Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[HazyShades]

After 40 years of menthol cigarettes...cilia aren't high on my list of things I have control over.

After 40 years of menthol you could probably cool your house off with your breath...
Oh, feline Princess... if you've messed up your kitty cat cilia with that nasty menthol why mess them up more? Those little hairs are better friends than google.

I started smoking with Salem
but got over them in about a month. Tried most of the brands
but other than a couple Kools I bummed from coworkers
I've stayed away from menthol. The middle kid
vaped menthol for a while..I gave him grief.

But I am working on a mix that requires some coolness.
Any suggestions?

 

[HazyShades]

five pawns.

All five of them? Stud.

 

[The Ocelot]

After 40 years of menthol you could probably cool your house off with your breath...
Oh, feline Princess... if you've messed up your kitty cat cilia with that nasty menthol why mess them up more? Those little hairs are better friends than google.

I started smoking with Salem
but got over them in about a month. Tried most of the brands
but other than a couple Kools I bummed from coworkers
I've stayed away from menthol. The middle kid
vaped menthol for a while..I gave him grief.

But I am working on a mix that requires some coolness.
Any suggestions?

I suggest Koolada it gives a cool sensation with no added mint or menthol taste. I add it to lots of juices.

Perfumers Apprentice - Koolada 10 PG

 

[HazyShades]

I suggest Koolada it gives a cool sensation with no added mint or menthol taste. I add it to lots of juices.

Perfumers Apprentice - Koolada 10 PG

Thanks, it has been suggested to me b4, do you know what it is made of
other than the PG base?
I've considered mint, even made a foxtail extraction
that I used in another experiment but the other flavor overwhelmed the mint.
I'll read your reply in the morning (afternoon
I have to go crash. Thanks for the company.
Good night.
Hazy

 

[nineironman]

You might consider mentioning ProVape in your messages. They are in Monroe, WA. Even if you're not a fan of their products, it is undeniable that they are the kind of small business the US should be proud of and the regulations will close their doors.

Thanks,I shall.

 

[ZeroedIn]

I will believe BT is on our side when I see them dump big sums of money into research and development of ALL vape products...gear, liquid, and accessories. We have seen the positive effects of vape innovation by companies who are just a small fraction of the size of BT with R & D budgets that are a drop in the bucket compared to the R & D budgets of BT. Think of how BT could advance vaping technology and market tested flavor enhancements with the deep pockets they have. For that matter, one could say the same thing about BP employing the smoking cessation angle and qualifying vaping as a "medicine". Unless I am oblivious (which is always a possibility with me), I haven't seen any of these efforts.

I have a feeling we'll start hearing some rumblings of these efforts come Feb 17, 2017, and definitely a lot of talk come August 9th, 2018.

 

[skoony]

I think we need companies with unquestionable reputations.

That would be nice if we had customers with unquestionable motives.
The only reason 5P's is in court is because they are in California.
Suicide Bunny doesn't seem to be having any legal difficulties.
Health England has stated at minimum vaping is 95% safer than
smoking. They didn't say diketone free vaping is 95% safer.

It would be interesting to see a class action lawsuit against all
the e-liquid manufacturers who tested their juice and advertised it as
diketone free and safer than the other manufacturers implying that
the other manufacturers are knowingly trying to harm their customers.

Oh,wait,I forgot that's just transparency.

Definition of transparency:
Whatever the user wants it to mean.

I wonder if such legal proceedings would be legal under under the
deeming regs? One would have to prove such claims to the FDA
and still might not be able to make them.


Regards
mike

 

[SeniorBoy]

On the 5P issue. Not sure if this has been posted so please humor me.

One of the owners named Rob started this thread:

Five Pawns now on ECF

EDIT: I'm finding it difficult to assume from the letter that 5P will go the PMTA route. Of course that's just my view and I could be wrong. A declarative statement to this affect including the words "PMTA" would certainly help me.

Enjoy!

 

[Lessifer]

On the 5P issue. Not sure if this has been posted so please humor me.

One of the owners named Rob started this thread:

Five Pawns now on ECF

EDIT: I'm finding it difficult to assume from the letter that 5P will go the PMTA route. Of course that's just my view and I could be wrong. A declarative statement to this affect including the words "PMTA" would certainly help me.

Enjoy!

I figured "working toward satisfying FDA framework" meant going for PMTA. Unless... They're partnering with someone making a closed system.

 

[zoiDman]

I figured "working toward satisfying FDA framework" meant going for PMTA. Unless... They're partnering with someone making a closed system.

It could be they mean that they are working towards Satisfying the Aug 8th, 2016 Requirements.

 

[Lessifer]

It could be they mean that they are working towards Satisfying the Aug 8th, 2016 Requirements.

That is true. I suppose the Forever thing could just be hype. I won't really care one way or the other but I do hope that some liquid companies at least try. I don't think they'll succeed, but at least we'd have something to point to and say look at all the work _____ did and they still didn't get approved.

 

[Lessifer]

The thing I like in the Cole Bishop amendment which is not present in 2058 is the requirement for the FDA to spell out what requirements must be met for approval. As it stands now, even if 2058 passes and keeps everything on the market as of 2016, the current Deeming provides no real guidance on how new approvals will be decided and granted. You could spend $2 million dollars completing a PMTA only to have it denied with some vague suggestion on how much more crap you have to provide for reconsideration. Under Cole-Bishop, those standards will be known in advance of the 2018 deadline.

The other advantage to that disclosure prior to the 2018 deadline is the opportunity to challenge the basis of those requirements if they onerous, arbitrary, and capricious. If they are so onerous as to being impossible to meet, there is certainly a basis for legal action, as the Tobacco Act does not empower the FDA to outright ban tobacco products. In addition, knowledge of the requirements for approval will also allow a vendor/manufacturer to better estimate the actual cost of completing the application, and not simply rely on the "predicted expense" the FDA calculated. Under the current regulation, even if 2058 pushes the grandfather date to 2016, you would still have to literally complete your application blind, hoping you hit all the checks the FDA will require for approval (assuming there are any).

I asked this before but no one responded. What is being said here? I don't remember any provision in that amendment requiring the FDA to formalize a standard other than the battery standard, which the FDA shouldn't be in charge of anyway. What am I missing? @Kent C @Bronze you both liked this post. What is Eskie talking about?

 

[crxess]

I asked this before but no one responded. What is being said here? I don't remember any provision in that amendment requiring the FDA to formalize a standard other than the battery standard, which the FDA shouldn't be in charge of anyway. What am I missing? @Kent C @Bronze you both liked this post. What is Eskie talking about?

You didn't and you won't - This Bill also supports BT(tobacco Variables) and they have purposefully used Obscurity since the Act Passed to ward off Competition. (Not Tobacco styled Micro Brews)
We are at the Mercy of Corporately owned Government.

 

[MyMagicMist]

They are protecting public health. These small vendors may be killing vapers. Who knows what is in their juice?

Just because there are around 10 million US vapers and none have been harmed by these smaller vendors does not mean that mass death and destruction is not imminent. And we need to protect the chillren too. Don't forget that.

This raises a question for me then, just what does the gov have planned to let slip out for vaping consumers?

I mean logically, if mass death and destruction are imminent accordingly with their heightened stance of protecting the public, only stands they know something. Why else think mass death and destruction are imminent? Well, it must be and from the looks of it, they're planning for it. How do they know how to plan for it? Seems all too ducks in a row.

 

[skoony]

When this is all over I think I will write a book.
"How to shut down adult Kool-Aid stands"
or "See what we did there?"
Forwarded by Zeller and Glantz.

Regards
Mike

 

[drum747]

I dont know if this has been posted or not? "e-cigarettes and public health"
American Enterprise Institute Hosts Discussion | Video | C-SPAN.org

 

[MyMagicMist]

I dont know if this has been posted or not? "e-cigarettes and public health"
American Enterprise Institute Hosts Discussion | Video | C-SPAN.org

Any way to save the video? Update: Got it.

 

[Bronze]

I dont know if this has been posted or not? "e-cigarettes and public health"
American Enterprise Institute Hosts Discussion | Video | C-SPAN.org

For those not familiar with AEI (American Enterprise Institute)...they are a prominent think tank. I believe they claim they are non-partisan but, in my opinion, lean right.

 

[classwife]

am listening...so far so good.
Actually crying with relief listening to Mr. Shiffman so far...

 

[classwife]

So...do these people have a voice - do they have any "power" ?