Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

The Ocelot

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Seems lately it's usually me in the middle of the donnybrooks so it was kinda nice to sit back and enjoy watching others battle it out. :D

Finally someone using a term I don't have to look up. I suppose for the kids in the room you should have used DYBRKS.
 
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zoiDman

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That was the definition of tobacco products prior to the deeming, which "deemed" other things as tobacco products as well. Even if the website is out of date, I don't recall reading any regulation that transfers the powers of the TTB to the FDA. I'm wondering if it is clarified somewhere whether or not new tobacco product manufacturers will also have to get a TTB permit?

https://www.ttb.gov/tobacco/manufacturer_products.shtml

Here is the Question I would be Asking.

Where does the Alcohol and Tobacco Tax and Trade Bureau gets its Authority from?

If it's authority comes from Laws and Definitions that are defined under an Internal Revenue Code, doesn't an Internal Revenue Code have to include e-Cigarettes/e-Liquids in some way for the TTB to have authority over them?

Damn... Where's a Governmental Lawyer when you need one?
 

mostlyclassics

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Going thru the government websites makes me crazy, but I found a document posted by a law firm to explain to what a congressional investigation means and the steps it takes. Maybe it will help a little bit about what can happen? Page 5 starts explaining the enforcement process.
https://www.mayerbrown.com/files/Pu...c20856/White-Paper-Congressional-Subpoena.pdf

Good find Qew!

That section from page 5 on is depressing reading. What it basically says is that the executive branch can do whatever it wants, within very broad limits. Then, the legislative branch's remedies are so slow, cumbersome and politically fraught that this country is effectively ruled by the executive.

Shudder.
 
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Yiana

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There are many thousand ( upwards of 15000 by some estimates ) vapeshops in the U.S. Imagine if they all acted as if their livelihoods were at stake !

They should be the ones educating their customers on these regulations. Each one of these stores has a dedicated customer base, ranging from dozens to hundreds i imagine. If only 50% of these customers were aware of the situation and cared enough, we would have a much better chance of stopping this, or slowing it down. Are we surprised that we don't have more support from the non-vape community, when we don't have even 10 % from within the community, knowing and caring.

It just blows my mind that b&ms are doing this and not informing the public. Are they really that stupid that their own livlihood is going to be flushed down the toilet. It makes me so angry.
 

VNeil

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Wow, you're finding nicotine far cheaper than I then.
A $50 liter of 100mg nic will make 33 liters of 3mg base at a cost of about 0.15 cents/ml. On a good day you can buy nic for $40 or less.

A $68 4 gallon glycube of your choice of pg/VG from essential depot works out to about 0.41 cents/ml.

You could make 12mg base for about 1 cent/ml.

At a tax rate of $1/ml, that liter of nic and about $136 of pg/VG, would tax out at about $33,000 if cut to 3mg. There is something very wrong with that picture...
 
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The Ocelot

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Just after the regs came out the vendor of my ADV posted that after June 6th there would be a price increase. There was no reason listed. I have been buying from them for almost 4 years and we have a somewhat personal relationship, so I sent them an email saying how disappointed I was since it appears they are doing a cut and run. (They have a couple of B&Ms and sell online - their juice appears to be all handmade). I got a response telling me they were still looking at the regs and would post something when they understood what was going on. I then sent them links to Dr. Siegel's blog, his interview with White Cloud and to CASAA. I said at lest they could put a link to CASAA on their front page.

It is now June 6th. The banner on the front page still has the unexplained price increase. However, the regs are mentioned in a blog dated May 12 (few days after my email). The blog is not mentioned on the front page. Honestly, how many people read vendor blogs if they aren't on the front page or there's a notice directing customers to read it? And this company's especially, since their other entries (the last one was in Feb) are introducing employees.

As you may or may not be aware, the FDA recently published the deeming regulations for the sale and manufacturing of electronic cigarette products. We are working hard along side our attorneys to get a better understanding of what exactly the regulations stipulate and how they will affect our company, the industry, and the customers who have supported us for many years. We know there has been a lot of confusion and misinformation flying around, and would like to take this time to assure our customers that we have no plans of going anywhere anytime soon. You can count on us to continually provide high-quality eliquids to our customers now and in the future. We will keep everyone posted with new information as it is available, so be sure to check our blog for updates periodically.

If you wish to protect your rights to use and purchase vapor products, please petition your legislators to support the HR 2058 bill. For more information, please see check out http://cqrcengage.com/casaa/app/write-a-letter?0&engagementId=101154


The contact for CASAA isn't even a hyperlink. Does this count as informing customers? I think at least putting something on the front page would be appropriate.

They have lost my business.
 
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The Ocelot

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I don't know what this is, but it came up when I did a search on splitting hairs.

ecoli-bad.gif
 

drum747

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Just sent this to one of my longest relationship juice companies, I don't get it!

Hey guys,
Quick question, I have been buying juice from you guys for years. With the announcement of the deeming regs the whole “in tune” vaping community has been doing whatever is possible to advance the cause, meaning getting people to sign up with CASAA and make them aware of HR2058 and the Cole-Bishop Amendment. I am just curious why I don’t see any mention on your website or Facebook page about any of this?
Thanks

Short and sweet.
 

leftyandsparky

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I don't know what this is, but it came up when I did a search on splitting hairs.

ecoli-bad.gif
I looked up 6 stores in my new home town and none of them report anything. Makes me feel like we don't matter.
 

Captain Pegleg

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leftyandsparky

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I would really like to see this linked in the original post for visibility Effective and Compliance Dates Applicable to Retailers, Manufacturers, Importers, and Distributors of Newly Deemed Tobacco Products

Everything already on the market by August 8 this year can stay there for two years...
The first hammer someone talked about was for new products.

Just me, I'm not stocking up two years in advance. Not while I have this ugly feeling of mass hysteria in my mind, from browsing this thread.

Reminds me of "we got attacked, go buy all the gas you can before we run out! ...oh crap, we ran out because everybody tried to buy gas at once"

An unpopular idea, I am sure... :)
A lot of states will be taxing so some people are stocking up.
 
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drum747

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Is there any part of our lives nanny Bloomberg doesn't want to control?

Mike BloombergVerified account‏@MikeBloomberg
.@US_FDA's decision to regulate all tobacco products, incl. e-cigarettes & cigars, is an important & overdue step. http://mikebloom.bg/1NkQqDQ

Just gave him a lashing on twitter, even Grimm Green weighed in on this one with the hashtag #WhoLinesYourPockets ? , my hashtag was not so kind.
 

Katya

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I may have to break down and get a Twitter account.

proxy.php


I just posted this in another thread...

Arrgh........ OK, so I can figure out how to sign up for Twitter (looks straightforward enough). Now I need to learn how to tweet. ;)

I never thought it'd come to this. :D
 
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Sugar_and_Spice

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That kind of makes sense in the context of our current situation. As every woman knows it sometimes happens when you've been f...
Looks like I changed my avatar just in time for the 'adult stuff'

LOL
:img:
 
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