Tobacco extraction using heated Ethanol

[aceswired]

I can't get over how clear my extracts are after freeze filtering. I'm wondering how they'll perform without further filtering. Here's what I did after extracting:

1) Filter through coffee filter, gently squeezing the tobacco to get the good stuff inside the flake
2) Freeze for 48 hours. Filter (inside the freezer) through coffee filter. Allow to return to room temperature.
3) Freeze for another 24 hours. Filter again.

My plan was to buy some 1.5 micron paper on Amazon for the final filtration, then to reduce. Probably still will. But as I look at this, it's just crystal clear. I'm seriously wondering if micron filtration is even necessary at this point.

 

[Bunnykiller]

make up a small batch and try it... see if the gunk factor is an issue

 

[aceswired]

Yeah think I will. Will work on reduction today.

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[Exchaner]

Hi everyone, Nice thread. I have been lurking around for a while and ready to do my first extraction. I could use some guidance before I start...

I have three different kinds of dry tobacco leaves purchased from LeafOnly. Since my supply of PGA is limited to 220 ml right now, do I have enough to complete the extraction? I do have an ample supply of EverClear at 75.5% though.

The three bottles I am using are approx 1.5 inches in diameter. Will I be OK if I use an amount of tobacco approximately 6-7 cigarettes' worth? Probably 1-2 inches high when put inside the bottles. Am I using enough to yield an extract after filtration?

I have lightly washed the leaves to remove dirt and other unwanted particles. Do I crush them when dry, or soak them as they are? What about the stems? Remove them?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Str8vision]

Are your bottles wide mouth like a jar or narrow mouth like 60ml juice bottles? Narrow mouth containers aren't well suited for the extraction process because it's difficult to get the saturated tobacco out of them. A container that is 1.5" in diameter and 2.5" tall will hold around 55ml of fluid so if tobacco were included that same container might still hold perhaps 40ml of extraction solvent. If so, 40ml of extraction solvent should yield around 30ml of filtered extract when taking into account the loss to filters and tobacco. 30ml of extract is more than enough to play with, I wouldn't make larger batches until you find a tobacco and extraction process you really like.

Most of my extractions are experiments in method, solvent and or tobacco type. When conducting an "experiment" my normal batch size is around 1/4 ounce of tobacco to ~40ml of extraction solvent. I use 4 oz canning jars (jelly jars), they're made to withstand heat, vacuum and pressure and are just $10 a dozen (lids and rings included), at Walmart. After separating solvent from tobacco and filtering I end up with around 30ml of extract so I lose 25% of the extraction solvent to the tobacco and filters. When extracting a tobacco I already know I like, I process 1 ounce of it in around 150ml of solvent. After separating and filtering I end up with around 130ml of extract so the loss percentage decreases with larger batch sizes.

I extracted sun dried organic tobacco leaves once, the results tasted pretty anemic and a bit like hay mixed with a very light, nondescript tobacco nuance. I've come to believe the curing, fermenting and casing process used on tobaccos are every bit as important to extracted flavor as the type or blend of tobacco itself. I would ribbon cut the leaves, removing the stems. Let them dry before extraction to enhance PGA absorption.

 

[Exchaner]

Thanks Str8, it seems I do have enough PGA to go with. My bottles are all wide mouth cylindrical - 1.5 inches wide, 3.5 inches tall, probably around 60 ml. The dry tobacco will probably occupy around 1.5 inches on the bottom. Should I fill up the rest of the bottle with PGA, or just 1-2 inches above the tobacco? I probably should fill almost to the top since otherwise I will not have enough liquid for filtration. I can always evaporate the excess - or use more extract in my final mix. Hmmm.... Maybe I should use more than 1.5 inches of tobacco. Either way, I can aways evaporate the excess - or use more extract in my final mix.

BTW, I asked this question in another thread. If leaf tobaccos are not well suited for extraction, then how to explain the popularity of Big Spirit sold by NET.Com. It is made from cigarette tobacco.

 

[Str8vision]

I always lightly pack the tobacco in the container and pour just enough solvent to cover it adding a little extra for absorption, perhaps 5 - 10% more. You're right though, with PGA it's not too important as you can always evaporate off any excess and I always reduce mine by at least 50 - 75% before calling it done. This reduction concentrates the extract allowing for a much smaller percentage of it (and alcohol base), to be used when mixing.

Big spirit, Organic spirit and Speaking spirit (excellent NETs), are all extracted from American spirit cigarette tobaccos made by the Santa Fe Natural tobacco company. Their tobaccos are advertised as being certified organic, chemical additive free and 100% American grown (which is great), but their tobacco is still cured and fermented like all smoking tobaccos are. Curing and fermenting doesn't necessarily involve chemicals it's just the way tobacco is dried and processed for use in pipes, cigarettes and cigars. It's a necessary step for reducing the chlorophyll content in the leaf making it more palatable when smoked. Combinations of steam, heat and pressure are often involved but manufacturers are very tight lipped about specific technical details of their processes. The exact same Burley tastes completely different when sampling air cured -VS- fire or flue cured versions.

 

[Boxster]

Thanks Str8, it seems I do have enough PGA to go with. My bottles are all wide mouth cylindrical - 1.5 inches wide, 3.5 inches tall, probably around 60 ml. The dry tobacco will probably occupy around 1.5 inches on the bottom. Should I fill up the rest of the bottle with PGA, or just 1-2 inches above the tobacco? I probably should fill almost to the top since otherwise I will not have enough liquid for filtration. I can always evaporate the excess - or use more extract in my final mix. Hmmm.... Maybe I should use more than 1.5 inches of tobacco. Either way, I can aways evaporate the excess - or use more extract in my final mix.

BTW, I asked this question in another thread. If leaf tobaccos are not well suited for extraction, then how to explain the popularity of Big Spirit sold by NET.Com. It is made from cigarette tobacco.

My PG extracts of American Spirit, American Spirit Perique, Nat Sherman Brown pack & MCD have all turned out exactly as what NET.com sells.

I just cover the tobacco about a 3/8th inch. Check the jar after a day and top off as needed. The tobacco will swell a bit and the extraction medium level will drop as the tobacco absorbs the PG or PGA.

 

[Boxster]

I always lightly pack the tobacco in the container and pour just enough solvent to cover it adding a little extra for absorption, perhaps 5 - 10% more. You're right though, with PGA it's not too important as you can always evaporate off any excess and I always reduce mine by at least 50 - 75% before calling it done.

You only reduce by 50 -75%?
My first PGA extraction I reduced about 80% and it still had a strong alcohol taste. My next extraction I reduced by 90% and turned out much better.

 

[Str8vision]

You only reduce by 50 -75%?
My first PGA extraction I reduced about 80% and it still had a strong alcohol taste. My next extraction I reduced by 90% and turned out much better.

I regularly use mine alcohol and all but if I can taste the alcohol, even just a little, further reduction is forthcoming. I only vape flavored NET and normally use just one drop of extract per ml of juice, most of the time I can't perceive the alcohol. Could just be my old worn out taste buds though.

For those that can or do taste alcohol or that just don't like the odor I'd suggest transferring the flavor into PG or VG. Once you've reduced the extract mix it with PG or VG. Once mixed gently heat the mixture (140F), in a shallow open container and evaporate the PGA off.

 

[Mattdogg]

Well, Here we go:

Let's do some organic burley:

Efff it, LET'S TOAST IT!

Hi broiler untill it just started smoking. Oops! Or was it a happy accident?

While we got the Crock Pot going, how about some Virginia as well?

I toasted it a bit too....

Covered with some %96 PGA and in we go. Got other jar lids on the bottom of the P so nothing burns. LOW setting for an hour, then I'm going to the KEEP WARM setting.

Results in a few days.

Thanks, Straight for the idea!

 

[Boxster]

I regularly use mine alcohol and all but if I can taste the alcohol, even just a little, further reduction is forthcoming. I only vape flavored NET and normally use just one drop of extract per ml of juice, most of the time I can't perceive the alcohol. Could just be my old worn out taste buds though.

I am all net all of the time, but I just recently started dabbling with some hybrids.
Sutliff Vanilla Custard with 1-2% Capella Vanilla Custard flavoring added, or Sultiff Coffee with cappuccino & caramel flavoring.

 

[Exchaner]

My PG extracts of American Spirit, American Spirit Perique, Nat Sherman Brown pack & MCD have all turned out exactly as what NET.com sells.
.

Is that with pg alone or combined with PGA? Heat/no heat?

 

[Mattdogg]

Ok, here's my planned reduction:

I'm going to take a small amount om my extract (10ml) and add 10 ml of PG, so now I have 20ml of a 50/50 PGA/PG solution. I was going to microwave it untill it reduces back to 10ml. Does anyone see any problems with this? Will i set my house on fire?

 

[Boxster]

Is that with pg alone or combined with PGA? Heat/no heat?

I just used a 6 week cold PG extraction.

 

[Exchaner]

Ok, here's my planned reduction:

I'm going to take a small amount om my extract (10ml) and add 10 ml of PG, so now I have 20ml of a 50/50 PGA/PG solution. I was going to microwave it untill it reduces back to 10ml. Does anyone see any problems with this? Will i set my house on fire?

You will be busy at least half a day - 5-8 seconds at the time - assuming of course that nothing explodes on you.

 

[aceswired]

It isn't going to explode. People seem to think ethanol is nitroglycerin. It's not. It an burn at 50% or higher. But it's not TNT. It can only ignite as fast as its oxygen supply. That said, the microwave plan is folly. Just put it in a hot water bath. It doesn't take long.

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[Exchaner]

Where did I say it was TNT ......? Maybe "explode" wasn't the right word, but pg and vg are both flammable, not to mention pga. I have had wicks ignite on me while pulsating at a modest 10 watts - no pga involved.

Do what you like, but when people read your post, some automatically assume is safe to nuke their juice - just because they saw it on the ECF.

 

[Ian444]

Regarding the discussion earlier on jar sizes for extraction, I use 30ml jars for all my extractions, with about 5gm (1/6 oz) of tobacco max and around 20ml solvent. I net around 12 to 14ml extract which makes approx 90 to 110ml of ejuice. This is the small end of the scale, if someone gave me a piece of cigar the size of a thumbnail I could make an extract from it (and have), this size works for me

 

[Bunnykiller]

2 things to consider.... toasting your tobacco can result in a harsh end product... and when microwaving a pga/PG or VG mix do it at very short time sessions... 3-5 seconds at a time... you want to boil off the PGA only, once the PGA is gone, it is still possible to overheat the PG/VG portion of the juice to well over 300F degrees... and it doesnt take long to do it in a MW...
I made the mistake of doing an 8 second run on a sample ( 3rd try) and it melted the bottle the juice was in....
( I still smelled PGA in the juice even after 2 8 second runs so I figured a 3rd try would do it... it did it alright )

be careful in mircowaving large amounts of PGA extract in the MW, the amount of ethanol fumes inside the MW can become explosive enuf to blow the door clean off the oven if there is a chance for ignition... the magnetron does have a coil in it that glows red hot.... and, it is open to the air inside the MW....