Titanium wire, vaping and safety
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Well some folks say Ni200 works as a contact coil and some feel it isn't reliable. My personal experience is that Ni 200 doesn't work well as a contact coil. I would say that Alloy 120 will work the same as Nickel 200. It's your choice whether it works well or doesn't.
What's the real benefit of a contact coil now days other than it's a little more compact? I make contact coils and then insert a razor blade between each wrap to and give it a very slight twist to make a little gap. The length of the coil increases but very little, the coil doesn't gunk up as much and the coil is reliable with respect to resistance no matter what wire I'm using. I know lots of folks prefer contact coils but I personally don't understand why.
Duane
Well some folks say Ni200 works as a contact coil and some feel it isn't reliable. My personal experience is that Ni 200 doesn't work well as a contact coil. I would say that Alloy 120 will work the same as Nickel 200. It's your choice whether it works well or doesn't.
What's the real benefit of a contact coil now days other than it's a little more compact? I make contact coils and then insert a razor blade between each wrap to and give it a very slight twist to make a little gap. The length of the coil increases but very little, the coil doesn't gunk up as much and the coil is reliable with respect to resistance no matter what wire I'm using. I know lots of folks prefer contact coils but I personally don't understand why.
Duane
I absolutely agree. I think spaced coils are superior to be honest but always end up pinching etc on the rare occasion i use kanthal these days. Pure habit really!
Is there a benefit for a contact coil with kanthal? The last time I made a kanthal coil I made it as my same old "mini-spaced" coil and it worked fine.
Duane
In my experience, nickel is garbage for contact coils. They oxidize like crazy and don't last very long. I wrap mine around a 6-32 machine screw, mount the legs, and unscrew the screw. Perfect coil every time.
My gennies get 32g twisted nickel and I do not use the perfect coil method for them. I find it much easier to just hand wrap around the mesh after it's been seated.
My cloud chasers get stainless steel contact coils. Because wrapping steel with any sort of precision is super hard... So I just push them together and call it a day.
My gennies get 32g twisted nickel and I do not use the perfect coil method for them. I find it much easier to just hand wrap around the mesh after it's been seated.
My cloud chasers get stainless steel contact coils. Because wrapping steel with any sort of precision is super hard... So I just push them together and call it a day.
Since I don't post in the DYG 200 thread, I just wanted to say:
Duckle: in 2-3 month of 24/7 Ti use on a DNA 40, I never ever experienced a kick out of TC. My resistances are between 0.28 and 0.36
Bloke: I saved your g post for posterity. I'm going to print it and frame it.
Regarding your comment about Evolv, they already know... For months.
Cheers and long live Ti and it's slow TCR, whatever that is.
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Duckle: in 2-3 month of 24/7 Ti use on a DNA 40, I never ever experienced a kick out of TC. My resistances are between 0.28 and 0.36
Bloke: I saved your g post for posterity. I'm going to print it and frame it.
Regarding your comment about Evolv, they already know... For months.
Cheers and long live Ti and it's slow TCR, whatever that is.
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Since I don't post in the DYG 200 thread, I just wanted to say:
Duckle: in 2-3 month of 24/7 Ti use on a DNA 40, I never ever experienced a kick out of TC. My resistances are between 0.28 and 0.36
Bloke: I saved your g post for posterity. I'm going to print it and frame it.
Regarding your comment about Evolv, they already know... For months.
Cheers and long live Ti and it's slow TCR, whatever that is.
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Tony:
I've learned to use bigger Ti wire and fewer wraps. That's solved the problem of being kicked out of TC (mostly). I still have a problem with a vapor flask Squonk now and then getting it to recognize that I need TC mode but that's the fault of the absolutely "wonderful" decision of Vapor Flask to quit masking the battery cap threads in their aluminum body when they do their anodizing. Every time it happens i go scrape the threads a little more and the problem goes away for a while. My latest hope is a silver contact goo which costs way too much but keeps me from googling for new swear words.
Duane
Agreed, I see no benefit in using contact coils accept where space is a limitation or battery mah is limited as contact coils do fire faster due to turn to turn proximity. The major downside to contact coils however has always been reduced wick and coil longivity imo. The intense heat created in the center of a contact coil seems to break down organic wicking medias faster and the interspacial voids created during the formation of alumina on the surface of kanthal seem to clog to the point that even aggressive dry burns will not clear them. Contact coils are so 2014....... G1Ti is new to me. I'm enjoying my Evic VT60 with a Ti build now. Time will tell if Ti is the new Ni.Well some folks say Ni200 works as a contact coil and some feel it isn't reliable. My personal experience is that Ni 200 doesn't work well as a contact coil. I would say that Alloy 120 will work the same as Nickel 200. It's your choice whether it works well or doesn't.
What's the real benefit of a contact coil now days other than it's a little more compact? I make contact coils and then insert a razor blade between each wrap to and give it a very slight twist to make a little gap. The length of the coil increases but very little, the coil doesn't gunk up as much and the coil is reliable with respect to resistance no matter what wire I'm using. I know lots of folks prefer contact coils but I personally don't understand why.
Duane
Yeah. Poor ground will kick you out if TC
Tested that when I was still using nickel and a sub par negative connection to my 18650
I'm not liking my evic VT today btw.
After 48 hours of having the same atty on, it finally refined down to 0.34 but bye bye vapor. I have to crank it to 280C to get a moderate cold vape... Ridiculous. I'm .......
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Tested that when I was still using nickel and a sub par negative connection to my 18650
I'm not liking my evic VT today btw.
After 48 hours of having the same atty on, it finally refined down to 0.34 but bye bye vapor. I have to crank it to 280C to get a moderate cold vape... Ridiculous. I'm .......
Regards
Tony
Sent from my keyboard through my phone or something like that.
Tony
Yeah...we have hands and brains. When they get coordinated they usually beat 0's and 1's in making vaping decisions for us.
Duane
Hello! Need some help from those more knowledgeable than I, please. I bought some .5 mm grade 1 ti wire. I put it on a troll (6wraps, .16 ohm) on an IPV4 at 350F and 50 joules. I keep getting lung irritation, almost like I am smoking. Am I supposed to clean the Ti with something before making my coil? I heated it to a decent orange, got quite a bit of nasty smoke off it then, but that stopped when the coils started really heating up, kind of like my kanthal. I didn't try to max it out, I have read most of this very long thread and know better than that, but I am still dying over here. Any suggestions?
I'm no expert, but a few suggestions.
Wipe it with isopropyl then PGA, possibly using an abrasive like Scotch Brite.
Do not heat it to orange. Only heat enough to produce a gold or yellow sheen on the wire. At the temperature needed for orange you're getting to the point of too much oxide on it which, could, produce some irritation and products you really don't want to inhale on a regular basis.
Wipe it with isopropyl then PGA, possibly using an abrasive like Scotch Brite.
Do not heat it to orange. Only heat enough to produce a gold or yellow sheen on the wire. At the temperature needed for orange you're getting to the point of too much oxide on it which, could, produce some irritation and products you really don't want to inhale on a regular basis.
Firstly, yes always clean your wire - we know for sure of some very dirty Titanium from Zivipf in Germany. Don't know where you got yours, but almost all Ti on the market at the moment is not for vapers and isn't pre-cleaned. You should always clean any wire first anyway, but especially for Titanium.
Secondly: on an IPV4 you want less than 350°F almost certainly - more like 250 - 290°F.
Thirdly: when you say heated it to orange, do you mean glowing orange? If so, never heat a Titanium coil until it glows. If you want to pre-pulse it (to make it easier to coil), do so until it turns first yellow, then blue. Never beyond blue. Or by orange did you mean the yellow colour that happens when it's been gently heated?
My guess is you're way overheating it, both in your dry burn phase and then during the vape (because of the 350°F). 350°F is in the right range for a DNA 40 but not on an IPV4 or most other mods.
PS. The IPV4 will have a dedicated Titanium mode via new FW update, hopefully in about a week
Secondly: on an IPV4 you want less than 350°F almost certainly - more like 250 - 290°F.
Thirdly: when you say heated it to orange, do you mean glowing orange? If so, never heat a Titanium coil until it glows. If you want to pre-pulse it (to make it easier to coil), do so until it turns first yellow, then blue. Never beyond blue. Or by orange did you mean the yellow colour that happens when it's been gently heated?
My guess is you're way overheating it, both in your dry burn phase and then during the vape (because of the 350°F). 350°F is in the right range for a DNA 40 but not on an IPV4 or most other mods.
PS. The IPV4 will have a dedicated Titanium mode via new FW update, hopefully in about a week
Orange when heated, the whole changing-color-titanium bit I haven't dealt with yet. Iso I know, what is PGA? Not golf, I'd assume.
I don't know how to quote like you did, but I can't wait for an update! Raise the wattage while it's at it?
Unknown about the IPV4 wattage - some people say that Pioneer4You originally said it would raise to 165W, but they haven't confirmed recently.
The Yihi SX Mini M recently went from 120 to 200 (or something like that), the IPV3 Li went from something to 165 or 200, so yeah it's certainly possible the IPV4 goes up as well.
More at the end of this thread.
The Yihi SX Mini M recently went from 120 to 200 (or something like that), the IPV3 Li went from something to 165 or 200, so yeah it's certainly possible the IPV4 goes up as well.
More at the end of this thread.
PGA is pure grain alcohol, but 190 proof will work fine, plus you can drink it, LOL.
Remember that the resistance curve, the amount of change in resistance and the starting resistance, of titanium is significantly different than nickel. Like Bloke said, start out lower in temperature by at least 100F, then raise it gently, small steps, until you find the vape you want. As a rule of thumb, titanium in a mod designed for nickel is run 100F LOWER than nickel. Above all, DO NOT heat it orange or red hot! Again, go slow, quick pulses at relatively low power, until you see it change color slightly from silver/grey to a gold color and stop if it gets to blue.
Remember that the resistance curve, the amount of change in resistance and the starting resistance, of titanium is significantly different than nickel. Like Bloke said, start out lower in temperature by at least 100F, then raise it gently, small steps, until you find the vape you want. As a rule of thumb, titanium in a mod designed for nickel is run 100F LOWER than nickel. Above all, DO NOT heat it orange or red hot! Again, go slow, quick pulses at relatively low power, until you see it change color slightly from silver/grey to a gold color and stop if it gets to blue.
Are you using 100°F lower on your Heatvape, @awsum140 ?
On the DNA 40 it's between 80 and 100°F lower, depending on the target temp you want (80°F lower if you are targeting 390°F, 100°F lower if you're targeting 450°F).
I had thought that for non-DNA 40 mods it was more like 150°F lower - but I haven't verified that yet. That's just what I've heard eg from Quantum on his Mini M. But it will vary with mod quite probably.
On the DNA 40 it's between 80 and 100°F lower, depending on the target temp you want (80°F lower if you are targeting 390°F, 100°F lower if you're targeting 450°F).
I had thought that for non-DNA 40 mods it was more like 150°F lower - but I haven't verified that yet. That's just what I've heard eg from Quantum on his Mini M. But it will vary with mod quite probably.
I am running the Invader at 280F with titanium and getting good performance. I mentioned 100F as a "rule of thumb" and adjust from there to suit. I'd love to know what it's really running at but all I have to check temperature with is a non-contact IR thermometer. While it's not a cheapie, it's not exactly and very accurate way to determine temperature for a coil. I may give it a try at next fill-up and when I do a new build, just for laughs.
I really don't think the Invader is very accurate, but it does do temperature control fairly well.
I really don't think the Invader is very accurate, but it does do temperature control fairly well.
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