TC beyond Ni200: Nickel Purity, Dicodes; Ti, SS, Resistherm NiFe30; Coefficient of Resistance

[soulseek]

As a dani v2 owner, can I ask you one thing?

As I posted a few messages back, I got the impression that the chip doesn't have on-board temperature sensor so that it assumes resistance calibration is done at 20 °C, and if that's not the case you have to compensate for the delta from 20 °C in the max temp you set for vaping.
Do you have the same understanding from reading the manuals and/or you have any further insight about that?
That's really the only thing (apart from the tube-ness thing) that bugs me and really makes little sense given the apparent high level technology they've used.
I tried to ask dicodes directly, but got no answer after 3 days, so I'm losing hope in an official statement...

Oh, and what's then the correct TCR to use for Titanium? I have the manual stating 320, is that already after your suggestion?

That's the impression I got as well, which is why I don't plan on using this device as my permanent device.

As for the TCR, 320 is for the wire they provided/suggest, which is correct. 350 is the correct value for Titanium grade 1, which is what I will be using henceforth when it arrives on Monday.

 

[TheBloke]

@ndb70 and @soulseek - you guys have samples of the Resistherm wire??

What is it like? Please post your thoughts I won't have mine until mid next week most likely.

Oh and @soulseek cool you're getting into Ti, did you order from Zivipf? I see you're in the UK: I don't know if you saw on the Titanium thread but in a week or so Crazy Wire (wireandstuff.co.uk) will have Titanium Grade 1 wire for sale at vaping gauges. I contacted them a week ago to let them know that Titanium was becoming a big thing with specific support from Dicodes and Joyetech etc, including Joyetech coil heads, so they reversed their decision not to stock it and it'll be here fairly soon.

I imagine you've used their site before for Kanthal? Or if not you may well have used their wire anyway as most vaping companies in the UK (Stealth Vape being on exception) buy and re-sell their wire.

 

[soulseek]

@ndb70 and @soulseek - you guys have samples of the Resistherm wire??

What is it like? Please post your thoughts I won't have mine until mid next week most likely.

Oh and @soulseek cool you're getting into Ti, did you order from Zivipf? I see you're in the UK: I don't know if you saw on the Titanium thread but in a week or so Crazy Wire (wireandstuff.co.uk) will have Titanium Grade 1 wire for sale at vaping gauges. I contacted them a week ago to let them know that Titanium was becoming a big thing with specific support from Dicodes and Joyetech etc, including Joyetech coil heads, so they reversed their decision not to stock it and it'll be here fairly soon.

I imagine you've used their site before for Kanthal? Or if not you may well have used their wire anyway as most vaping companies in the UK (Stealth Vape being on exception) buy and re-sell their wire.

I'm not currently in the UK but I travel there very often, I was there last week. I've bought many times from the previously.

The resistherm wire is ok but it only comes in one gauge which is too thin for my liking. In terms of flavour I can't say since I don't have any Ti yet to compare and I can't compare it to kanthal, since I'm using it in my dicodes which is temperature controlled and mic different to using a regular vw device.

 

[TheBloke]

OK thanks.

How does it handle compared to Ni200 and what you remember of Kanthal? Easy to coil/holds its shape, or springy? Strong like most Kanthal, or breaks easily like some Ni200?

 

[TheBloke]

Someone in another thread asked about NiChrome - for the record this wire is not usable with Nickel Purity or any other (current) TCR modification. Its TCR is 0.00011 which is more than 8 times lower than Stainless Steel which is already at the very bottom of the usable TCR scale in current TCR adjusting mods.

 

[soulseek]

OK thanks.

How does it handle compared to Ni200 and what you remember of Kanthal? Easy to coil/holds its shape, or springy? Strong like most Kanthal, or breaks easily like some Ni200?

I've never used Ni200. I think the Resistherm handles well compared to Kanthal; a bit springy but doesn't break easily. But then again all these features also depend on the thickness of the wire and as you know this comes only in 1 size.

 

[dr g]

What do you mean? The poor naming of the feature?

Ridiculous concept. Ni200 was specced because it is pure to within a fraction of a percent. That means it will be predictable to a finer degree than the temperature can be controlled.

The idea that you would have to adjust for "poor quality Ni200" ... is facepalm-worthy.

 

[TheBloke]

Ridiculous concept. Ni200 was specced because it is pure to within a fraction of a percent. That means it will be predictable to a finer degree than the temperature can be controlled.

The idea that you would have to adjust for "poor quality Ni200" ... is facepalm-worthy.

It's called Nickel purity not Ni200 purity. There are Chinese nickel wires that have lower percentage - I don't know if they're incorrectly branded Ni200 when they don't meet spec, or if they're just called 'nickel' and are of low purity. Either way, they exist, and this feature allows them to be used much better.

You may not need to adjust for poor quality Nickel, but clearly other users do. Hence the feature.

But all that's the least important part of this amazing feature. What's really incredible about it is that it's not just an adjustment around the possible purities of nickel, but rather a modification across the entire usable Temperature Coefficient of Resistance range.

It thus allows effective vaping of a wide range of other wires such as Titanium, Stainless Steel, Resistherm and twisted Ni200/Kanthal. And that is incredible, and incredibly useful; and doubly so as the only other mods that have this feature sell for $150-$200+ and the SXK mods with it in sell for $50+.

There's something facepalm-worthy here and it ain't these features

 

[ndb70]

A bit late, but here are my impressions after a bit of vaping on the dicodes wire.
It's the same coil I used for the water test i posted a couple of days ago, rewicked of course (using rayon) and still in my squape.
I think I can't sense any specific wire taste, but hey, I can't with nickel either (and kanthal I've never really used it that much as I begun vaping in last November and immediately jumped on the TC wagon).
I have a general impression of a kind of muted flavor, but that could be the build in general, I don't think it's the wire.
Also, I had to set the temperature quite high for my standards (around 225-230 °C, i.e. 437-446 °F), while I'm normally vaping my K4s at about 205 °C, but that might well be just that _now_ the reading is more reliable, while K4s with their static resistance cause that appearing-low-vaping temperature effect...
I'll have to do more experimenting to check if the muted flavor can be caused by the wire or not, but as for now I can only say it's quite easy to work with (a bit better than ni200 of the same size) and allows for easier higher ohms.
If it's better or not that Ti, I honestly don't know as I've to try Ti yet, but would like to hear from anyone who has tried both.

 

[TheBloke]

I've never used Ni200. I think the Resistherm handles well compared to Kanthal; a bit springy but doesn't break easily. But then again all these features also depend on the thickness of the wire and as you know this comes only in 1 size.

OK that's good to hear - if it handles like Kanthal that means it's way better than Ni200. But yeah having only 29G available is a shame, and it doesn't look likely that they will get anything thicker any time soon. However I plan to try twisting mine and see how that goes.


@TheotherSteveS when will your Dicodes arrive??

 

[TheBloke]

A bit late, but here are my impressions after a bit of vaping on the dicodes wire.
It's the same coil I used for the water test i posted a couple of days ago, rewicked of course (using rayon) and still in my squape.
I think I can't sense any specific wire taste, but hey, I can't with nickel either (and kanthal I've never really used it that much as I begun vaping in last November and immediately jumped on the TC wagon).
I have a general impression of a kind of muted flavor, but that could be the build in general, I don't think it's the wire.
Also, I had to set the temperature quite high for my standards (around 225-230 °C, i.e. 437-446 °F), while I'm normally vaping my K4s at about 205 °C, but that might well be just that _now_ the reading is more reliable, while K4s with their static resistance cause that appearing-low-vaping temperature effect...
I'll have to do more experimenting to check if the muted flavor can be caused by the wire or not, but as for now I can only say it's quite easy to work with (a bit better than ni200 of the same size) and allows for easier higher ohms.
If it's better or not that Ti, I honestly don't know as I've to try Ti yet, but would like to hear from anyone who has tried both.

OK thanks very much. My wire will be here in a couple of days I guess so I will try and let you know then!

 

[TheotherSteveS]

what is the ohms/meter of the dicodes wire (29g right??)

 

[TheotherSteveS]

OK that's good to hear - if it handles like Kanthal that means it's way better than Ni200. But yeah having only 29G available is a shame, and it doesn't look likely that they will get anything thicker any time soon. However I plan to try twisting mine and see how that goes.


@TheotherSteveS when will your Dicodes arrive??

Not sure. Got the tracking number yesterday but noi update so far. I hope wednesday but it could be later I guess...It will take me that long to understand the manual...

 

[TheBloke]

Not sure. Got the tracking number yesterday but noi update so far. I hope wednesday but it could be later I guess...It will take me that long to understand the manual...

Wow as soon as Wednesday you think? That'd be cool. Is it coming DHL or similar? My wire is coming from Germany DHL but it's not moving very fast. As of Saturday it was in Koln, forwarded for export, and no change since then. It'll come locally via ParcelForce

what is the ohms/meter of the dicodes wire (29g right??)

Yes 29G only, 5.5Ω/m

 

[dr g]

It's called Nickel purity not Ni200 purity.

As you said:

The stated purpose of Nickel Purity is to allow users who have lower quality Ni200 wire - such as is commonly found in China - to better use TC.

The reason for specifying nearly-pure metal is that for alloys such as kanthal, the metallurgical formulas have wider variance ranges than the accuracy of even Evolv TC, and thus do not have consistent coefficients.

You may not need to adjust for poor quality Nickel, but clearly other users do. Hence the feature.

Easy fix, don't use substandard Chinese Ni200. The cost difference is so trivial that anyone that would do it does, in fact, deserve a facepalm.

What this really is, is a bodge for slack in Chinese quality.

 

[druckle]

As you said:




What this really is, is a bodge for slack in Chinese quality.

Maybe....but it's hella useful for titanium wire and that's the way I rock.

 

[TheBloke]

What this really is, is a bodge for slack in Chinese quality.

No, what this is is a feature that allows us to use various wires for TC vaping. Lower quality Nickel, for those who have it - people do exist outside the USA and Europe, I'm sorry to have to break it to you this way - but more importantly Stainless Steel, Titanium, Resistherm and any others pioneered in the future.

It's a feature found in $200 Dicodes German mods, and $50 Chinese mods.

If you find no need for it, don't use it. Others will, and they will benefit greatly from it. I am right now on my first NP mod, and will be ordering my second shortly. I'm quite fine with Chinese quality, in fact I know it to be superb.

I have to say I find it sad that you have such a negative view - you'd rather features didn't exist if you personally don't want to use them. I saw you post the same in the Innokin thread - because TC with Kanthal sure is a facepalm, who'd ever want that? Oh I guess it can't possibly work; until it does. I suppose @Vooper was right.

Thankfully you're in the minority, which is why we have the progress we do have. If everyone felt the same way, we wouldn't have TC ("what? I don't need a mod to tell me when I'm low on juice! Facepalm!") we wouldn't have regulated ("what? I know how to get the right battery voltages thank you very much! Facepalm!) hell, we wouldn't have vaping ("I can quit smoking without any ridiculous red hot coils and vapourised liquids thank you! FACEPALM!")

Anyway, you use what you you want to use as will we.

 

[dr g]

No, what this is is a feature that allows us to use various wires for TC vaping. Lower quality Nickel, for those who have it - people do exist outside the USA and Europe, I'm sorry to have to break it to you this way - but more importantly Stainless Steel, Titanium, Resistherm and any others pioneered in the future.

You do understand that "stainless steel" covers a huge range of alloys, right? That's why it was not specified. This will be guesswork at best.

Yes it could be a used for what you state but the reason for its creation is NOT what you claim and is NOT laudable. It's like when a board is riddled with engineering errors and just happens to work, you don't praise that.

I have to say I find it sad that you have such a negative view - you'd rather features didn't exist if you personally don't want to use them. I saw you post the same in the Innokin thread - because TC with Kanthal sure is a facepalm, who'd ever want that?

It wasn't about Kanthal, although getting away from kanthal is a good thing. It's not a good TC wire. The mentality that thinks it's such a great thing is the anti-progress mindset that just can't imagine not using kanthal.

The facepalm there is that Innokin had the pre-eminent temperature control boardmaker as a partner and they likely just shredded that partnership with this move.

 

[druckle]

It all boils down to
"If Evolv didn't do it ....it shouldn't be done"

 

[dr g]

It all boils down to
"If Evolv didn't do it ....it shouldn't be done"

Actually what it boils down to is that they have engineered TC the most correctly so far, which makes sense since they had no one to copy. A lot of what has come since, this included, is flawed or based on flaws.