It would save them millions of dollars for applications that have no guarantee of being allowed. Plus what Bob Chill says.
Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!
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It would save them millions of dollars for applications that have no guarantee of being allowed. Plus what Bob Chill says.
Maybe you're right.
I guess it's not really all that far-fetched.
But if refill liquid is available, then the profit potential is reduced substantially.
I don't see how they could outsell Halo Tribeca.
Sorry, like I said....aint buyin' it. Not for a second. Cigar sales are a fart in a windstorm relative to cigarette sales. I find myself disagreeing with Dimitri often.
And who Exactly benefits from a Cig-a-like Fail/Return to Smoking?
Not say'n that BT is not going to want to Open Up the e-Cigarette Market. They just don't want it done Now. Isn't it Smarter for them to do it thru a Limited PMTA for ENDS process than from Moving Up the 2007 Date to say 2016?
Also from the Site you linked to...
Nicotine inhaler doubles chances of quitting smoking, study finds
Funny how if you Inhale Nicotine from a BP Sold device that it Doubles your chances of Quitting Smoking. But if you Inhale Nicotine from a Non-BP Device, an e-Cigarette, it Doesn't Work.
Well Dr. Laura Tenner, says it's because with Nicotine from a BP sold device people can be evaluated and monitored by their doctors where as with e-cigarettes you are going to have all of these adverse risk no one is following up on....
even though you can buy buy nicotine inhalers, gum, patches, and lozenges without a prescription
BT's support for e-cigs is very telling and of course self-serving. It just shows that should the regs stand and this industry collapses, even their deep pockets won't be able to produce an ironclad PMTA for any vapor product. And if by some miracle they do, they also know the FDA can rescind it at any time.
Another reason might be they're just tired of paying the extortion fees the Tobacco Master Settlement Agreement demands that is partially based on cigarette sales. (Which doesn't apply to cigalikes).
But who the hell knows what convoluted schemes creep out of their minds?
How much are the application fees?
We've been focusing on the PMTAs and I haven't heard much about application fees.
I think the ship has sailed (globally) on cigalike or smoke only options. BT probably clearly sees that vapor is the new smoking and already figured out how to properly take their slice.
The regs would certainly delay things but the future is definitely going to be vaping surpassing smoking around the world within a decade.
SOP.
Like a ballistic arc. Headwinds, gravity, air resistance. So you aim a certain amount above the target to factor that in.
Same here. Ask for 150% to get the 100% you originally had in mind. Factor in the political resistance.
Problem is, when too demanding, folks might tell you to just shove it all.
And I am stilled appalled that FDA even considers this kind of wantonness.
Make rules, change rules at whim, don't even tell how to comply with the rules.
Putting themselves above the law, beyond control or oversight - what's the point of having a congress, a senate or supreme court then ?
This is exactly the kind of rogue behaviour - when exhibited by foreign governments - that in the past has prompted the USA to send in troops.
Maybe so much democracy got exported that there isn't any to spare for home ... :/
No Argument there. BT is Smart Enough to see Profits in the e-Cigarette Market. But How, Exactly, would Moving up the Grandfather date help BT?
And if the Monetary Bar is High Enough that really Only BT, BP, and perhaps a one or two BV, doesn't that in and of itself give BT an almost Guaranteed US market Dominance?
If they Want it that is. And I think they BT Does want to Dominate the US e-Cigarette Market.
Totally agree.......Case in point:
Ever see those Vuse(sp??) commercial where they say 'One less cigarette smoked is a victory'? Where do you think they got this line? Altho, no one can prove it, it has been said on this forum countless times since my being here(2010) and way before these commercials ever started. Makes one wonder just how many 'spies' have read the forums and continue to glean info for their uses, or to use against us.
Read one just last night, member claiming to be a 3 year vaper-er,(altho new to ecf) saying they were having problems with equipment they were using. The more they explained their problem led one to believe they were fishing more for info than actual help. Why do I bring this up? Just wanting everyone to be aware that unfortunately not everyone who graces any ecig forum is always here for the reasons the majority of us are.
mods: if this is not acceptable pls delete. Not trying to cause any problems, just impart info.
Siegel speculated that BT was supporting because they'd rather have a smaller share of a big market as opposed to a big share (monopoly) of a tiny market. I don't know. It could be some combination of that and feeling insecure about the chances of their products getting PMTAs. ??
Swap the piece pipe for a box mod.
Heck that would be an eye-catcher PR-wise :
A Sitting Bull lookalike sporting a vape ...
Then you'll have to disagree with his guest, Ashley who works with BT lobbyists and us on HR2058/Cole-Bishop.
I'm sure these folks don't get paid to lobby the wrong pieces of legislation.
Again, there is a disconnect between the literal interpretation of what the FDA said it can do, and what it actually CAN do.
The ref is written such that they can remove 18650s, surgical cotton, welding wire, and a bunch of other things from the market if they don't receive a PMTA.
They can't.
Not as in " they shouldn't", or "that's just crazy", they CAN'T.
The minute they try to regulate 18650s they also have to regulate q-tips, tampons, and plastic bottles.
The regulation is written so that they can regulate everything used for vaping, but, at the end of the day, they only thing they'll be able to say anything about is packaged products with nicotine and/or labeled for vaping nicotine.
I dunno. Isn't that like saying the only way BT can dominate the smoked tobacco industry is if open systems (pipes and hand-rolled cigars) are not allowed, or whole leaf tobacco is not allowed?
Because that obviously hasn't been the case. Once upon a time, open systems (pipes) were pretty much the only way that tobacco was smoked. But the companies that became BT came up with a more convenient way; cigarettes.
Maybe they think they can do it again? Or that they will buy out whomever comes up with an effective system that they believe will pass PMTA muster? A product like JUUL comes to mind here.
They subpoenaed all sellers to release their data. I received a notice from the reservation about six months before the IRS came crashing down.
It basically stated that they had no choice, and that they were warning all of their customers that they had released the data as requested. I didn't blame them one bit.
But let me tell you - it took a bite.
I didn't say "application fees". PMTA = premarket tobacco product applications
... which they also have to do. Sure, everyone says they are the ones that can afford it, but there is no guarantee and frankly, what the FDA has done to them in the past, it is likely they might think that they could spend (depending on their vape products/eliquids, etc. ) 100's of millions of dollars for the FDA to reject their applications.
The 'Bob Chill' part of my post was that he pointed out that the tobacco companies have a pretty good idea of who their market is and would just go with that part of the market. Perhaps later develop open systems to compete as well. But for now the Vuse and Mark 10 and cigalite markets are theirs. The idea of a way out of MSA is another plus for them.
Take away the leftist views on Big anything but government, and you might be able to see clearer. :- )
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