The Ever Changing ... Prodigy V1 (still not even at V2 yet)

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fjames

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Just a thought for those following this thread - there's a 18350 li-ion (3.7V) cell available. I'll probably get around to trying some. In round numbers it should double the life of standard "123" cells. It's supposed to be a true 850mah capacity, where most r123 cells are over-rated in their capacity.

Many issues with 18350 - fit/charging/availability ... just what does the Prodigy do with 7V? etc., but worth look into maybe.
 

tescela

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Just a thought for those following this thread - there's a 18350 li-ion (3.7V) cell available. I'll probably get around to trying some. In round numbers it should double the life of standard "123" cells. It's supposed to be a true 850mah capacity, where most r123 cells are over-rated in their capacity.

Many issues with 18350 - fit/charging/availability ... just what does the Prodigy do with 7V? etc., but worth look into maybe.

I don't know s*** about electricity, so I'm going to borrow Walrus' terminology: would it be possible to regulate the output of two 18350's down to 5v and enjoy the extended battery life?
 

fjames

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I don't either, but this is what I know. There are a ton of flashlights with active regulation (not a resistor in other words) in this form factor. Problem is, I don't think you'd gain much in runtime since you only need to regulate it down a small amount. You'd gain something, but not much, certainly not enough to justify the increase (I assume) in price.

Now a side by side 18650 in parallel, actively regulated at say 3.8V might be interesting, but I don't know enough to do the math.
 

tescela

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I don't either, but this is what I know. There are a ton of flashlights with active regulation (not a resistor in other words) in this form factor. Problem is, I don't think you'd gain much in runtime since you only need to regulate it down a small amount. You'd gain something, but not much, certainly not enough to justify the increase (I assume) in price.

Now a side by side 18650 in parallel, actively regulated at say 3.8V might be interesting, but I don't know enough to do the math.

Thanks for your comments, fjames. This kind of thinking is always nice to see. If you aren't already participating in the modders' forum, I'd love to see you add your ideas to that group.

For me, new hardware is first and foremost about getting the benefits of 5v (vs. 3.7v)...specifically, the shorter draw and improved throat hit. The only way I can currently envision improving on the planned Prodigy V1 is if battery life were extended and/or the unit's size reduced.

Apparently, Steve is planning for V2 to be substantially smaller, so it will be interesting to see if he knows of a way to maintain the 5v (based on his comments, I think he does) AND increase battery life (I don't know if this is one of his objectives). He did mention the possibility of including some cool features with the V2. We will have to wait and see what features he has in mind.

From a hardware standpoint, PureSmoker is -- in my humble opinion -- leading the pack in terms of innovation.

Now I am waiting to see if Steve will re-introduce his e-juice lines, because being a one-stop shop for e-cigarette supplies would give PureSmoker a more pronounced (and profitable) competitive advantage. I am guessing that they may not go this route, because if the U.S. government moves against e-cigarettes, their assault will most likely have to focus on e-juice, since the hardware can be repackaged simply as personal vaporizers with non-nicotine uses. If that scenario unfolds, and the U.S. government chooses to ban the domestic sale of e-juice (as opposed to taking a "regulate and tax" approach), then it will only have destroyed yet another U.S. manufacturing industry (and missed an opportunity to protect consumers by standardizing e-juice purity), because e-juice sourcing will simply shift to a direct-import model. Hardware production is the high-probability bet to survive the advance of hostile legislation, and I think Steve understands this and has repositioned PureSmoker accordingly.

Of course, PureSmoker's fortunes largely depend on the Prodigy V1's rollout being successful. If there turns out to be a flaw in the Prodigy, PureSmoker could be sunk.

By the way, I only say that PureSmoker's fortune *largely* depend on a successful Prodigy V1 rollout, because I think they may have a sleeper hit on their hands with the 6' 20awg USBpass they apparently plan to launch in mid-June (and a 3' 20awg USBpass, if they choose to shift from their current 28awg version).
 
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fjames

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I don't care about cell life, I care about runtime. You're probably using the two terms as the same, but you have to be careful I think, as they mean something entirely different.

Anyhow, bigger cells = more runtime, at the same efficiency, so a side by side 18650 (or 17650 or 18500 or 17500) in series and resistored (same electrical configuration as the PV1) would drastically increase runtime. Doing it side by side would keep length in check.

Me, I want full regulation. My ideal, off the top of my head, would be a side by side 17500 (1100mah) regulated to 4.5V or so. Nice hit and no doubt an all day setup.

To give you idea of what's out there (not sure if it applies to vaping use) I have several high powered LED flashlights with multiple power levels, strobes and flashers all user set. I can set the power level, speed of strobe and all that kind of thing. It's annoying - click wrong and you get lost, but the stuff is out there to alter power with a simple click sequence.

How about that - personal vaporizer and emergency signaling device all in one :D
 

breakfastchef

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I have been trying to keep up with this thread and decided that Cash is trying way too hard to please too many vapers. I think it would be reasonable to produce and release a device, with specific pwer properties, period. Aftrr which accessories could be introduced to meet the needs of other folks. It seems absolutely crazy that Puresmoker has enough cash and time to cater to the most minor needs of every whim of ECF vapers. Cash, pick a product configuration and sell it!! Then introduce modifications, accessories, etc. later. Do not try to please everyone at once. Ordering is so confusing.
 

Sar

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I have been trying to keep up with this thread and decided that Cash is trying way too hard to please too many vapers. I think it would be reasonable to produce and release a device, with specific pwer properties, period. Aftrr which accessories could be introduced to meet the needs of other folks. It seems absolutely crazy that Puresmoker has enough cash and time to cater to the most minor needs of every whim of ECF vapers. Cash, pick a product configuration and sell it!! Then introduce modifications, accessories, etc. later. Do not try to please everyone at once. Ordering is so confusing.
I actually think Steve is being rather rational. If you read the earlier threads, he REALLY LOVED the original 6+v design, but still decided to drop it to 5v average (4.7v - 5.5v) for the final product, making the product probably more reliable, less eliquid-consuming, less likely to burn the atomizers once he has connectors for different atomizer models. I am sure it was a tough decision, but probably the most important one.

That he is listening to wishes of his customers (or future customers) makes him a good business man. The fact that some voice opinions about alternative products (designs) and he is able to react may bring benefits in the long run.
 

tescela

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I actually think Steve is being rather rational. If you read the earlier threads, he REALLY LOVED the original 6+v design, but still decided to drop it to 5v average (4.7v - 5.5v) for the final product, making the product probably more reliable, less eliquid-consuming, less likely to burn the atomizers once he has connectors for different atomizer models. I am sure it was a tough decision, but probably the most important one.

That he is listening to wishes of his customers (or future customers) makes him a good business man. The fact that some voice opinions about alternative products (designs) and he is able to react may bring benefits in the long run.

Agreed, Sar. :thumb:
 

StratOvation

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I have been trying to keep up with this thread and decided that Cash is trying way too hard to please too many vapers. I think it would be reasonable to produce and release a device, with specific pwer properties, period. Aftrr which accessories could be introduced to meet the needs of other folks. It seems absolutely crazy that Puresmoker has enough cash and time to cater to the most minor needs of every whim of ECF vapers. Cash, pick a product configuration and sell it!! Then introduce modifications, accessories, etc. later. Do not try to please everyone at once. Ordering is so confusing.

Chef,
Steve has started getting the website updated with info regarding the recent changes and "Final product spec.s". That should clear up alot of the ordering confusion.

I actually think Steve is being rather rational. If you read the earlier threads, he REALLY LOVED the original 6+v design, but still decided to drop it to 5v average (4.7v - 5.5v) for the final product, making the product probably more reliable, less eliquid-consuming, less likely to burn the atomizers once he has connectors for different atomizer models. I am sure it was a tough decision, but probably the most important one.

That he is listening to wishes of his customers (or future customers) makes him a good business man. The fact that some voice opinions about alternative products (designs) and he is able to react may bring benefits in the long run.

I agree Sar. Steve hasn't said so... But I gotta think that some alterations to the original Prodigy may likely have been initiated by forum members asking questions that He simply hadn't considered based on His use of it.

Like all the questions regarding use with carts at higher voltages... He stated that He hadn't tried it with a cart. But the questions indicated that some folks would intend on using carts...So He started testing with carts... Maybe one of the factors He used in deciding to drop to 5V?

Or the questions regarding how much Juice it consumes... Based on His more recent statements... I don't think He really noticed how often He was actually dripping, until the question was asked and he took note, then realized... "I hate drippin constantly!":shock:

I believe Steve is committed to generating the Best possible product he can and if He has overlooked a potential issue that comes to light Prior to starting production... It's simple common sense and good business practice to attempt to deal with it before vs. after shipping to customers. JMHO

Mike
 

CaSHMeRe

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Thanks Sar, Tesc, StratO,

The #1 reason on the design switch was try and please 90% of the ecig community. 3.7v is simply NOT cutting it IMO, and 6-8V (loaded/unloaded) is just TOO much for a majority of the population ... SO ... we did something about it. We started testing different resistors/voltage regulators - that would atleast fit - A series of different diodes, and we finally arrived at what we felt was the *Sweet* spot for all atomizers ... Still Dripper Friendly, Still Cart Friendly, and still vapor/throat hit/power friendly :)

Its also nice to see, the Prodigy V1 and USBpass utilizing pretty close to the same voltage (+/- .5v) ...
 

Sar

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Thanks Sar, Tesc, StratO,

The #1 reason on the design switch was try and please 90% of the ecig community. 3.7v is simply NOT cutting it IMO, and 6-8V (loaded/unloaded) is just TOO much for a majority of the population ... SO ... we did something about it. We started testing different resistors/voltage regulators - that would atleast fit - A series of different diodes, and we finally arrived at what we felt was the *Sweet* spot for all atomizers ... Still Dripper Friendly, Still Cart Friendly, and still vapor/throat hit/power friendly :)

Its also nice to see, the Prodigy V1 and USBpass utilizing pretty close to the same voltage (+/- .5v) ...

Sorry Steve, that might have pleased 90% of the community maybe two months ago, but by the time you ship it will probably only please 75%. If you really want to go 90% you need to tell us when is the connector for 510 atomizer going to be available. :D

Please, at least a hint...
 

scintar

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I don't know s*** about electricity, so I'm going to borrow Walrus' terminology: would it be possible to regulate the output of two 18350's down to 5v and enjoy the extended battery life?
When you add a resistor it is to lower the voltage down. When the resistor is doing it's job it absorbs the extra power and produces heat which must dissipate somewhere. I would think the resistor would get to hot in an enclosed space for this to be possible. If it cannot cool. It will stop working and unit failure IE. Burn up atomizers will occur. Even the one watt resistor that I believe he is using will not handle the task.
 

CaSHMeRe

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Will the 3.7v CR123a fit or work in the VI or is it to long and powerful?

Should work assuming specs are the same as Tenergy :)

When you add a resistor it is to lower the voltage down. When the resistor is doing it's job it absorbs the extra power and produces heat which must dissipate somewhere. I would think the resistor would get to hot in an enclosed space for this to be possible. If it cannot cool. It will stop working and unit failure IE. Burn up atomizers will occur. Even the one watt resistor that I believe he is using will not handle the task.

2W .5ohm Resistor used ... I have yet to even feel the resistor get warm let alone hot ... :)
 

CaSHMeRe

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[/b]
Cool. I could not tell in the pics. That's good to know

Yeah ... its surprised us quite a bit how robust these little resistors are ... We had one hooked up and put this along with several other types (including diodes and diff size resistors) and they all did surprisingly well ... This one fit the power need just perfect, thus, we used it :)
 

scintar

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Yeah ... its surprised us quite a bit how robust these little resistors are ... We had one hooked up and put this along with several other types (including diodes and diff size resistors) and they all did surprisingly well ... This one fit the power need just perfect, thus, we used it :)
Cool man, had me a little worried about 1W. When you told me it was 2.5 made my mind up.
Just orderd :)
BTW. it is using 123a's@ 3V I want to order some extras from DX
 
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CaSHMeRe

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Cool man, had me a little worried about 1W. When you told me it was 2.5 made my mind up.
Just orderd :)

LOL ... Appreciate it scintar! Hope you enjoy bud! :)

Besides the resistor ... i'm quite happy about the final tact we finally picked out ... the throw is awesome, and I have yet to burn one out since switching to these and I put them through the ringer :D
 

TDM

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LOL ... Appreciate it scintar! Hope you enjoy bud! :)

Besides the resistor ... i'm quite happy about the final tact we finally picked out ... the throw is awesome, and I have yet to burn one out since switching to these and I put them through the ringer :D

So thats why they are so amall you send them through a ringer to shrink them. Ingenious
 
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