Congressional hearing on E-cigs

[Eskie]

I think I'm gonna cross post this a few places.
I may be going bat crazy at this point from all the bull:cendored: but...

Children.
Do they let children speak at these things ? (after all...they are trying to SAVE THE CHILDREN !)

Vapers have children and grand children - and great grand children.

Children and grand children that are grateful their parent(s) / grand parent(s) switched from smoking to vaping.
Children that are grateful for how much better that/those parent(s) / grand parent(s) are since they switched.

Children that WANT their parent(s) / grand parent(s) to be able to continue to have this method of harm reduction available to them...and to have a choice other than smoking cigarettes.

Children that don't want their parent(s) / grand parent(s) to go back to smoking cigarettes.


CHILDREN !

Ask the children of VAPERS.

Eh, children aren't all that effective. Look at the kid who went to the UN and got to speak about the issue of climate change and her generation. Trump mocked her in a tweet and FOX called her mentally ill. No sympathy for a kid who happens to disagree with your policies and beliefs.

Here's another idea. One thing politicians need is money. They can't breath without money. They can't CAMPAIGN without money. Some rely on speeches at fundraisers. Others grassroots donations (Sanders is a good example of someone who can pile up a lot of money relying only on small grassroots donations). Even Trump (still can't figure out why he can't pick up his own bill if he has all that money).

How about every vaper who would consider a donation to a political candidate, even if it's only $1, donate it to CASAA or the VTA instead. AND let the candidates know where their donations are going instead of to their coffers. Money talks. Maybe #novapenopolitcaldonation. Open to idea on that hashtag, it is too long.

 

[DaveP]

A sufficiently high per pack tax on tobacco cigarettes at the retail level would save thousands of lives every year.

Politicians are jumping on the very thing that could eventually save the lives of current smokers by blaming the e-cigarette industry because young people are using them to vape oils. A little vapor education on what NOT to vape would go a long way towards solving the problem.

Big Tobacco saw the light of the oncoming train and hooked the states on payments for past tobacco harm. They can't really point at smoking and accept the check at the same time.

How many people die from smoking?

Image: evolution-institute.org
Nearly one in five deaths in the United States can be attributed to smoking tobacco. According to the Centers for Disease Control, 443,000 people die from diseases related to smoking each year.

 

[DarrenMG]

In the end @Eskie I agree with you. Not sure what if anything will work but loads of $. You can buy votes with enough money. It takes a hell of a lot though, and us who vape are still a small minority as compared with how many people still smoke (and it's not just about the USA, sure the USA started anti-smoking trend to a degree, but there is a whole world out there). That's why I hate this current ostrich thinking. If you put your head down in the sand and only think about self somehow the world will be a better place. Sure for a a few years, but the rest of the world is going to go on with or without us too. We live in a world of fast travel, fast information, we can face it or try to relive the life of old men 50 years ago.

Shorter version, vaping should be the future, but no surprise big tobacco is also trying to hang unto their past success (and so are old men politicians).

 

[Cool_Breeze]

I offer my gratitude to Ms. Vicki Porter for her appearance on the behalf of the interests of vapers.

 

[Jazzman]

Soon, we will all be approached for contributing to political campaigns for 2020 elections. The big push for this generally begins one year before the actual election and hits a frenzy with the national conventions where a candidate is chosen and continues until the actual election. Whether it's by campaign workers outside of supermarkets, telephone calls from political parties (get ready it will be a blitz of calls soon), emails, snail mail, or actual door to door encounters we will be seeing this in a big way soon (BTW, you can't opt out of political calls in an election year). Elections are won by dollars in election campaigns.

I would encourage all vapers to use a standard response that all money available for donations has been and will be given to vape advocacy groups to preserve your right to vape and stay off of more harmful tobacco products since your politicians aren't interested in being advocates for your right to vape and stay healthy.

If you receive requests for donations, don't throw them away or blow off the telephone call. Respond to them with this so it is clear to the politician what the issue with donations is, and how they could change your behavior with political donations. This is every bit as important with state and local elections as it is with national elections.

Denial of dollars is the only thing that will alert candidates running for office to our needs and desires, so make it clear that this is a big issue for you by refusing to donate to election campaigns that refuse to support our rights. This is even more effective if you have donated in the past since they keep very accurate records of that so that the well can be tapped again.

 

[rosesense]

But what candidate is going to go out on a limb and advocate for vapers? I don't see that happening. Some vapers supported Johnson, he had pushed the oversight committee to look into things. They ignored him and he didn't push the issue.

 

[DarrenMG]

While very logical to say this is not a political matter and keeps politics out of it is just avoiding what it really is about.

The doors to tell your reps you are going to withhold $10 dollars wont move them because they don't read those emails anyway.

Now if you can say I might gift you 10s or 100s of millions in money for voting my way, that will move them. Of course you don't say it that way, you do an indirect exchange and then go what?

In many ways it is our own fault, we voted for these cash hounds under the 'he is going to give me something I want' (did you get it?), so now we are paying the price.

I purposely linked an anti vape article from Fox News too, because they are not looking out for us/you either. It's just a business there too.

The sooner people get over worship and idols of authoritarian types, the sooner we can get back to a government that really works for us vs cash and lies. I mean .... our president even admits he is the biggest cash hound ever.

Government stay out of my business please. I'll assume the risk of vaping. I don't need government ...... telling me what to do.

 

[DarrenMG]

It is utter nonsense, the right will say less government interference but when it comes to what you eat, who you sleep with, what you do with your kids, what you drink or smoke, they must have their tendrils intertwined in every aspect of our lives. The real truth.

 

[Horselady154]

It is utter nonsense, the right will say less government interference but when it comes to what you eat, who you sleep with, what you do with your kids, what you drink or smoke, they must have their tendrils intertwined in every aspect of our lives. The real truth.

Just cut it out, Darren. If you listened to the hearing, you know, what this thread is about, you would have seen Democrat authoritarians who made no bones about what they were. It was flat out disgusting. So, unless you want to get into a cage match about this, how about you cut out the partisan bull....!!!! There is plenty of blame to go around. It's not about color of beanie; there are authoritarian POS on both sides.

 

[LoriP1702]

@Horselady154 not sure if you meant to quote me in the above post, just wanted to check.

 

[Horselady154]

@Horselady154 not sure if you meant to quote me in the above post, just wanted to check.

nooooooooooo. I just clicked reply on Darren's post.

 

[DarrenMG]

Just cut it out, Darren. If you listened to the hearing, you know, what this thread is about, you would have seen Democrat authoritarians who made no bones about what they were. It was flat out disgusting. So, unless you want to get into a cage match about this, how about you cut out the partisan bull....!!!! There is plenty of blame to go around. It's not about color of beanie; there are authoritarian POS on both sides.

Okay stop, we are supposed to be non-PC anymore right? That was the right party line, so I am being non PC. I purposely write stuff at times to point out how silly this is being non PC line is, the right is easily triggered too. It doesn't take much at all for the right to go into snowflake mode.

My goal was not get to likes or dislikes, but indeed to point out are there are authoritarian tendencies and yes, POS, on both sides. If we don't face this fact, we are going to go down a very dark path. Us 'mobs' are the only ones standing in the way of another authoritarian idiocy, or a democracy.

We are rapidly losing our right to vape, thanks to the right and left who really don't care about us mobs, and our right to vape. Yes I used your words 'mobs'.

p.s. This post might get me banned, but the not being PC stuff the right puts out, just so silly, the right are so easily triggered too.

p.s.s. the biggest snowflake ever is our president, OMG the news is not always positive about me, cry.

 

[Horselady154]

Darren, I think most everyone has realized there are unconstitutional authoritarians on both sides of the aisle. You, however, are the only one I see making the whole thing partisan. The fact that neither party is adhering to the Constitution and the enumerated powers within it, doesn't mean that we should go to mob rule. Because as bad as mob rule is, it never lasts and the next step is even more horrifying. I don't have the answer. We are in deep doo doo.

 

[DarrenMG]

The fact that neither party is adhering to the Constitution and the enumerated powers within it, doesn't mean that we should go to mob rule.

That is some common ground and I agree with very much. Both sides have over stepped the constitution directly or in intent.

Not sure if you know this, but I am red at heart. Less government interference. Everytime the feds make laws it just ends up in quagmire. Not saying no laws should be made, but rushing into a law is almost always fail.

Yes, I am not suggesting mob rule either, good with the middle ground, but right now we are seeing politicians enacting anti-vaping laws on a whim, that cannot work either.

Look if it is shown vaping e-juice (not THC carts bought on the black market) kill people faster then smokes, then that is a fair thing to discuss, but this last round of laws were purely political.

 

[DarrenMG]

@Horselady154 what you might not being seeing is the mob still does rule. It's the mob of how to get along with other representatives, or senators. You may not like me writing something outside the norm, but most of congress won't even try, they fear being ostracized.

It is still a mob on a smaller scale. Look, I write what I believe is true, and it doesn't always make me friends, but that is how to avoid becoming part of 'the mob' of group think.

 

[DarrenMG]

And now instead of making this an attack about me, because I do not make laws either, how about going after your reps and trump who are the ones are working to ban vaping. I am not the enemy, I am just one voice. Sorry if I triggered anyone, but if you want to get something done, going after me won't get it done (though politicians love that). Rich donnie and the dumb congress will be making choices. Focus on where it matters.

 

[Horselady154]

And now instead of making this an attack about me, because I do not make laws either, how about going after your reps and trump who are the ones are working to ban vaping. I am not the enemy, I am just one voice. Sorry if I triggered anyone, but if you want to get something done, going after me won't get it done (though politicians love that). Rich donnie and the dumb congress will be making choices. Focus on where it matters.

Congress isn't dumb. They are operating in their own self-interests. They are the best Congress money can buy off. If we had kept government within its constitutional boundaries, Congress would not have had anything to sell to the highest bidder.

Look Darren, if you want to criticize Trump's policies, go for it. Calling him "Rich donnie" just appears as jealousy.

 

[Horselady154]

 

[AttyPops]

^^ Love her.

 

[Alien Traveler]

I would like to know if there still are new members who recently quit smoking thanks to vaping. May be all who wanted to quit did it already?