Competition vaping... Really?
- Thread starter Malarky
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Well if we're screaming education, I think that should be a MUST on the brick & mortar level. Many people buy their 1st ecig in stores & it is there that they're then immediately introduced to mechs & RDAs. THOSE who sell to someone who doesn't have a clue what they're doing are {IMO} what makes vaping so dangerous- not someone who who enjoys clouds.
yeah, thats the point where ive been tryign to get at this whole time, its education and misinformation to blame. If you get down to the root of it there are many things to blame and pinpointing all of them would be difficult, the main point im getting at is that cloud competitions increases the risk of something going wrong due to people pushing the max of their devices, and if they arent knowledgable of what they are doing that further increases the risk of something bad happening. I am not against cloud competitions, i just dont condone them due to this fact. There are just no preventive measures or regulations in place to prevent incidents from happening. I am NOT in favor of the FDA regulating vaping either do NOT read me wrong. People who take the higher risks should be knowledgable of what they are doing and from personal experience, most people who I've met are just interested in blowing the biggest clouds possible do not do themselves justice by educating themselves. over half of the people ive talked to who are fnatics about 'cloud chasing' have no clue what ohms law is, they have no idea how resistance, potential difference, and current interact with eachother, which is basically the core of what cloud chasing is. It may be just me but the majority of people who are into 'cloud chasing' really have no idea behind the basics of what cloud chasing actually is.
This is the dangerous aspect, when you get someone who is misinformed/uneducated who wants to keep chasing the biggest cloud, and do not know the limitations of their setup. sure its for fun, just start a competition and see who blows the biggest clouds, but then you get that overly competitive vaper, who pushes and pushes trying to get a cloud bigger than the last guy, and thats where it gets dangerous. Labeling it as a 'competition' automatically makes it that to some people, a competition. It's all fun and games til someone gets hurt, and it wont just be that 1 person who gets hurt, itll resonate through the entire vaping community.
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Which makes doing it all the more fun. That's probably why cloud chasing is so appealing to young, 'never smoked a cig in my life'rs.
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i honeslty wouldnt mind if they did it on their own time in private unpublcized events. when it happens at big vape meets where vendors are there to sell, vapers are their to learn, and industry leaders are there to inform, is where i dont condone it.
Some people clearly cannot get their head around the main concern from this and rather then trying to understand just label those of us against it at this time as selfish, old, envious\jealous or regulation favourers so I'm out as none of those apply to mine or many other opposers positions here but we clearly cant get our point across no matter how we try.
So, if there are a lot of cloud chasers out there who don't know how to do it safely, or are taking chances they shouldn't in order to win competitions, where are the incidents and/or injuries? There was the mod explosion at ECC, but that was probably not even a competitor as far as I know. Other than that one case, I know of no other high power mechanical mod incident.
I do however know of a few eGo batteries that have burned/exploded and injured people. I know of a few more where they 'just' caused property damage.
So who is looking at making eGo batts safer? Also, the eGo problems have not resonated through the vaping community, why would competitive vaping injuries and fires, if they start happening, do that?
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Other people have just as much right to chase clouds as you do not to. I respect your opinion that vaping is just for ex smokers but that simply isn't true. We ex smokers do not own vaping. Anyone who is over 18 can blow as many clouds as they want. Big government doesn't need a reason to shut vaping down. If they want to they will.
^- just that. it seems that the only people who cant get their heads around the concerns are people who think "let them do what they want because it doesnt affect me", or "let me do what I want because i want to do it and you cant stop me". I have yet to see anyone give any positive reasoning to cloud chasing competitions, just a bunch of over exaggerated analogies that aren't even relevant. If the only reasoning you have in favor of cloud chasing competitions is "because i/they want to", im sorry but that hasnt been a valid excuse since you were in diapers.
i dare you say that to the communities and organizations that have put effort into keeping the government from trampling all over your rights to vape. I know I dont own vaping, but i sure as hell wont think twice about raising my voice to some ignorant child that takes the right to vape away from me. Like i said, blow as big of clouds as much as you want, just dont start blowing yourselves up due to being misinformed and unknowledgable because it doesnt just effect you, its going to effect everyone else. Im not here arguing against the fact that people have the right to blow clouds or not. I'm here just not condoning an atmosphere that accepts people regardless if they know what they are doing or not, to blow clouds at highly publicized events with a higher risk than normal of things going awry. In publicized events, if things go wrong, people know, and what people know spreads and spreads giving vaping bad publicity. look what bad publicity did to guns, pit bulls, and countless other things.
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I get what you're saying; I really do but what doesn't ever get mentioned is that there really are many of us who do know what we're doing yet get lumped into one classification- dumb dangerous cloud chasers with no understanding of battery safety & Ω's law.
Just because I can build a coil & know what the resistance will be doesn't mean I won't test it on a meter first. Cloud chasing is nothing. Just look around ECF at the # of people who are building coils with nothing to test it on. Why isn't what they do considered dangerous- not only to themselves but others? Hell, that individual could likely burn down a house.
I just think some of the things people make a big issue about are non-issues that is not directing affecting them.
I definitely agree with this statement. When people are going to these competitions and don't know what they're doing that is what's so dangerous about it. I'm not saying it happens all the time but I know out of all the cloud competitions around the country theres a few people that go in not knowing as much as they should about their mod/battery. That's what's really dangerous. If that don't have the right battery and their mod doesn't have good venting everyone in the room is in danger which isn't fair to all those other people. I love clouds and cloud chasing but I also do it in my house and I know what I'm doing.
lol, if you got what im saying then you probably wouldnt have made this comment
it will dirtectly effect all us vapers if the 'dangerous' things they are doing in public sactioned events. I wouldnt even care much about it, if i knew every single publicized cloud chasing made sure all competitors knew what they were doing and the risks, the fact is not all do. I'd love to believe that every adult is responsible, but we all know that is not true. People need to have their hands held, and thats the point im getting at here, it's for us who dont need our hands held. I dont want to pay extra $$$ for the FDA to hold my hand when i dont need it, just because johnny knowitall didnt really know it all.
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lol, if you got what im saying then you probably wouldnt have made this comment
You said a lot & I did get what you were saying. That doesn't stop me from thinking in general some people make some {any} issues bigger than they actually are or not.
I provided list that rationalizes, I believe accurately, that cloud blowing competitions are way down on the list of concerns for 'problems facing the vaping community.' Those who see it as a problem wish to argue that it is near the top. IMO, that has not been backed up very well in this thread, and has for sure not even addressed the (real) top 3 items that are the real issues facing the vaping community.
I hinted at positive reasoning for cloud chasing competitions, and I am furtherst thing away from cloud chasing, as I have incessant desire to stick to cigalike devices. But I'll give it a gander here because you double dogged dared me/us, and because right about now, I'm feeling a little big for my diapers.
#1 - like all vapers, everywhere, blowing clouds out of one's mouth is very interesting, entirely cool. Some vapers, but not all, like to see how big the cloud can be when exhaling. Even me, with my cigalike, I've tried to see how big can I make a cloud in a room where I'm the only occupant. I would say I'm rather novice at it, which I kinda consider good because cigalikes are really really good for vaping everywhere, with respect. My clouds dissipate very fast. But, if I had right device and right lung capacity, I think it would be extra cool, more interesting, and crazy fun to be in a room where everyone is there to see who can blow the biggest cloud. Even if I took 27th place, I still think it would be crazy fun and interesting to see what vaping devices can produce when given full opportunity.
#2 - It brings vapers together in a way that is a spectacle, with a mixture of stamina and (extreme) art. Of course, absolutely, this won't work for everyone, and for anti-types, it will appear as bad/unwanted attention. Anything that is extreme/underground, I would expect, will be treated the same. But by those participating, it will be (or at least could be) treated as an event where camaraderie is shared, new friendships are made, and vapers are standing up boldly for what is a huge draw for vaping (blowing clouds, see item #1). It also strikes me as one of the least risky of the extreme competitions currently around. Methinks, you'd have to be ANTZ leaning to deem this activity as inherently dangerous when I'm sure level of harm at all such at events is between extremely rare and none at all.
#3 - It will have impact on how devices are made. Perhaps not the greatest impact, but it is testing the limits of devices by persons who have legitimate reason to tailor devices in way that enhances cloud formation while not (necessarily) sacrificing safety. I would think cloud chasers are more attuned with the ins and outs of their device than the overwhelming majority of vapers, as well as most manufacturers. I could very easily see these type of persons being tapped by manufacturers to help improve devices, for reasons that may have nothing to do with cloud chasing.
#4 - Let's pretend none of the above three work for you. Then, let's just consider this as low hanging fruit with regards to the politics of vaping. People who are out on the edge, taking the risks, and drawing attention to vaping. People who aren't willing to be stepped all over by TPTB and who are standing up, very boldly, for what they want from vaping, without asking anything from the political types in the vaping community. I strongly suggest we not throw them under the bus, and instead remain, at worst, neutral toward their activity. If ANTZ wants to make an example of them, as ANTZ looks to make examples out of all things vaping, then this could be viewed as low hanging fruit that likely keeps anti-types busy for an indefinite amount of time. Chances are ANTZ will never be able to get their grips on cloud chasing competitions, but will continue trying nonetheless. The more it is forbidden, the more likely it is to pop up and keep going. For the overall politics of vaping, it serves as a decent distraction that is unlikely to be stopped any time soon.
Awesome post (as always, J).
J, your #3 is very much already in effect and has been for a few years. It has had impact on how devices are made and plenty of vapers have been consulted with (or just themselves become makers) for what a given device 'needs' to be most effective. As a matter of fact, and yes I mean an actual fact, a lot of the gear out today was first conceptualized by or 'modded' by someone that was just trying to get the most out of their own gear. That's of course where the term "mod" came from. All the airflow and such in these devices was first accomplished by vapers drilling out their own holes in their atties.
J, your #3 is very much already in effect and has been for a few years. It has had impact on how devices are made and plenty of vapers have been consulted with (or just themselves become makers) for what a given device 'needs' to be most effective. As a matter of fact, and yes I mean an actual fact, a lot of the gear out today was first conceptualized by or 'modded' by someone that was just trying to get the most out of their own gear. That's of course where the term "mod" came from. All the airflow and such in these devices was first accomplished by vapers drilling out their own holes in their atties.
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Note: When I said "for a few years," I meant simply that those that chase clouds have had a direct impact on the advancement of gear, not necessarily that cloud chasing competitions have been around in their current form for that long -- though, exhaling more vapor has always been an important factor of what could be construed as "better gear". Hell, even carto tanks was a concept coming from vapers at home coming up with ways on how they could have more liquid without having to refill as often.
Well, I never been to a cloud comp and after this thread I did some thinking. Before I bash anything let me see what it's like first. While I was thinking about it and vaping in Dubai, I realized damn, I don't need to go to a cloud comp. I already won. So I took a picture to prove it. 
Well, I never been to a cloud comp and after this thread I did some thinking. Before I bash anything let me see what it's like first. While I was thinking about it and vaping in Dubai, I realized damn, I don't need to go to a cloud comp. I already won. So I took a picture to prove it.
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I see they also use Reos Mods over there
I can see this ending up on ESPN 3 right after Darts and the Rock, Paper, Scissors championship.
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