Titanium wire, vaping and safety

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awsum140

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I'm really hoping Ti doesn't impart that taste. It just isn't very pleasant at all with a long break-in period. I just checked on my Ti shipment and it should be here tomorrow. I was going to re-coil my Ni200 setup tomorrow but will hold off an do it with Ti instead.

I look at TC as sort of an insurance policy and maintenance reducer. It makes up for a bad wick or not wicking quite fast enough. I'm still working on the coil diameter and wicking in the Fogger V6 so TC keeps me from burning anything in that learning curve. Pretty handy!
 
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soulseek

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Regarding contact and non contact coils. I've made only contact coils since I received my Ti and it felt like performance was flaky, even though I always pulsed them to the point were they glowed before wicking. Today I made a non-contact coil and it seems like it's working way more reliable. Gonna recoil my tank and other dripper and see if I get the same results.
 

Quantum Mech

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Regarding contact and non contact coils. I've made only contact coils since I received my Ti and it felt like performance was flaky, even though I always pulsed them to the point were they glowed before wicking. Today I made a non-contact coil and it seems like it's working way more reliable. Gonna recoil my tank and other dripper and see if I get the same results.

Nice one, but should not be glowing Ti mate

See my picture on the previous page of the thick grey oxide that forms & breaks away quite easily

It can be seen where I had hot legs & the broken off flakes can be seen to the left of the picture just laying on the build deck

Pulsing till gold or through to blue is good enough & that layer does not seem to break away like the thicker grey coating that forms at higher temps
 

soulseek

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Nice one, but should not be glowing Ti mate

See my picture on the previous page of the thick grey oxide that forms & breaks away quite easily

It can be seen where I had hot legs & the broken off flakes can be seen to the left of the picture just laying on the build deck

Pulsing till gold or through to blue is good enough & that layer does not seem to break away like the thicker grey coating that forms at higher temps

I've been using some an alloy Ti for more than 6 months now; I'm pretty aware of what I should be doing. My point was that a microcoil with no shorts still seems to be working inconsistently.
 

Quantum Mech

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I've been using some an alloy Ti for more than 6 months now; I'm pretty aware of what I should be doing. My point was that a microcoil with no shorts still seems to be working inconsistently.

Whats the crack with glowing the coils then with the mixed wire you have

Does it not form a coating

All the posts have read have been on Grade 1 not mixed metals

6 months of flaky performance, glad you found a better vape
 

TheBloke

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Whats the crack with glowing the coils then with the mixed wire you have

Does it not form a coating

All the posts have read have been on Grade 1 not mixed metals

6 months of flaky performance, glad you found a better vape

Yeah what alloy is this? If you can make the coils glow without destroying the wire that sounds interesting.
 
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Quantum Mech

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i torched some the other day and Im sure the shininess went away, replaced by a dull appearance but quite blue - very pretty!

Not 100% on this yet as still monitoring it

But have been torching till gold some coils & a bit more till blue on others

Running them in my dripper & finding the gold stays cleaner than the blue

Not sure if the colour is deceiving or the gold coating is more resilient to caking up with juice

Anyone else noticed this
 

druckle

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Hey Tom: I'm being lazy....I just got my SKX Vapor Flask from the mailbox and I'm letting it cool off. It's 109F(42.8C) outside my house today and I think it's reasonable to cool the chips before going further. I actually have read over the little instruction paper but now I'm thinking about what I should set the "purity" for with Grade 1 Ti.

I seem to remember you saying 42 was your sweet spot. Is that correct? Any other hints for a good first time experience?

Duane
 

tchavei

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Ti alloy? Sounds like GG's mystery titanium? That one doesn't form any TiO2 but I was warned about titanium beta alloys and my spool is well hidden from sight as I'm not planning to use it ever again.

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Tony

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soulseek

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Whats the crack with glowing the coils then with the mixed wire you have

Does it not form a coating

All the posts have read have been on Grade 1 not mixed metals

6 months of flaky performance, glad you found a better vape

No, I've been using non contact coils for the last 6 months. The point of using a microcoil was because other people were reporting that it was working with tc modes and since it's easier to build I thought I would give it a try.
 
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druckle

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42c :thumb: .... that's Mankini weather ;)
Yeah I know...but this is the bloody desert and it's June. The sad part is that it was cool and rainy two days ago. I've lived here over 20 years and I have never before seen it rain in JUNE. This is PAYBACK!

Thanks for the info. Gonna give it a try now and see how it compares.

Duane
 
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TheBloke

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Hey Tom: I'm being lazy....I just got my SKX Vapor Flask from the mailbox and I'm letting it cool off. It's 109F(42.8C) outside my house today and I think it's reasonable to cool the chips before going further. I actually have read over the little instruction paper but now I'm thinking about what I should set the "purity" for with Grade 1 Ti.

I seem to remember you saying 42 was your sweet spot. Is that correct? Any other hints for a good first time experience?

Duane

I found 42 to work pretty well, but that was before I knew about the chronic low resistance and before I made the calc. I haven't been back to Ti since I made it, but am just about to make a new coil tonight.

Use The Calc, Luke (Duane)! :)

Nickel Purity / Static Resistance calculator

  • Target Temperature: Put in whatever figure you want to limit to, with an F or C suffix, eg 440F
  • Wire Type: Select Titanium
  • Starting Temp: Adjust upwards from 20°C if necessary
  • SXK Resistance: Put in the resistance it shows on screen
  • Real Resistance: put in your estimation of the real resistance of the wire
    • to get the real resistance, measure the build (cold) on one or two other devices you trust: SX Mini M is a good one, using the Set Resistance.
    • Then consider how much Static Resistance to remove.
      • If it's an RDA, 0.01Ω is likely.
      • If it's a "big metal" RTA, 0.02Ω or 0.03Ω.
    • Subtract the SR from the resistance read on the 'good' device and that's your Real Ω value.
  • At the bottom it will tell you the Best Resistivity and below that, the SXK Nickel Purity value to use (which is just the last two digits of the Resistivity.)
Start with that NP value, and tune to taste - I'm often finding I want to then tune it down a bit lower than the calc says (ie it doesn't seem to limit temp enough) perhaps because SR is higher than I'm predicting, perhaps because the 'real resistance' value is not super accurate anyway (my other mods not measuring it right either, perhaps too high), or perhaps because there's more to it than the plain calculation done by the calc.

But I'd start from the calc value and tune from there, rather than an arbitrary number. Once you've got more of a feel for what numbers vape like, you will probably find a good number to use in future without going to the calc each time.

With Resistherm the calc has been telling me to use about 42 (up from 32 that it should be) but I've often ended up around 38-39.

It's all a bit of a guestimation, because there's now two ways to tune - where before we might have got a dry hit and then lowered the target temp, we could now also just lower the NP. Which is 'right' is up for discussion - at least without accurately measuring the real coil temp. But certainly there's some cases where I'd say lowering NP is better, eg where a target temp of 500°F was being used when clearly the coil wasn't at 500°F, and ditto going up from ~300°F when it was obviously higher - both cases where the atty/coil resistance is affecting things. It'd be nice to think we could use the target temp we actually want the coil to be, even if that means adjusting another number to compensate - at least I think so, others may say it's same diff either way :)

Just play about and find what works well, but start with the calc first as it'll account for the chronic low resistance and the more data we get on 'right' settings the more we'll understand about how low the SXK really is in practice - ie how much SR we're actually finding in real life situations.
 
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druckle

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I found 42 to work pretty well, but that was before I knew about the chronic low resistance and before I made the calc. I haven't been back to Ti since I made it, but am just about to make a new coil tonight.

Use The Calc, Luke (Duane)! :)

Nickel Purity / Static Resistance calculator

  • Target Temperature: Put in whatever figure you want to limit to, with an F or C suffix, eg 440F
  • Wire Type: Select Titanium
  • Starting Temp: Adjust upwards from 20°C if necessary
  • SXK Resistance: Put in the resistance it shows on screen
  • Real Resistance: put in your estimation of the real resistance of the wire
    • to get the real resistance, measure the build (cold) on one or two other devices you trust: SX Mini M is a good one, using the Set Resistance.
    • Then consider how much Static Resistance to remove.
      • If it's an RDA, 0.01Ω is likely.
      • If it's a "big metal" RTA, 0.02Ω or 0.03Ω.
    • Subtract the SR from the resistance read on the 'good' device.
  • At the bottom it will tell you the Best Resistivity and below that, the SXK Nickel Purity value to use.
Start with that NP value, and tune to taste - I'm often finding I want to then tune it down a bit lower than the calc says (ie it doesn't seem to limit temp enough) perhaps because SR is higher than I'm predicting, perhaps because the 'real resistance' value is not super accurate anyway (my other mods not measuring it right either, perhaps too high), or perhaps because there's more to it than the plain calculation done by the calc.

But I'd start from the calc value and tune from there, rather than an arbitrary number. Once you've got more of a feel for what numbers vape like, you will probably find a good number to use in future without going to the calc each time.

With Resistherm the calc has been telling me to use about 42 (up from 32 that it should be) but I've often ended up around 38-39.

It's all a bit of a guestimation, because there's now two ways to tune - where before we might have got a dry hit and then lowered the target temp, we could now also just lower the NP. Just play about and find what works well, but start with the calc first as it'll account for the chronic low resistance and the more data we get on 'right' settings the more we'll understand about how low the SXK really is in practice - ie how much SR we're actually finding in real life situations.
OK....I deserve being chastied! I will go do the sheet! :)

This device looks like a pretty good buy to me. 1/5 the price of a original VF.....with "purity"....the only thing I've found that I don't like is I had a hard time finding a pair of batteries in my collection short enough to make the battery covers go on decently. It seems like they put Samson springs in there. The other difference is that the surface looks sand blasted but that doesn't bother me. All in all so far a hell of a bargain I'd say.

Duane
 
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TheBloke

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Yup the prices are awesome, an amazing bargain.

Yeah I found issues with the batteries at first. I've only used Samsung 25Rs in mine (which are you using?) but whereas in my Waidea Flask they dropped right in with loads of room to spare, with the SXK I had to really push the caps down hard while turning to get it to bite on the thread. It would then screw down tight (but the caps never line up, sadly) but it took some effort - I generally used a screwdriver rather than coin, and couldn't do any part of it with my fingers.

The good news is that it loosens up over time. I can now push down the cap with my thumb while giving it a half-turn at the same time and grab the thread every time. So those springs do loosen.

Which flask do you have, black or silver? Be aware that you may have grounding issues - there's been lots of discussion on the VF Clone thread, and you might want to scroll through the last 10 pages. If you have silver then more likely than not you'll be OK, though there has been one report of problems. If the black, more likely than not you'll have problems.

The fix is to remove the top plate, and then sand down the underside of the top plate and the top of the flask on the "mating area" - ie the area where those two touch. Sand it down or dremel it down, then clean the area thoroughly (ideally with IPA). Ditto clean the battery threads thoroughly, with something abrasive and then IPA. That black coating affects the conductivity, often leading to batteries draining unevenly in the case of the threads, and grounding issues in the case of the top plate.

Symptoms include shutting down randomly, saying Low Battery when it's clearly not, or sending out less power than it says it is. In the most serious case people have had it reading 0.00Ω and saying Low Res whenever it tries to fire, but clearly yours isn't doing that.

You may not need to do any of that right now if you have the Silver, but look out for the symptoms. I had none of those problems with my Batch1 Silver, but @dwcraig1 got a Batch2 silver and he had the low-watts issue which resolved after sanding.
 

druckle

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Yup the prices are awesome, an amazing bargain.

Yeah I found issues with the batteries at first. I've only used Samsung 25Rs in mine (which are you using?) but whereas in my Waidea Flask they dropped right in with loads of room to spare, with the SXK I had to really push the caps down hard while turning to get it to bite on the thread. It would then screw down tight (but the caps never line up, sadly) but it took some effort - I generally used a screwdriver rather than coin, and couldn't do any part of it with my fingers.

The good news is that it loosens up over time. I can now push down the cap with my thumb while giving it a half-turn at the same time and grab the thread every time. So those springs do loosen.

Which flask do you have, black or silver? Be aware that you may have grounding issues - there's been lots of discussion on the VF Clone thread, and you might want to scroll through the last 10 pages. If you have silver then more likely than not you'll be OK, though there has been one report of problems. If the black, more likely than not you'll have problems.

The fix is to remove the top plate, and then sand down the underside of the top plate and the top of the flask on the "mating area" - ie the area where those two touch. Sand it down or dremel it down, then clean the area thoroughly (ideally with IPA). Ditto clean the battery threads thoroughly, with something abrasive and then IPA. That black coating affects the conductivity, often leading to batteries draining unevenly in the case of the threads, and grounding issues in the case of the top plate.

Symptoms include shutting down randomly, saying Low Battery when it's clearly not, or sending out less power than it says it is. In the most serious case people have had it reading 0.00Ω and saying Low Res whenever it tries to fire, but clearly yours isn't doing that.

You may not need to do any of that right now if you have the Silver, but look out for the symptoms. I had none of those problems with my Batch1 Silver, but @dwcraig1 got a Batch2 silver and he had the low-watts issue which resolved after sanding.
I'm using LG he2 batteries. I hope it does loosen up a little with time. I said a few choice words as I was going through my battery stash looking for the shortest pair.

I have the silver one and so far so good. I did the spread sheet and it told me to use purity setting 45...but I tried it at 42 and it seemed pretty good. I'll leave it there for now and see how it compares after a while.

One thing I definitely will say....I like it better than the second Vapor Flask Squonk replacement I also got today. The first one lasted 2 days before I got totally Evolved. This is the replacement from Vapor Flask. It WILL NOT STAY IN TEMP CONTROLLED MODE NO MATTER WHAT I DO. If I put the same atty on an SX mini M class it works perfectly but of course no squonking. Ditto for the SKX.


I have absolutely had it with Evolv. I HAVE HAD 3 OF THEIR DEVICES AND EVERYONE HAS HAD BIG TIME PROBLEMS AND HAD TO BE RETURNED.

I hope the SKX hangs in there better than all original Evolv's have for me. Since it sort of seems to be based on Evolv I have no idea what will happen but at least it's not $300 down the drain. It could be that Chinese clone manufacturing is vastly superior to original American toilet sludge. I hope so.

Enough

The sad thing for me is that I really want a temperature controlled squonk box. The only SX squonker I know of available right now would cost me $550 and 6 weeks minimum wait time. Cloudmaker Tech will have one sometime but for now I'll have to put away the bottom feeder atomizers I've acquired and just wait. I am ANGRY...but it will get better. :)

Sorry for venting.

Duane
 

tchavei

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I'm using LG he2 batteries. I hope it does loosen up a little with time. I said a few choice words as I was going through my battery stash looking for the shortest pair.

I have the silver one and so far so good. I did the spread sheet and it told me to use purity setting 45...but I tried it at 42 and it seemed pretty good. I'll leave it there for now and see how it compares after a while.

One thing I definitely will say....I like it better than the second Vapor Flask Squonk replacement I also got today. The first one lasted 2 days before I got totally Evolved. This is the replacement from Vapor Flask. It WILL NOT STAY IN TEMP CONTROLLED MODE NO MATTER WHAT I DO. If I put the same atty on an SX mini M class it works perfectly but of course no squonking. Ditto for the SKX.


I have absolutely had it with Evolv. I HAVE HAD 3 OF THEIR DEVICES AND EVERYONE HAS HAD BIG TIME PROBLEMS AND HAD TO BE RETURNED.

I hope the SKX hangs in there better than all original Evolv's have for me. Since it sort of seems to be based on Evolv I have no idea what will happen but at least it's not $300 down the drain. It could be that Chinese clone manufacturing is vastly superior to original American toilet sludge. I hope so.

Enough

The sad thing for me is that I really want a temperature controlled squonk box. The only SX squonker I know of available right now would cost me $550 and 6 weeks minimum wait time. Cloudmaker Tech will have one sometime but for now I'll have to put away the bottom feeder atomizers I've acquired and just wait. I am ANGRY...but it will get better. :)

Sorry for venting.

Duane
It's all your fault man. Evolv boards don't glitch.















:D

Regards
Tony

Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
 

druckle

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I haven't thought through all the issues you guys have been addressing very well but I'm curious ...
Would doing the water test and adjusting the "purity setting" on the SKX to achieve 100C indicated temperature make any sense as a check on things? Probably not but I need edumacated!

Duane
 
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