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That really is an awesome deal , it says limited run, but it also says check back later. I think ill keep my eye on that one, thanks for the heads up!
No offense to anyone new to vaping, but ANYONE who has been vaping on a VV device for more than a few days knows exactly how to get within a tenth(or two) of a volt to their sweet spot just by knowing the resistance of the coil they are gonna use. I haven't had to use an Ohms law calculator for I don't know how long.
Which is why I'm gonna make this point: VW is a highly inaccurate and pretty much useless feature. Half the time using VW the vape is either too hot or too cold. It's great if you're a "set it and forget it" kinda vaper. But if you're really into trying to get the BEST performance from your device and the BEST flavor from your juice, you HAVE to use VV to get it. Every juice has its own subtle characteristics and reacts differently to different temperatures and therefore requires "fine tuning" to bring out all that it has to offer. Something that is just not possible, in my opinion of course, using VW.
I am a very happy owner of a Provari. Everything said in previous posts is pretty much true. It's an extremely well built device,with consistent performance, and is well worth the money.
I also own much less expensive device with far more "bells and whistles", a Sigelei flat top Tele V3. It actually sees more use than my Provari as it is my "beater" for taking out and about. I like that it telescopes so I can choose how big I want it to be. But most of all, at the price I paid for it, if it broke I wouldn't be too upset. I have no doubt that even if taken out and about every day, my Provari would outlast a dozen Sigeleis.
I guess my point is: the Provari is a great device, for what I use it for. And my much cheaper Sigelei is just as great, for what I use it for. It really depends on the situation. At home when I'm doing some serious vaping, it's all about the Provari. But out and about, when I just want a vape on the go, my Sigelei is the man for the job.
And as for the VW on my Sigelei: I never use it, but it's kinda cool that its there.
And in regards to variable wattage: VW will get you to the stadium, but you need VV to find your seat.
Regardless of what you vape on... VAPE ON!!!
Which is why I'm gonna make this point: VW is a highly inaccurate and pretty much useless feature. Half the time using VW the vape is either too hot or too cold. It's great if you're a "set it and forget it" kinda vaper. But if you're really into trying to get the BEST performance from your device and the BEST flavor from your juice, you HAVE to use VV to get it. Every juice has its own subtle characteristics and reacts differently to different temperatures and therefore requires "fine tuning" to bring out all that it has to offer. Something that is just not possible, in my opinion of course, using VW.
I am a very happy owner of a Provari. Everything said in previous posts is pretty much true. It's an extremely well built device,with consistent performance, and is well worth the money.
I also own much less expensive device with far more "bells and whistles", a Sigelei flat top Tele V3. It actually sees more use than my Provari as it is my "beater" for taking out and about. I like that it telescopes so I can choose how big I want it to be. But most of all, at the price I paid for it, if it broke I wouldn't be too upset. I have no doubt that even if taken out and about every day, my Provari would outlast a dozen Sigeleis.
I guess my point is: the Provari is a great device, for what I use it for. And my much cheaper Sigelei is just as great, for what I use it for. It really depends on the situation. At home when I'm doing some serious vaping, it's all about the Provari. But out and about, when I just want a vape on the go, my Sigelei is the man for the job.
And as for the VW on my Sigelei: I never use it, but it's kinda cool that its there.
And in regards to variable wattage: VW will get you to the stadium, but you need VV to find your seat.
Regardless of what you vape on... VAPE ON!!!
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Can't read entire thread cause I gots stuffs to do.
Just had my oldest provari (18 months) revitalized for $75.
All new internals. One week, coast to coast.
This beast took a beating. 20 ' fall off a ladder, onto a rock. Countless lap dances onto pavement.
Where you gonna get this kind of support?
Just had my oldest provari (18 months) revitalized for $75.
All new internals. One week, coast to coast.
This beast took a beating. 20 ' fall off a ladder, onto a rock. Countless lap dances onto pavement.
Where you gonna get this kind of support?
Please stop posting misinformation and utter nonsense. You are simply wrong. It's not a matter of opinion. It's simple physics. It's how electricity works.
If you can "get there" with VV, you can "get there" with VW just as well or better.
If you can "fine tune" using VV, you can "fine tune" using VW just as well or better.
VW will always be at least as good as VV, assuming your atomizer resistance remain absolutely constant. In reality, the resistance frequently changes, sometimes even during the course of a single puff because of heat alone. When the resistance changes, VW outperforms VV.
But there are no scenarios under which VV outperforms VW. It is scientifically impossible. Unless your idea of good performance is fluctuating and inconsistent power. What good is consistent voltage when the power is inconsistent?
Is it possible that a particular VV device outperforms a particular VW device? Yes, but that's a difference question from VW vs VV. Again, when properly implemented, VW will always be equal to or better than VV. Always.
A better way to put it is that VW, than the post you quoted, is that VW is not the set it and forget it solution it was touted as initially.
Additionally, if we are comparing accuracy,none of the devices sharing the china vv/vw chip are as accurate as a provari.
That's probably true for many or even most people, but that doesn't make VW useless or inferior to VV in any shape or form.
Again, also true. There are currently no device on the market more accurate than the Provari, AFAIK.
However, a Provari only gives you accurate voltage. What you really want is accurate power. That should be obvious to everyone, but there are far too many people who insist that it's all about voltage. That's just utter nonsense.
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I just gotta say something ---
Without question the Kick Module utilizing VW is good for "set it and forget it". I do believe that was Evolv's intention as many vapers are that way. Don't confuse that with even the "multi-function" clone devices. VW can be changed just as easy (or hard, depending on one's view) as VV on the "clone" devices.
And -- it's very easy with a DNA20 mod. (to change the watts) The Nivel chip (both VV and VW) --- gulp -- that one would take some practice---just like it has for most Vari's with a display---only more with the Nivel. But, it too, would become second nature quickly.
I Hope this isn't taken as argumentative or fan-boi-itis for any method or device. I love my mods, 3.7 volt unregulated, VV, "Multi function" and VW. All have features I can enjoy.
Without question the Kick Module utilizing VW is good for "set it and forget it". I do believe that was Evolv's intention as many vapers are that way. Don't confuse that with even the "multi-function" clone devices. VW can be changed just as easy (or hard, depending on one's view) as VV on the "clone" devices.
And -- it's very easy with a DNA20 mod. (to change the watts) The Nivel chip (both VV and VW) --- gulp -- that one would take some practice---just like it has for most Vari's with a display---only more with the Nivel. But, it too, would become second nature quickly.
I Hope this isn't taken as argumentative or fan-boi-itis for any method or device. I love my mods, 3.7 volt unregulated, VV, "Multi function" and VW. All have features I can enjoy.
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I don't own a Provari, but I did talk my buddy into getting one (so I can play with it too lol). I had an eVic (before I left it at a bar), I have a Vamo, a kick, and a slew of mechanical mods, along with countless ego style VV and non-VV batteries.
You don't get the Provari for its features, a $50 Vamo has you covered. You don't get it for the display, it's lacking. You don't get it for the battery config flexibility, also lacking and expensive to upgrade (relatively). You don't get it for "set it and forget it" as it's only VV. You don't get it for its "superior voltage regulation" as I couldn't taste a difference between it and my Vamo given the same voltage settings. You don't get it for battery life, as that extra bit of voltage regulation costs you some of that. Not to mention the lack of airflow slots in on top, which inhibits some atomizers from performing correctly. The Provari would seem to be quite lacking compared to today's less-expensive alternatives (but give it credit, it's been around a long while and was a very innovative product in the beginning).
You get it because it is rock solid, can be dropped multiple times, and has a 510 connection that won't strip out on you after a few months, especially if you use SS atty's. It's all about the quality of the device. I would have easily laid down another couple c-notes to get one had I not already discovered higher-end mech mods and the kick. It's a reliable, very well built device that won't need replacement 6 months down the road. My buddy has dropped his countless times, even broken off cartos inside the 510, and it performs flawlessly every time and the 510 connection threads flawlessly every time. You can only go through so many cheaply made mods, regardless of performance, before you finally give up and just get one.
Before I lost it, the eVic I had was already starting to strip out at the 510 after a month or so use of an AGA-T+. The Vamo I have now is almost useless due to a stripped out 510 connection. I also had to "ghetto rig" an o-ring where the original insulator used to be due to the original crapping out, causing the positive pin to sink down and barely make contact with my atty's. I do not miss the eVic, nor do I use my Vamo, now that I have a quality mech with a kick. And had I not already gotten into SLR and RBA's, I would have gotten a Provari in a heartbeat after having seen the use and abuse one can take.
I haven't read the whole thread, not going to, and the above has probably already been stated countless times. But I felt it's worth repeating.
You don't get the Provari for its features, a $50 Vamo has you covered. You don't get it for the display, it's lacking. You don't get it for the battery config flexibility, also lacking and expensive to upgrade (relatively). You don't get it for "set it and forget it" as it's only VV. You don't get it for its "superior voltage regulation" as I couldn't taste a difference between it and my Vamo given the same voltage settings. You don't get it for battery life, as that extra bit of voltage regulation costs you some of that. Not to mention the lack of airflow slots in on top, which inhibits some atomizers from performing correctly. The Provari would seem to be quite lacking compared to today's less-expensive alternatives (but give it credit, it's been around a long while and was a very innovative product in the beginning).
You get it because it is rock solid, can be dropped multiple times, and has a 510 connection that won't strip out on you after a few months, especially if you use SS atty's. It's all about the quality of the device. I would have easily laid down another couple c-notes to get one had I not already discovered higher-end mech mods and the kick. It's a reliable, very well built device that won't need replacement 6 months down the road. My buddy has dropped his countless times, even broken off cartos inside the 510, and it performs flawlessly every time and the 510 connection threads flawlessly every time. You can only go through so many cheaply made mods, regardless of performance, before you finally give up and just get one.
Before I lost it, the eVic I had was already starting to strip out at the 510 after a month or so use of an AGA-T+. The Vamo I have now is almost useless due to a stripped out 510 connection. I also had to "ghetto rig" an o-ring where the original insulator used to be due to the original crapping out, causing the positive pin to sink down and barely make contact with my atty's. I do not miss the eVic, nor do I use my Vamo, now that I have a quality mech with a kick. And had I not already gotten into SLR and RBA's, I would have gotten a Provari in a heartbeat after having seen the use and abuse one can take.
I haven't read the whole thread, not going to, and the above has probably already been stated countless times. But I felt it's worth repeating.
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lol i love provari fights
my dream setup: two nice mech mods, a provari, a nice dna20 box mod, a cheap out and about mech, a cheap out and about vv
what do i have now: mkn-ts:cheap mech
evic: cheap vv
getting the provari soon
thinking ggts and ggtb for my mechs
my take on the stupid vv/vw fight: vw seriously is not a deal breaker. i have a strong feeling the change in resistance while the coil is hot is so minute that vw might change the voltage at max .1 volts. and how do you know the china vw devices even change the voltage during the hit in vw mode? i have a strong feeling both modes do the exact same thing, they are just in there so their device sounds advanced and therefore you buy it. and finally, these chinese vw devices are so inaccurate you are losing any possible accuracy gained with vw anyway.
and btw, i usually use vw mode on my evic. not because i believe its better, which i dont, but just because its what im used to. and im sure provari users are so used to vv they wouldnt even touch wattage mode on a vw device
my dream setup: two nice mech mods, a provari, a nice dna20 box mod, a cheap out and about mech, a cheap out and about vv
what do i have now: mkn-ts:cheap mech
evic: cheap vv
getting the provari soon
thinking ggts and ggtb for my mechs
my take on the stupid vv/vw fight: vw seriously is not a deal breaker. i have a strong feeling the change in resistance while the coil is hot is so minute that vw might change the voltage at max .1 volts. and how do you know the china vw devices even change the voltage during the hit in vw mode? i have a strong feeling both modes do the exact same thing, they are just in there so their device sounds advanced and therefore you buy it. and finally, these chinese vw devices are so inaccurate you are losing any possible accuracy gained with vw anyway.
and btw, i usually use vw mode on my evic. not because i believe its better, which i dont, but just because its what im used to. and im sure provari users are so used to vv they wouldnt even touch wattage mode on a vw device
I don't understand the practical difference between accurate voltage and accurate power. If I have a 2ohm carto and I want 8 watts, I need 4 volts, it doesn't matter if I set the voltage or the device does. It does matter if that voltage is accurate and the resistance reading is accurate.
Useless or inferior is a bit harsh, not necessary is a better way to say it. Also, since all the precise VW devices are basically $200 and up...your choice if you value accuracy is either stacking batteries as that china vv/vw chip handles stepping down much better than boosting voltage or getting a provari.
For a lot of people, the china vv/vw's are perfectly fine, for some not so much.
None of this has to do with the OP though. That was about cost.
That's only true if you have exactly 2.0Ω at all times. In reality, all "2.0Ω" cartos have some variance right from the start. During normal use, the resistance could change significantly for many reasons, e.g. gunk build-up, coil displacement, partial shorts, etc. With VV, the only way to ensure consistent power is to periodically check the resistance, make some calculations, and adjusts the voltage.
With VW, the power is always consistent, by definition.
The fact is everyone tries to regulate power in some way, even if they don't call it that. After all, we're just transferring energy from a battery to a wire at a certain rate. That is the definition of power. People who are arguing against VW are essentially arguing against a definition.
Not even close. Watt is a unit of energy transfer per unit time. Volt is a unit of electrical potential. What you're saying is equivalent to claiming that energy is the same as speed. I can assure you that being hit by a bus is not the same as being hit by a balloon at the same speed.
This vv vs vw argument is as asinine as my Provari's menu system. Every device has it's trade offs. VV cooks the coil differently when the coil resistance changes while being heated. Big fat hairy deal. VW theoretically adjusts for that, but the cheap ones use unfiltered PWM which just has different thermal properties that are subtle but noticeable to some. Whatever.
You're trying to heat a coil by feeding power through it. How you do it is largely academic.
All mods have a great "regulator" built in: the fire button. As long as your juice feed & wick can keep up if you want it hotter, just cook it longer. The coil will keep heating up more than you think it will. Want it cooler? Let it rest for a bit. The setting just makes it quicker and wastes less juice.
Higher number: faster to heat. Simple.
And vaping that way lets you tailor the vape to a lot more than just the coil. Also mood, outside temperature, how much juice is left and a billion other things.
My provari tends to live 0.2V below E1. My kicks are all set to 10W, and I'd go to 15 if I could. And you can still get a relaxing, cool vape off of them without much effort, though it is harder with the provari because it's menu system sometimes trips. And they can all get hot and heavy to the point of melting delrin drip tips.
Just buy the device you want, figure out what works for you, and stop worrying about the technical minutiae. At least, that's how I see it.
You're trying to heat a coil by feeding power through it. How you do it is largely academic.
All mods have a great "regulator" built in: the fire button. As long as your juice feed & wick can keep up if you want it hotter, just cook it longer. The coil will keep heating up more than you think it will. Want it cooler? Let it rest for a bit. The setting just makes it quicker and wastes less juice.
Higher number: faster to heat. Simple.
And vaping that way lets you tailor the vape to a lot more than just the coil. Also mood, outside temperature, how much juice is left and a billion other things.
My provari tends to live 0.2V below E1. My kicks are all set to 10W, and I'd go to 15 if I could. And you can still get a relaxing, cool vape off of them without much effort, though it is harder with the provari because it's menu system sometimes trips. And they can all get hot and heavy to the point of melting delrin drip tips.
Just buy the device you want, figure out what works for you, and stop worrying about the technical minutiae. At least, that's how I see it.
As a photographer this reminds me the Leica issue. Some photographers will "die" for their Leica while some others (me included) will make it out with other brands. And the fight never ends......
I'm not arguing against any of this, I'm arguing against it being done by the device as being necessary. Resistance shouldn't be bouncing around in a significant manner as to necessitate constant reading of the ohms. I have a term c that I built and it metered at 1.6ohms yesterday, still 1.6ohms today. Might be 1.7ohms tomorrow in which case I can bump the voltage up 0.1 but there is not a need to check the ohms all day.
If you resistance is jumping around or changing significantly quickly, it's probably better to deal with your issue than have your pv constantly correcting for it. If your genesis is shorting and jumping around in resistance, it's best to correct the short. It's going to taste like crap no matter what your vw pv does.
And again, speaking about in practice. I do understand how it all works and what vw actually does. If VW is what someone wants, go for it. You want three buttons, go for it. I just think it's funny that people tout these things as huge advantages on devices that don't do the basics well.
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I like variable power, for all of the obvious benefits mentioned earlier. However, I vape to taste most of the time, so accuracy is not a significant factor whether I adjust voltage or I adjust power. Some of the arguments for vv over vw is just absurd. Since they are both used to produce power, it doesn't matter one iota which you choose. The fact is that if you didn't quite like the vape at one power or one voltage, all of us would just adjust one or the other to suit our vape. Much of this argument is just nonsense. I have two Provari's. I prefer variable power. I like the display on the eVic. I like the reliability on the Provari. Bottom line is I like vaping, am delighted to be non-smoker, will continue to buy gear until I'm satisfied (and that doesn't seem to be nearing), and I will continue to come to ECF as I like the community...even the debate. OMG, it's certainly not personal. The wonderful thing is that there are now choices for all different preferences. One size does not fit all. The best PV is the one that keeps you off the analogs. None of these devices needs to be championed nor defended, as everything about them is subjective. You like what you like. If I like variable power, and you don't, so be it, but to say one is better than the other is just silly, as they both do exactly the same thing. The so called bells and whistles allow one to achieve exactly the same result. At the end, we all get half way up the mountain, turn to one another, and say, but my way was best. In today's vaping world, you can get very close to the same experiences with a $30 mod or a $200 mod. One may last longer, but it also costs seven times as much and definitely should last longer. If my Provari was slightly inaccurate, I would simply adjust the voltage to suit my taste. The same thing happens with my Sigelei. Neither need to be defended. For the most part I find these debates amusing, but there's some very wrong information on this thread about the superiority of variable voltage over variable power that defies mathematics and physics. Makes you wonder what's really going on, huh? I do love both of my Provari's, but come on...I just happen to love my Sigelei V3 even more, and for different reasons. Does that make me some kind of traitor? Maybe in your eyes...then again, I have an open mind.
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