Why do people who stop vaping go back to normal cigarettes?

[Robino1]

For starters: What in the heck does "facepalm" mean??? (What can I say - I'm old!....)

As others have said, everyone's different; but, for me, I had no intention of switching when I started vaping. I saw it as ONLY a way to "get my fix" whenever and wherever I darned well felt like it. My switching was entirely involuntary (hence, my username.) I just found myself unable to go back to my analogs after just a few days of not being able to (comfortably) roll. Exclusively vaping during that time was just an alternative to my hands hurting any worse than they already were. (Cold weather does that to them.) I fully intended to return to smoking, as soon as my hands straightened back out; so, there was ZERO pressure or anxiety about switching. It was simply a matter of convenience, which removed the psychological factors. Once I was able to roll a batch, I started doing so; but, found that they tasted so terrible compared to my juice that I just didn't want them.

One factor in the above might be that my juice (1/2 clove and 1/2 orange/pineapple) was close to my analogs (I smoked unprocessed, leaf tobacco RYO's, with ground clove mixed in) for me to like the taste; but, different enough that my tastebuds went "WTH!?!?!" when I tried to go back. Also, since I didn't get into vaping as a means of quitting, my juices were all VERY high nicotine; and, gave me an even better "fix" than my analogs did. Over the past month, I'm finding that I'm having to mix them down with lower nic level juices; but, that's largely because I do chain vape most of the time. (I chain smoked my analogs, except for when I was really busy.) If my analogs didn't taste so bad to me right now, the mere thought of quitting would have me smoking. I have @1,000 pounds of real, unprocessed, leaf tobacco just sitting out in a storage trailer, IF I ever get back to it tasting decent to me; so, I have one heck of a "security blanket."

This leads to another point: I've been smoking UNPROCESSED tobacco exclusively since '99, which is an advantage that very few folks have. Manufactured "tobacco" has more chemicals in it than it has actual tobacco - it's basically a papermaking process! I don't even want to think about what kind of chemical garbage they put in manufactured cigarettes! I know that when I tried to smoke one (after having smoked about 3 packs a day of them for many years), about 5 or 6 day after getting my first case of flue-cured, it tasted like it had been soaked in floor stripper!!! I could TASTE NOTHING BUT all the chemicals. I wound up putting it out after just a couple of drags, giving the rest of the pack to my friend's wife, and going out to the car to get my RYO's... I'm not sure how to help those who are more addicted to the other chemicals than they are to the nicotine...

One other thing that might help folks is having back-ups for EVERYTHING... I only got into this in Feb. (couldn't say exactly when); but, not counting the 3 cigalikes I'd initially gotten, I've got 4 batteries (the original 650, the 1100 I upgraded to when I realized that I needed a spare, and the 2 1350's that I ordered shortly after that, for even more security); an assortment of clearomizers and tanks (partially as the result of searching for gear that'll hold up to my juice); and, a supply of juice that could last me probably at least 6 months - at least. Why??? For the same reason that I went back and bought 3 more 440 pound cases of the real tobacco, back in '03 - the prospect of "getting caught without" results in the equivalent of a panic attack... For someone just making the switch (and actually wanting to switch), this could (potentially) be misinterpreted as a craving for an analog...

Will l ever quit? I really don't see it ever happening; but, the ONLY way it would ever happen would be if it just happened to happen. I've been a hard-core smoker since 1970; and, I lost ALL interest in even trying to quit back when push began to try to force folks to quit. I see vaping as just a better tasting "cigarette" that no one can give me any crap about... As such, it removes all the the "quitting angst" that seems to lead so many folks back to smoking analogs. I'm guessing that folks going into vaping with the intent of quitting might be "shooting themselves in the foot;" but, if they'd take a lot more casual attitude about it, they might well find themselves just gradually reducing the nicotine level and eventually finding themselves down to such a low level that going to 0% is no big deal.

This might only help a small percentage of folks; but, for that small percentage, this kind of an attitude might be the ONLY attitude that'll work...

When I started vaping I still smoked during the transition. I never placed a "quit time" limit on myself. The only goal I had in mind was to not buy another carton of cigs. After the carton I had was gone, I wasn't going to buy another one. That carton had 7 packs still in it when I tossed it out before moving from Philly to Florida. From October to February it sat there without a change in how many we're in there.

I think when you tell yourself that you are doing this to quit, it triggers a defense in the brain and the cigs become more powerful. I read this all the time on ECF: COUNT THE ONES YOU DON'T HAVE, NOT THE ONES YOU DO. It takes the pressure off to quit and becomes more like: Well look at me! See how good I'm doing?!

It is a HUGE deal to cut way back. Never discount the accomplishment of cutting back and NEVER think of it as failing. If we think of it as failing, where do we get the incentive to continue?

 

[mkbilbo]

I read this all the time on ECF: COUNT THE ONES YOU DON'T HAVE, NOT THE ONES YOU DO.

I'm a big fan and advocate of this myself. Positive reinforcement works better.

And since a lot of us smoke to relieve stress, stressing yourself over quitting is kind of counter productive I would think...

 

[Mikeh380]

I'm a noob and have been analog free for almost a week. I still carry a pack of cigarettes with me... just in case. So far I haven't needed to resort to analogs but if I can't find a combination that works for me, I may just box this hardware up. I'm now getting so frustrated that I'm considering if this hassle is worth it. I just need something that is simple and works. With real cigarettes, I would just step outside, suck down a Paul Mall and get back to work.

I like not stinking and the many choices of flavors with vaping, but I can't seem to get that satisfying fix with it. When I inhale like I'm tuggin on a cigarette, there seems to be very little taste. When I puff on it like smoking a cigar, I get a more flavor but I don't seem to get the satisfaction like I do with an analog. Ether way, I can't seem to get enough like I do with an analog.

Another problem I'm having is the first hit or two seem to be solid but after that, hits seem to dry out. It doesn't seem to matter which carto or clearo I use, I seem to get the same results. This wouldn't be all that bad, if three or four minutes of puffing satisfied my fix but, I find myself wanting to vape nonstop. It's almost like I've gone from half a pack a day to chain vaping. At least with analogs I could fill my fix every hour and a half or so. The exception to this has been with NJOY disposables. They seem to do the job well, I just don't like spending 9 bucks a pop every two days.

I keep reading that the most important thing is getting the right juice for an individuals subjective taste. I DO understand that. It takes about a week to get juice delivered and now I'm finding out that it needs to sit, (seep) for another week before you'll know what it actually tastes like.

Does anyone find that they can take a few puffs and be good for a an hour or more?

 

[mkbilbo]

I'm a noob and have been analog free for almost a week. I still carry a pack of cigarettes with me... just in case. So far I haven't needed to resort to analogs but if I can't find a combination that works for me, I may just box this hardware up. I'm now getting so frustrated that I'm considering if this hassle is worth it. I just need something that is simple and works. With real cigarettes, I would just step outside, suck down a Paul Mall and get back to work.

I like not stinking and the many choices of flavors with vaping, but I can't seem to get that satisfying fix with it. When I inhale like I'm tuggin on a cigarette, there seems to be very little taste. When I puff on it like smoking a cigar, I get a more flavor but I don't seem to get the satisfaction like I do with an analog. Ether way, I can't seem to get enough like I do with an analog.

Another problem I'm having is the first hit or two seem to be solid but after that, hits seem to dry out. It doesn't seem to matter which carto or clearo I use, I seem to get the same results. This wouldn't be all that bad, if three or four minutes of puffing satisfied my fix but, I find myself wanting to vape nonstop. It's almost like I've gone from half a pack a day to chain vaping. At least with analogs I could fill my fix every hour and a half or so. The exception to this has been with NJOY disposables. They seem to do the job well, I just don't like spending 9 bucks a pop every two days.

I keep reading that the most important thing is getting the right juice for an individuals subjective taste. I DO understand that. It takes about a week to get juice delivered and now I'm finding out that it needs to sit, (seep) for another week before you'll know what it actually tastes like.

Does anyone find that they can take a few puffs and be good for a an hour or more?

Steeping for a week isn't a "hard and fast" rule. It's better for DIY and "boutique", hand crafted liquids (the more "made to order" it is, the more you'll want to steep). The more "manufactured" ones, I don't bother. I just shake the bottle often. Usually when I go to fill a carto. I'm going to get ahead a bit on liquids and let my favorites steep a bit before using but it's not something I do regularly.

What set up are you using and how are you filling your cartos? I dunno clearos myself (others do) but I've found with cartos, I can get a nice, long use by using the "push" method (also known as, heh, the "condom" method). Then letting the carto sit a while. I've gotten in the habit of doing fills before bed and letting them sit overnight. I get some nice vapor and pretty long lasting flavor that way. And I can "chain vape" at times. Especially writing posts like this.

During the day, I "rotate" cartos. I have three ready in the mornings then when I run out on one, fill it, let it sit, use one of the others.

I think, speculating here, letting them sit a while is letting the juice permeate the carto filling better? I wasn't happy with the fill if I tried using the carto immediately.

The other thing is the base liquid mix and nic level of your juices. Pall Malls are "full flavor" and fairly high in nicotine content. What level of nicotine is your e-liquid? Maybe you need higher?

The PG/VG mix is important to finding what you like. It's something that's purely subjective and you have to try some combinations to see what works for you but PG is generally said to produce better flavor and throat hit while VG is known generally for vapor production. I lean toward VG because I prefer vapor over throat hit. You may be the reverse. I've settled mostly on a 50/50 mix of the two. That seems to be just about right for my tastes.

Lots of other factors I could think of that could be affecting your experience. I'll cut this off here and just suggest you kick it around with the folks here. Lots of people who are way more experienced than I am around ECF. Everything I've learned, I learned here!

Oh, one thing I could suggest that maybe you could try is I found at first that I needed a regular once in a while (especially after waking) to get the nicotine quickly. Nicotine absorption through the lungs (as cigs do) is much faster than vaping which is absorbed through the mouth and nose. I found that for a while, I seemed to need that "quick fix" then could "coast" on vaping.

If you have to do both for a while, big deal. I did or do. Over the month I've been vaping, I've come down from 1.5 to 2 packs a day to now one cig at most per day with yesterday being the first completely cig free day. Still have most of a pack in the kitchen. Don't fight myself if I just gotta, gotta have a "real one" (that's still stuck in my brain, that cigs are "real" and vaping ain't). But the trend has been downward over time so I'm happy.

Not everybody walks away from cigs the first day. Some do, others don't...

 

[amarat]

I dont know, I now like more e-cig than analog cig.

 

[alex8039]

First of all forget about perfection. That's a HUGE accomplishment. One day you'll wake up and find vaping to be more enjoyable. Give yourself a pat on the back and forget about tomorrow. If I worried about the next day I can almost guarantee I'd be living in the streets drinking 4 Aces.


My wife and I took a self improvement course decades ago. I was skeptical but it had helped my wife get thru some very tough times so to show support I enrolled...at one point they told us to think about ALL the worrisome issues in our lives for 5 mins. After 5 mins the instructor asked if anything had changed with those issues- of course nothing had changed except my stress level.
Are things better than they were for you 2 days ago? When I first got clean and sober I took the smallest and tiniest of steps to achieve my goal- was told by by a number of people to whom I'm forever grateful to give myself credit for those "baby steps". It's all about the journey being stress free and as enjoyable as possible. You deserve to give yourself kudos for your achievements thus far. I certainly do


She broke her wrist- simple enuff. Thankfully the Therapists diagnosed her as having RSD- a chronic pain syndrome- VERY VERY PAINFUL.
RSD - Reflex Sympathetic Dystrophy
She HATES pills but was on oxycontin for 2 yrs- daily rehab for 1 yr. had to apply her makeup and curl her hair each day. She's now 80% recovered. All she did was sleep, eat and exercise for the first yr.
The therapists recommended she purchase a Tens Unit- a controversial electronic gadget. Because of the intense pain her brain was becoming "wired" to that pain. The Tens Unit would send diff electrical impulses to her brain to prevent this re wiring. I know there are Tens skeptics out there but my wife swears by it in relieving her pain.

Realize also it takes at least 2 weeks for the alkaloids to vacate our system. I believe they are far more addictive than the nicotine.
Scientists did a study. They fed rats nicotine until they were "addicted" and placed a bowl of nic in the cage- rats wouldn't self medicate. Next they addicted the rats to nic+ alkaloids and placed a bowl of it in the cage. Rats made a beeline to it and immediately began self medicating.
What we are all doing is INCREDIBLE and we all have to give ourselves credit for this feat.

That's some good advice about taking baby steps, I try to remind myself of it but keep forgetting lol. Everyday there's a new mindset I try to enforce but end up forgetting them. Interesting about the tens unit, I wonder if it could have some benefits to mental health, like dealing with depression.

Ahh I see, I knew it takes 3 or so weeks for nicotine receptors to diminish but didn't know about alkaloids taking that long. I worry tho if there will always be a reward pathway for them ingrained in the brain, like why some people here always report missing something. It's interesting how some people can abolish this pathway and others are always on the edge of relapse because of it.

But I'm definitely over thinking, I need to keep reminding myself to not take life so seriously

 

[merrick92]

The one ting I would point out,although slightly existential, is if you did understand why they could smoke analogs after vaping, you'd probably be doing it yourself. The fact that you don't 'get it' means your not wired like those that do 'get it'. Sort of like asking "why are we here?", if we weren't here,we couldn't ask ourselves that question .
I still smoke a few a day right now. My wife smokes,trying to get her to switch over. We have a rolling machine sitting 5 feet away. It's tough when its sitting right in front of me to say no thank you.

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

That's some good advice about taking baby steps, I try to remind myself of it but keep forgetting lol. Everyday there's a new mindset I try to enforce but end up forgetting them. Interesting about the tens unit, I wonder if it could have some benefits to mental health, like dealing with depression.

Ahh I see, I knew it takes 3 or so weeks for nicotine receptors to diminish but didn't know about alkaloids taking that long. I worry tho if there will always be a reward pathway for them ingrained in the brain, like why some people here always report missing something. It's interesting how some people can abolish this pathway and others are always on the edge of relapse because of it.

But I'm definitely over thinking, I need to keep reminding myself to not take life so seriously

I just having a funny feeling you're going to do okay...just based on your obvious research YOU DESERVE it and more. Some look at vaping as a hobby while some, like myself, view it as a smoking cessation prog...most important we all enjoy the journey and although it's not a hobby I really enjoy the tinkering and research involved....maybe it is my hobby??

 

[Mikeh380]

What set up are you using and how are you filling your cartos?

I drip the juice in and watch it soak in. When it starts to 'puddle' around the barrel at the top of the filler, I stop and let it soak in for a few minutes. I tried the condom method, but the juice didn't seem to be soaking in. Maybe I should research that part some more.

My Hardware; iTaste MVP, eGo (650mAh), 510 atomizers, Moonbeam Clearos, iClear15's, iClear30, Kanger eVod's and Boge SR & LR carto's. The juices I've mostly tried are 70/30 and 12mg of nic. I've had a couple @18mg of nic but I wasn't fond of the flavor to give it a chance.

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll putz with the carto's some more and try the methods that you like.

BTW - I took a drag off my wife's analog the other day and was shocked at how horrible it tasted. Like I just licked a plate of cigarette ashes. I guess I was so surprised because after the last time I 'quit' and had my first analog, it was just as fantastic as the one I had 6 months prior. Now after just a few days, the same analog was unbearable.

 

[Leal]

I know my relapse with cigarettes had a lot of variables involved. I had been without smoking and vaping for a year. When my daughter was five months old I started smoking again due to unaddressed post partum depression, severe sleep deprivation, and an extremely high stress career. If I had enough time in my day for a shower I was lucky. Fiddling with e cigs wasn't an option I could even consider. It's easier to open a pack and light.

Then I got a prepaid cc from my mother in law for my birthday. I did a lot of research and found a good simple ego set to restart vaping. Now I am happier and slightly more sane. My plan is to slowly ween nic level down and even stop vaping. But I will always keep an emergency stash just in case.

 

[BCCincinnati]

My problem was not having the back-ups. Once you start back to the analogs it's even harder to stop than the first time in my opinion.

Now that I'm back to vaping I'm making sure to keep extra everything around so that day will never come again.

 

[mkbilbo]

Scientists did a study. They fed rats nicotine until they were "addicted" and placed a bowl of nic in the cage- rats wouldn't self medicate. Next they addicted the rats to nic+ alkaloids and placed a bowl of it in the cage. Rats made a beeline to it and immediately began self medicating.

This is turning into a very interesting thread for me. Two things, the previously described action of menthol, and this that I wasn't aware of. I wonder how common actual nicotine addiction is. I suspect that's my primary addiction. And have read about studies that suggest there are some that are predisposed to strong nicotine addiction. Add in that the most successful quit in my history was with the gum. A second time failed because, for whatever reason, the stuff irritated my mouth severely and I had to stop. I was, actually, about to try again with the stuff. And my "back up" plan is 0 nic vaping with nicotine gum if the FDA gets too nuts.

(Sigh. Ensuring minors don't have access and some quality control, I could live with. But how far they'll go...?)

But the feeling of "something's missing" is relatively mild for me. And if I'm busy with anything but talking about smoking (heh, such as now), I don't notice it. It's easily ignored long as I've the e-cig (pass through most times) handy.

Huh.

 

[BakuPeg]

My mother has been smoking from long before I was born. (i'm 39) Since cig taxes are killer expensive in Michigan she bought a cig-a-like and it helps her cut down, but she has not quit the analogs.

My husband quit smoking using a greensmoke, I later bought him a vv china thing and later a Provari. He has been off the cigs for 1 year.

For Christmas I bought Mom a little china mod a rev3 three phase VV, a tank my husband made 10 punched boge cartos and about 2 months of DIY juice I made for her in 18mg strength. All in all about 20 amber glass bottles of 15ml juice. I made everything from cupcake to doublemint gum to fuzzy navel to margaritas. I don't think she even tried it.
I am going to visit in late April but I bet I'll get something like "It looks like a b---"..
I don't want to be a PITA but I hope she at least uses it when I visit.

 

[vshadowheart]

Funny enough, I smoked hookah a few times a month, and switched over to vaping because the flavors are better. Now I am working on trying to get the same clouds.

 

[wandawag]

i can understand the psychology of it. today is a fine example....i miss the holding of a analog and when i am stressed, such as earlier, i told hubby i wanted a cigarette and got out our cig a like and puffed away. felt like i was having a real smoke, took care of what my mind needed. if i didn't have this, would we have bought a pack of smokes? no way in hell! that is why i will always have a cig a like ready....for the psychology of the whole thing.....a happy vaper!

 

[Vapoor eyes er]

This is turning into a very interesting thread for me. Two things, the previously described action of menthol, and this that I wasn't aware of. I wonder how common actual nicotine addiction is. I suspect that's my primary addiction. And have read about studies that suggest there are some that are predisposed to strong nicotine addiction. Add in that the most successful quit in my history was with the gum. A second time failed because, for whatever reason, the stuff irritated my mouth severely and I had to stop. I was, actually, about to try again with the stuff. And my "back up" plan is 0 nic vaping with nicotine gum if the FDA gets too nuts.

(Sigh. Ensuring minors don't have access and some quality control, I could live with. But how far they'll go...?)

But the feeling of "something's missing" is relatively mild for me. And if I'm busy with anything but talking about smoking (heh, such as now), I don't notice it. It's easily ignored long as I've the e-cig (pass through most times) handy.

Huh.

I've always imagined the millions of times I've put an analog to my mouthy and always wondered what it was doing to my mind being such a repetitive action. Have studied martial arts and basically it's repeat, repeat, repeat and then repeat some more the same actions. Imagine doing a motion that is also reinforced by a GREAT feeling when it's done? The mind completely defeated by the actions and feeling one gets from smoking- somewhat akin to Pavlovs Dog. For me that repetitive analog to mouth action/ motion in numbers is 6,022,500 times in my life

 

[mkbilbo]

I drip the juice in and watch it soak in. When it starts to 'puddle' around the barrel at the top of the filler, I stop and let it soak in for a few minutes. I tried the condom method, but the juice didn't seem to be soaking in. Maybe I should research that part some more.

I wasn't happy with it at first myself. But top fill? I'm not that patient.

Getting it soaked in was a problem. So one time, I just left things on the counter and blew it off. And it seemed to produce a more even flavor and last longer. So I started letting them sit and, I guess, soak longer. I've gotten to where I may do two rounds of filling. If the first one seems to have been soaked up, I might do another round then pull the carto up in the condom--but not out--then rest it in a shot glass (have a few but quit drinking years ago) and let it sit. It's less "wet" when I get back to it and I don't waste as much juice blowing it out.

My Hardware; iTaste MVP, eGo (650mAh), 510 atomizers, Moonbeam Clearos, iClear15's, iClear30, Kanger eVod's and Boge SR & LR carto's.

Heh, you got more kit than me. I've got to get some LR cartos. I have an LR atomizer that's really great for dripping but I'm really starting to prefer cartos. Once I blundered my way into a fill that worked for me. I haven't tried clearos and know nothing about them. Others around here will though. Lots of experienced (and more experienced than I) folks around ECF.

The juices I've mostly tried are 70/30 and 12mg of nic. I've had a couple @18mg of nic but I wasn't fond of the flavor to give it a chance.

Is 70/30 the only mix you've tried? You might try some other combinations of PG & VG and see if you like those better.

It's all so much a matter of subjective, personal taste, you have to experiment. I still am. And just hitting some combinations that work well for me.

BTW - I took a drag off my wife's analog the other day and was shocked at how horrible it tasted. Like I just licked a plate of cigarette ashes. I guess I was so surprised because after the last time I 'quit' and had my first analog, it was just as fantastic as the one I had 6 months prior. Now after just a few days, the same analog was unbearable.

Yep. I still sometimes have one and the things give me a headache now. I really don't like them. I wish I'd cut out going back. But I consciously chose to not get myself wound up about "quitting". Instead, focus on exploring and enjoying vaping. And the further I go, the less I want to go back to cigs and the longer the period between lighting up becomes.

Amazing ennit when you hit that, "What did I ever see in these things?" moment?

 

[alex8039]

Anyone experience headaches when quitting analogs? I had a massive one in the morning and gave into a cig, it seems to have gone away or at least feels masked

 

[stefania123]

I find the sweet vapes sometimes dont do it for me, and want a cigarette. But have some less sweet vapes, more tobacco flavor, and WTA for such circumstances..

 

[stefania123]

One thing i noticed is that since i stopped smoking and started vaping, when the urge for a cig does come it is not the same urge as when i was smoking and needed a cig, it is less brain/body and more just brain.. (but chemical urge, not psychological) the nicotine is satisfied but something is missing- which makes me think its got to be the WTA im craving- & it does go away for me with WTA.