand.

I don't want to own one for those reasons. I wouldn't read or watch a review that compared something like the Volt X2 to the Provari (to actually return to the original topic) because they're heavy, they're ugly, and they fit poorly in my hand. Any comparison that begins there also stops there because I don't like the thing and wouldn't use it.

Not to mention the fact that I simply don't care for manual control, the same way I don't care for Italian Wedding Soup. Some people love it, that's fine, I can't stand the stuff.

The fact that you like it and defend it isn't going to make me suddenly love the soup, any more than I'd ever consider a Provari.

 

[generic mutant]

six: To vary the volts you must vary the watts and vice versa, so in that sense they're the same - different sticks to pull to adjust the same equation.

It's always going to be complicated, but watts is a better approximation of the desired effect ('vape output') than volts, simply because watts is a function of resistance.

I've got juices that I know I like at roughly a certain number of watts, to some degree regardless of the build. Having the option of setting via watts makes that easier. An intelligent device which varied the voltage as resistance changed during firing would be more consistent too, though I don't know how often VW devices sample the resistance and adjust.

It's not a night and day difference, but it is legitimately different, and to many people an improvement.

 

[yorkiegirl]

I hate to say it, but I now understand the annoyance with the Provari fanboi (fanchik in your case) club.

It's ugly, it's heavy, it feels weird. These were the things I observed. That's not inconsistency, it's bloody poor aesthetic design.



Where did I comment on the warranty? I said it's heavy, it's ugly, and it feels weird. I don't care how good the warranty is on a product I won't use because it's not well-designed and doesn't fit well in my hand.



You might have asked. We had to turn the voltage down to 3.6, which is what I'm used to and where my liquid tastes good to me--and happens to be what the Volt X2 puts out. Without, I should add, being heavy, ugly, or fitting poorly in my hand. Which was my only criticism about the Provari.



The reason I don't own one is because, having tried it, it's heavy, it's ugly, and it fits poorly in my hand.

I don't want to own one for those reasons. I wouldn't read or watch a review that compared something like the Volt X2 to the Provari (to actually return to the original topic) because they're heavy, they're ugly, and they fit poorly in my hand. Any comparison that begins there also stops there because I don't like the thing and wouldn't use it.

Not to mention the fact that I simply don't care for manual control, the same way I don't care for Italian Wedding Soup. Some people love it, that's fine, I can't stand the stuff.

The fact that you like it and defend it isn't going to make me suddenly love the soup, any more than I'd ever consider a Provari.

Going back and forth on forums is not my thing. I'm here to learn and try to be as helpful as I can in as nice a way possible. You have your opinion and I have mine. Provari fanboi...weird....lol. The hate from those that don't have one is just as weird. Hope you have a good evening.

 

[MorpheusPA]

This would probably be better in a different thread... but I'm going to go ahead anyway. They are the exact same thing. Ohms law is ohms law.

I gotta agree with Mutant here. Fortunately, V and W aren't the same thing or the currently-being-tested chip on my desk would be on fire. It's getting 5 V and 0.15 watts. Do that the other way around and it simply won't work--and might do some interesting things at that amperage, even with the voltage so low. V and W are not interchangeable.

Altering V is non-linear since W = V^2 / R. Altering W changes V in a non-linear fashion, but changes power applied to the atty in linear fashion as the casual user would expect.

While they're related, they're not the same thing.

There are a thousand factors involved in heating and cooling anything. Just those I asked questions about should make a pretty solid point about the fact that the bizarre hype about VW is just bizarre hype.

VV and VW are the same thing. Ohms law does not change because of marketing.

Well, except that I can wing wattage calculations in my head without a second thought. If it's even necessary since the wattage is linear. Interrelating the voltage with the resistance I'm using to determine wattage takes me a moment.

If that's a moment I don't have, that's a problem. If I change atomizers in the middle and forget to change voltage, that's a problem.

Simplicity of design can't be underestimated. Anything that doesn't make the average user think too much is an advantage, it allows in another chance for user error. While not potentially fatal or even all that harmful in this case, that's one of the reasons these things are carefully considered on the design of many tools.

Wattage is simply easier to understand for the casual user than voltage is, and far easier to work with. Parabolic equations are difficult for most people to solve in their heads, therefore you don't make them try.

 

[Myrany]

On the VV VW debate.

FOr me (and only me) I prefer VW. I understand you get to the same place with either. I use a limited range of coil ohms, I use flavors that all pretty much prefer a Certain wattage. For me PERSONALLY I prefer the set and forget of VW on my vamo. Grab a topper screw it on and vape a nice vape every time with no adjustment. This works for me.

People that vape in a wide range of power levels VV/VW becomes much more of 6 of one half a dozen the other. They are fiddling for maximum vape either way.

 

[MorpheusPA]

Going back and forth on forums is not my thing. I'm hear to learn and try to be as helpful as I can in as nice a way possible. You have your opinion and I have mine. Provari fanboi...weird....lol. The hate from those that don't have one is just as weird. Hope you have a good evening.

And the best of days to you too.

 

[six]

six: To vary the volts you must vary the watts and vice versa, so in that sense they're the same - different sticks to pull to adjust the same equation.

It's always going to be complicated, but watts is a better approximation of the desired effect ('vape output') than volts, simply because watts is a function of resistance.

I've got juices that I know I like at roughly a certain number of watts, to some degree regardless of the build. Having the option of setting via watts makes that easier. An intelligent device which varied the voltage as resistance changed during firing would be more consistent too, though I don't know how often VW devices sample the resistance and adjust.

It's not a night and day difference, but it is legitimately different, and to many people an improvement.

I don't know how to make this more clear, and there really is nothing complicated about it. Ohms law is ohms law. All portions of the pie chart are equal. That's how he proved his law. When resistance is static, to change power, you change volts. When resistance is fixed, if you change volts, you change power. They are equal. It is the exact same thing. Marketing does not disprove ohms law.

I already addressed the sampling of minute resistance changes and adjustment - It is marketing. Do what I said before. Pop the bridge out of any old atty you have lying about. Put it on any old PV you have lying about no matter fixed, regulated, unregulated or whatever. Push the button and look at the coil. Did it instantly become red? No. It took some time. Was it at maximum temperature when it became red? Nope. It was not. Let off the button. Did it instantly quit glowing? No. It did not. Did it instantly become ambient temperature? Nope - not that either. Repeat with juice or anything else stealing heat from the coil and those facts become even more pronounced.

Marketing does not disprove ohms law. Ohms law is proven and can not be disproven. - Further, I'm baffled how it is those who are convinced that VW is different than VV also seem to forget the important part is the first V = variable. Variable is the important part. Otherwise, fixed regulators would have won the day and we wouldn't have all of these wonderfully functional and fancy devices.