Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!
- Thread starter Oliver
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Why not? There is undercover personnel at DOJ, State, and CIA right now.We should have been taking undercover positions there over the last ten years.
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The headline of the press release is:
"E-cigarettes take serious toll on heart health, not safer than traditional cigarettes."
They base this conclusion on the cholesterol levels by monitoring !45! e-cig users and comparing them to non smokers and dual user smokers.
Even if it was a 1K+ e-cig users tested, it doesn't prove anything, cholesterol levels are mostly affected by the diet and the overall way of life. Also e-cigs never were advertised to lower the cholesterol lvl.
How f.up is the evidence-based medicine in the US these days?
this Dr. Siegel is totaly doing this
for big F/T money.
"E-cigarettes take serious toll on heart health, not safer than traditional cigarettes."
They base this conclusion on the cholesterol levels by monitoring !45! e-cig users and comparing them to non smokers and dual user smokers.
Even if it was a 1K+ e-cig users tested, it doesn't prove anything, cholesterol levels are mostly affected by the diet and the overall way of life. Also e-cigs never were advertised to lower the cholesterol lvl.
How f.up is the evidence-based medicine in the US these days?
this Dr. Siegel is totaly doing this
for big F/T money.
What I read that [bad] title as saying is: e-cigs are as hard on your cholesterol levels as cigs are. And they might be. That' disappointing. It may be a known effect of nicotine in general. IDK. NRT's maybe too.The headline of the press release is:
"E-cigarettes take serious toll on heart health, not safer than traditional cigarettes."
They base this conclusion on the cholesterol levels by monitoring !45! e-cig users and comparing them to non smokers and dual user smokers.
Even if it was a 1K+ e-cig users tested, it doesn't prove anything, cholesterol levels are mostly affected by the diet and the overall way of life. Also e-cigs never were advertised to lower the cholesterol lvl.
How f.up is the evidence-based medicine in the US these days?
this Dr. Siegel is totaly doing this
Now, OVERALL they're safer on several other levels.......just maybe not cholesterol.
Sad face follows:
Pretty small study though. Needs a lot more work.
click-bait titles, articles, modern-media... meh.
Apparently this effect of nicotine has been known since at least 1986.
So now I'm thinking it's more junk science showing known effects in the realm of "hey, it's e-cig research".
Oral nicotine induces an atherogenic lipoprotein profile. - PubMed - NCBI
So now I'm thinking it's more junk science showing known effects in the realm of "hey, it's e-cig research".
Oral nicotine induces an atherogenic lipoprotein profile. - PubMed - NCBI
this Dr. Siegel is totaly doing this
????
Dr. Michael Siegel? He's on our side. He's a good guy. Unless I misread your post--if so, I apologize.
Atty, darling. Studies, studies... From the same source:
Nicotine: A Double-Edged Sword in Atherosclerotic Disease. - PubMed - NCBI
"However, recent studies have demonstrated that nicotine, at lower doses, may be beneficial to the cardiovascular system. With binding to specific nicotinic acetylcholine receptors, nicotine can induce migration and proliferation of vascular cells, and hence enhances angiogenesis. Therefore, these seemingly inconsistent properties of nicotine may in fact give rise to novel and efficacious management strategies of CVD."
A lot of things were known (or suspected and investigated) about nicotine for years.
Researchers Investigate (Horrors!) Nicotine's Potential Benefits
And this:
In New Calculus on Smoking, It’s Health Gained vs. Pleasure Lost
"WASHINGTON Rarely has the concept of happiness caused so much consternation in public health circles.
Buried deep in the federal government's voluminous new tobacco regulations is a little-known cost-benefit calculation that public health experts see as potentially poisonous: the happiness quotient. It assumes that the benefits from reducing smoking -fewer early deaths and diseases of the lungs and heart - have to be discounted by 70 percent to offset the loss in pleasure that smokers suffer when they give up their habit.
Experts say that calculation wipes out most of the economic benefits from the regulations and could make them far more vulnerable to legal challenges from the tobacco industry. And it could have a perverse effect, experts said. The more successful regulators are at reducing smoking, the more it hurts them in the final economic accounting."
????
Unless I misread your post--if so, I apologize.
I'm guessing she didn't read "The Rest of the Story" where Siegel states:
"Thus, this paper provides no evidence of any effect of vaping on cholesterol levels. That relationship is
"This is why I think that the conclusion of this paper (that e-cigarette use leads to an unhealthy cholesterol profile and that vaping is therefore just as dangerous as smoking in terms of heart health) is unwarranted and indicates a bias against e-cigarettes."
Oh, Dr. Gottlieb. While I agree with his assessment of the current crisis and its cause, I don't believe in bans, period. Especially any bans involving harm reduction products while cigarettes remain on the market and are just as accessible (or unaccessible) as e-cigarettes--pods or open system. The only concession I would be willing to make wrt Juul and such would be reducing nicotine levels in their pods from 59 mg/ml to something more sensible like 25 or 30 mg/ml. And adding pods with even lower nic levels like 12 and 18. If an adult smoker needs more than that, then they would have to go to the open system. Other than that, enforce the laws that we already have--no underage sales, no advertising to kids, etc.
And today we get this:
Trump administration wavers on ban of flavored e-cigarettes, FDA official says ‘no final answer’ now
“There is no final answer on the policy question, that’s why we continue to have these discussions internally,” Zeller said.
Keep calling the White House, folks.
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I'm not vilifying nic.
What I said was that the e-cig study and the effects on LDL are already well documented. As to how it all plays out, IDK.
This story is somewhat hopeful to vapers but it is also proof that there is a bipartisan effort to stop vaping. According to this story it sounds as if Trump is trying to have a balance between vapers and the "WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING" crowd. This is not just a Trump thing. It is a stupid politicians from both parties thing.
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