Officials report biggest fall in adult smoking in decades

[dave8944]

Didn't see a thread for this one yet...

Officials report biggest fall in adult smoking in decades

Even though this sharp decline's source is clear and obvious they still worry the opposite may be true:

As today's teenage e-cigarette users become adults in the next few years, "we may see 18-, 19- and 20-year olds pick up the habit," worried Dr. Jonathan Whiteson, a smoking cessation specialist at NYU Langone Medical Center in New York.

Still, he and others are optimistic in part because regulators are turning their attention to the potential dangers of e-cigarettes

 

[Just Me]

They keep going on and on about teenagers possibly getting addicted to nicotine and then progressing on to cigarettes. That's not how I see it. I think the ones who might go on to use burning tobacco do so because they just want to smoke and e-cigs are way too fiddly. I liked the actions of smoking early on, before I was really hooked, and I doubt I would have put up with the maintenance of e-cigs. Even after almost three years of being free of tobacco, I still resent the time-consuming aspects of vaping. It was much easier to light, smoke, and toss the .....

It's also really silly in my opinion to think they can absolutely prevent an underage person from getting their hands on an e-cig if that person really wants one. Kids always have older friends or family members that can get it for them. Do they think teens never drink? And I can guarantee there are a multitude of teens in this country right now who smoke the "other stuff", many more of those than some who are using e-cigs. Get real, bureaucrats, can you even think?

 

[Vaslovik]

It's why they are trying to kill off vaping, billions in cigarette revenues lost.

 

[Vaslovik]

They're worried young people who vape now will turn to regular cigarettes later.

I really don't think that's their worry at all. I think they are worried that young people just won't buy cigarettes if the far healthier alternative of vaping is available. They are desperate to get back the lost revenues on cigarettes, the health damage from which is well known, yet the big campaign is against vaping, not smoking while they tell us they just don't know the health risks of vaping. Meanwhile you can buy all the cigs you like anywhere.

Follow the money...

 

[Oliver]

I agree. Their logic is: "if A=C, and B=C, then A=B".... It is a valid point mathematically, but we're not talking mathematics. If Smoking = Nicotine, and Vaping = Nicotine, then Vaping is Smoking.... that's their logic. Apply it to anything else and it sounds absurd. If Walking=Travelling, and Driving=Travelling, then Walking=Driving... start selling Walking licenses... or... if Alcohol=Drinking, and Water=Drinking, then Alcohol=Water... Start raising the limit of water drinking to 21.

The Truth is..... It's not a mathematical equation. They have studied smoking, and how nicotine works through smoking. There has been little study on pure Nicotine itself separated from smoking. There has been some, and it is proven that although it is addicting, it's not as addicting as when taken from a cigarette. They have even been told that cigarettes ADD chemicals to Enhance the Nicotine... this was proven through several documents that they found a use for ammonia even though they knew it would enhance the nicotine (Ref) .

It is known that nicotine obtained from a cigarette is on a totally different level than just the straight nicotine itself. That fact needs to be publicized and made open. Nicotine is NOT a carcinogen, it does have some benefits to the body if taken moderately. (ref1) (ref2) (ref3). The main guilt that nicotine has, is it happens to be consumed by combustion with thousands of other chemicals. And those other chemicals cause cancer/lung disease.

In conclusion... people are convinced that cigarettes and nicotine are one and the same... which they're not. The FDA needs to realize this, and talk to scientists that have done the studies. In all honesty, I doubt they will due to the fact that they're paid quite well to keep those two on equal terms.

Everything you say is correct. But in the twisted world of science and public possibly, nothing is simple.

Here's the problem - while simultaneously acknowledging that nicotine is far safer than smoking, the FDA is also captured and feeding back into the biggest moral panic of our age: that a new epidemic of addiction is taking place amongst US youths. There is, of course, no evidence for this, and every reason to suspect that the opposite is in fact true.

Nevertheless, the FDA knows which way the wind blows, and is happy to use the cover to push through its regulatory capture of vape products. Remember, all regulatory agencies want to regulate, so this is not sinister - it's just a law of nature.

And the FDA's logic is perfect if you don't know the facts: "we'd rather smokers use nicotine alone, but we can't have adolescents falling prey to its effects" - in other words, it's perfectly acceptible for them to shut down the industry, because it will eventually figure out which products should remain due to the public health benefits to smokers and which ones won't appeal to adolescents.

They've shown no reason for us to believe this is remotely within their capabilities (or even in the realm of possibility), and the recent revelation that they pushed for a full flavor ban shows that they cannot understand why vaping works for people.

And here's the rub for Myers and his crew: in the same way that FDA cannot figure out why vape works for smokers, they'll also never be able to figure out what appeals to adolescents... So the brutal truth is that smokers lives will be traded for a threat against adolescents that hasn't manifested, and won't manifest ever.

It's almost unbelievable this has come to pass. But there we are. The stupid is strong.

 

[Captain Pegleg]

They're worried young people who vape now will turn to regular cigarettes later.

And they're happy that vaping is going to be regulated, harder to access.

So backwards, so nonsensical.

They could ban cigarettes, then poof, no more worry about future smokers! But nahhh that isn't really the issue for them...when they try to say it is, yet their logic is so faulty, it's just so easy to see through their thin cover over their real concern, moneyyyyy

 

[element77]

The first 5 minutes made me sick, I couldn't stomach any more of that snot filled, predisposed, drivel of a video.
The tobacco industry she refers to hasn't touched a single cent of mine in over 4 years...this coming from a guy who as a teenager would have thought nothing cooler than a camel tattoo to express my love of smoking. I would have walked ten miles for a camel 5 years ago...today those chains are broken.

 

[MrDripper]

All in all, I find the thundering silence emitting from the medical community in the U.S. regarding the RCP report quite interesting...

Of course they are going to be silent. If vaping was touted as a safer alternative to smoking cigarettes as it should be, less people would become sickly due to smoking cigarettes and there goes funding for the American Heart Association, the American Lung Association, the countless doctors who are specialists in cigarette-causing illnesses and each and every one of the little cogs in the Big Pharma machine.
At the end of the day, it all comes down to money, plain and simple. Too many people are going to see their wallets getting lighter and they are not happy about it.
The true shame in all of this is that the vaping community, strong as it is, does not have the money or the power of BT, BP of Uncle Sam. We simply can't win this fight.
Part of me wants to say 'Get in there and fight!' Then the other part of me figures 'what's the point?'

 

[Steamix]

"...worried Dr. Jonathan Whiteson, a smoking cessation specialist at NYU Langone Medical Center in New York. Still, he and others are optimistic in part because regulators are turning their attention to the potential dangers of e-cigarettes. Earlier this month, the Food and Drug Administration announced sweeping new rules ..."

Optimistic about exactly what, Doc ? Continued 'customer' influx or really more folks quitting ?

Worry less ( about vapers ) , read more ( about vaping ).

Well at least the article strives to pretend a neutral tone. We're making progress. A limping snail still can outpace us, but we're making progress.

All in all, I find the thundering silence emitting from the medical community in the U.S. regarding the RCP report quite interesting...

 

[NealBJr]

While this comes out we also see propaganda put out that people are turning away from vaping in droves. Well, one or the other is true, and it's been quite clear that BT and the state has lost a great deal to vaping all along. Billions of lost sales and taxes on cigarettes. $45 billion by one estimate. It's hardly surprising to see claims that the public is turning away from vaping in that context.

That's the "Doh" part... you take something that is literally hundreds of times more effective at getting people to quit smoking traditional cigarettes, and so far researchers are finding hundreds of times safer that traditional cigarettes AND probably hundreds of times safer than alternate ways of qitting (Chantix, etc)

Smoking: 500,000 deaths per year ( Reference )

Chantix deaths due to the suicidal tendencies: some estimate more than 500+ (we don't know for sure, they've proven to cover this up) ( Ref 1) ( Ref 2 )

Deaths do to aspirin/NSAIDs: 15,000 ( Ref ) (most published papers indicate percentages)

Deaths due to Alchohol : 88,000/year ( Ref )

Deaths due to Vaping: None

FDA's ruling: treat it like it was deadly..... WHY?

Added: For those who think that just not vaping is just as safe.... let me point out....

Deaths due to air pollution: 53,000 ( ref ).

 

[NealBJr]

my
I may be biased towards vaping, but I do believe the biggest increase in the decline of smoking is mainly due to vaping. You have to look at WHY teenagers smoke... to look cool and rebel against their parents. If you tell a child "don't do this".. when they're angry with you, they'll do it. It's just part of the teenage psyche. Teenagers are at a point where they're coming up with their own outlook on life, but are restricted by their parents. Smoking had the tough "bad boy" reputation for so long, so it naturally attracted teenagers to it.

Then along came vaping. Vaping started as being called Ecigarettes. They named it that way to attract smokers to try this new alternative. It was something new, and it was primarily unique to the younger culture. It is "their thing", and they were drawn to it. If you do a search for vaping videos, you'll notice a very high percentage of under 30 year old vapers... not many of us older folks vape. Where I work, The only ones interested in vaping are 18-25 year olds... .the older folks see it as smoking and try to even try to avoid the vapor if they're around me outside. It's just the demographics.

All that being said, I would rather the younger folks "rebel" by vaping rather than smoking. It is well known, but rarely talked about, that cigarettes have added chemicals that enhance the nicotine's affect. Us vapers know, that vaping does not lead to smoking, since they taste totally different. me, being an ex 20 year smoker, finds cigarettes to taste disgusting. I know, I've lit one up and coughed, then ran for the mouthwash to get the taste out. We know that, but the CDC doesn't. I know a few non smokers who took up vaping... guess what, they don't vape very often.. and if they forget about it, they go a few days without. If they would've tried smoking, you know that wouldn't have been the case.

I'm not a Tinfoil hat wearing alien chasing conspiracy theorist. I do believe that money is an issue here. Probably not directly involved or a conscious "ban vaping because we get more money from vaping". I believe the government is being guided by corporations who find vaping as a competition. Big pharma who make smoking cessation supports those unaware of the benefits of vaping, and the overall lack of scientific knowledge of the general public is what hurts us the most. Everyone opposed to vaping say "they said that smoking was safe before"... well, we didn't even have computers back then, and the research equipment to find out.. now we do, and so far, everything points out that vaping is MUCH SAFER. And I whole heartedly believe it's much less addicting than traditional cigarettes. CDC... prove me wrong... I dare you.

 

[mountaingal]

Our stupid government, should look at what the UK is doing. They found vaping was much healthier then smoking and now promote vaping to help people quit. You see, they decided vaping would save billions in health care costs. And since medical care is Government run, they are all for it.

 

[VNeil]

Is Nicotine Addictive ?

Despite the fact that the FDA is claiming nicotine is "highly addictive" in their current anti-vaping smear campaign, in 2013 they published this:

Federal Register | Modifications To Labeling of Nicotine Replacement Therapy Products for Over-the-Counter Human Use

Where they modified the labeling of OTC NRT products such as nic gum, patches and lozenges. Buried deep they had this to say...

"We also note that although any nicotine-containing product has the potential to be addicting, based on the available evidence, currently marketed OTC NRT products do not appear to have significant potential for abuse or dependence. A 2010 review of historical reports made to the Agency's Adverse Event Reporting System and to the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration's Drug Abuse Warning Network between 1984 and 2009 suggested that NRT products have a low potential for abuse. Several published studies have also found that the abuse liability and dependence potential of NRT products is low, especially compared to cigarettes (see West et al., 2000; Houtsmuller et al., 2002)."

Of course, the FDA is the best regulatory agency BP money can buy

 

[DC2]

But it ain't over, Oliver. So many people on the front lines battling this. It's pretty incredible.

So true Katmar.

Who would have expected to see this a few years ago...
American Enterprise Institute Hosts Discussion | Video | C-SPAN.org

A bunch of people in business attire from a public policy think tank supporting us.
Arguing for us, exposing the hypocrisy and the lies right there on C-SPAN.

We've been gaining momentum.
And I think we may very well win this thing.

The Legislative branch can take care of this thing if they so choose.
But if not, the Judicial branch can bring the hammer down.

We'll just have to see...

 

[MyMagicMist]

It's why they are trying to kill off vaping, billions in cigarette revenues lost.

Yep. 45 billion per 5 years if 9 million vape and do not spend $1,000 per year on tobacco product. One billion per 1 million vapers not spending $1,000 per yr on tobacco. I been learning to doodle with numbers a little better. Also been double checking with others. I'm not the brightest crayon in the box. The box though has all kinds of brightness so, i help average it out.

 

[Just Me]

Its simple its about cash. This is the Hijacking of an industry. First time I've seen this in my lifetime (30 years old)

I believe they tried to hijack the vitamin and supplement industry in the 90s. I didn't pay much attention to it then, but my mother mentioned it. Just last week, I watched some hearings about it, one where Raquel Welch testified before a Senate Committee in favor of leaving decisions about such things up to the consumer. I don't really know exactly what they were trying to do or how it came out, but I don't think FDA got what they were wanting.

 

[rideronthistrain]

Senator Ron Johnson of Wisconsin (R) recently used his authority as chairman of the Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs to demand answers from the FDA as to why they are going after the vaping industry. The FDA has until May 31 to provide answers: The request is a good read:

Senator Forces FDA to Explain Itself Over Harsh E-Cigarette Regulations

 

[crxess]

The way I see it is its more of a power struggle. BT,BP, and the gov are seeing $$$ which equals power slipping from their grasp. I think this FDA crap is just a way to raise the price of playing the game for mod and juice makers. If they cant afford to get all their products approved(which is out of their price range), then they will end up selling the business to someone who can afford it.(ie BT). So in the end the FDA regs end up lessened but BT ends up buying all US producers and then we can continue to vape but BT still gets the profit. Just my opinion but I'd love to be wrong.

The only WRONG in all of this is the FDA ever sticking their collective Noses in our Business.

 

[GrouchyOldGuy]

It seems painfully obvious to me also that not a one of those politicians either has a child or has raised a child(nanny took care of that). Because what they are doing only makes things worse. To vilify something whether its an object or an activity only makes it more interesting. Putting some pressure on the parents of underage kids who purchase ecigs, or stiff penalties to a clerk or shop that sells them makes for more sense than attempting to remove them from existence. But in the interest of childrens safety lets just bubble wrap the world. Wait. What happens when a child chokes on the bubble wrap? Then what or who do we blame?

Side note. If they are worried that kids that vape MAY progress to cigs. What would those kids be smoking now if they didn't have a vape? Cigarettes!!

 

[NealBJr]

I think they may well be in for a surprise as there will be many what do not return to tobacco. These not returning will also lobby and rally diligently against tobacco as well. This will create a further entrenched back lash the likes of which I doubt tobacco, pharmaceutical, medical, insurance industries here in America will ever hope to see recovery. They have already lost the war, long before the now of vaping too. It was lost when they decided to profit from death.

To clarify and to head off anyone putting words in my mouth. I'm not saying those who tend to the business of caring for the dead, as in funerals and the like ought not be granted some profit. I think perhaps if they were honest they could see clear to not take as much profit. Still, I'm not saying they should not be granted a proper wage for doing a service. My point above was discussing another form of person that profits on/from death.

I originally passed this up...but started thinking....

We can't label it as a smoking cessation device... it has not been proven to be so...
However, "vaping may lead to smoking." is the reason it's getting treated like a tobacco product and banned... it has not been proven so...

So, if it hasn't been proven to lead people to smoking, which hasn't been substantiated yet, then that's the same as giving someone a speeding ticket for driving a Mustang or Corvette... because they THINK it MIGHT.....

Condemning something before any adverse harm has been proven.... that's just a wtich hunt in my eyes.