Right. I still have no inkling why Gottlieb did what he did, or who if anyone signed off on it. At least he did express his thoughts from time to time. But he's gone now and we have even less idea what the folks there now are thinking.
Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!
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Right. I still have no inkling why Gottlieb did what he did, or who if anyone signed off on it. At least he did express his thoughts from time to time. But he's gone now and we have even less idea what the folks there now are thinking.
I think Gottlieb was trying to thread a needle. Keeping minors from vaping while making some level of vaping available to adults. Not certain how much success he would have doing that but it’s moot now. The new guy doesn’t appear to have much compassion for the adults. Lots of people here trashed Gottlieb but he has been the most reasonable of all the actors since Deeming was announced in 2016.
I have already done that... personal letters. I am looking for something short and concise that a whole bunch of us can link to at the bottom of our own letters.
The corporate entity which dictates human existence is itself a parasite. The united states is a dumping ground for inbred, disjunctive royalty from across the entire planet. Civilization is literally a mosh-pit around a burning trash fire. The only thing that holds any of you together is your common avarice for criminality.
Well, that will be a negligible "drop in the bucket" if one considers that within the next ten years or so we'll be losing 50% or more of all jobs. This lose will come from Capital switching over to more robust means of automation. Driving truck will be hard hit as the technology of automated driving furthers better safety protocols. It's already at something like 80 to 95% safer to let computers drive.
Tell me that we won't allow it on public roads and I'll just laugh. Whatever Capital wants, Capital will have. You think for a minute they want to keep shelling out money to human drivers when computers can do it more efficiently, need no sick days, have no "personal issues", no health requirements? And this is not only driving, it'll happen all across the board. We'll get automated robotic surgeons preforming routine surgeries soon enough.
Even waiting tables will face stiff competition from touch screens built into tables and hosting menu boards for ordering. Then, you can swipe your phone to give credit/debit card data for paying. Drones will come to your table with your order. I'm not saying this kind of stuff to weave fancy sci-fi type tales here. These things will soon be reality and people will need to adjust, go insane or do a bit of both.
The point of the U.S. losing money over cigarette jobs? Ha! That's just absolute silliness. Even if it were so it's merely a ploy for keeping Capital raking in profit. "Oh, you must consume cigarettes for the sake of national security." Yeah, well you can go toke some bull chips for me buddy, I'll keep vaping thank you.
I think it was Tony Soprano who said ''...We're only doing what they (the man) are doing. They only come after us because we don't pay taxes''
It's not a secret that human society is centered around the formulaic exploitation and abuse of anything that can't defend itself in a court of laws. If the law only exists to further the interests of criminal enterprises, which specialize in the externalization of all costs onto the defenseless, than the law itself and the forces backing it are illegitimate.
The general population is just intelligent enough to recognize the scenario playing out, and most do their best to exploit it at whatever meaningless level they're able to. 'How to create the next Big Scam', from a money-making perspective that's all there is to worry about. People are content to live furtive, baseless existences where they don't even address, let alone attempt to solve any greater problems, because nobody pays them for that. They are paid actors in the MMMORPG of life, hungry hungry hippos trying to devour everything in sight. From my life's perspective, nearly all human activity is some kind of institutionally sanctioned form of sado-masochism.
People don't ever take any account for the consequences of their disruptions to the equilibrium of the natural world, or even to their own societies. It's an unlawful, disorderly, and unnatural existence. I think the people 'in charge' are quite well aware of their failure to organize and inspire the masses, that's why they have splinter societies guarded by mercenary contractors in deep underground DUMBS, like any squirrel would go to bury their nuts. Even at the top-most level of human society, with the combined wisdom of their greater intelligence, for all purposes and intents they display the ingenuity of rodents.
The general population is just intelligent enough to recognize the scenario playing out, and most do their best to exploit it at whatever meaningless level they're able to. 'How to create the next Big Scam', from a money-making perspective that's all there is to worry about. People are content to live furtive, baseless existences where they don't even address, let alone attempt to solve any greater problems, because nobody pays them for that. They are paid actors in the MMMORPG of life, hungry hungry hippos trying to devour everything in sight. From my life's perspective, nearly all human activity is some kind of institutionally sanctioned form of sado-masochism.
People don't ever take any account for the consequences of their disruptions to the equilibrium of the natural world, or even to their own societies. It's an unlawful, disorderly, and unnatural existence. I think the people 'in charge' are quite well aware of their failure to organize and inspire the masses, that's why they have splinter societies guarded by mercenary contractors in deep underground DUMBS, like any squirrel would go to bury their nuts. Even at the top-most level of human society, with the combined wisdom of their greater intelligence, for all purposes and intents they display the ingenuity of rodents.
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I will say I did not trade anything for anything. When it comes to the government... Well, you've got a better shot against Scientology IN ITS HEYDAY when they were killing people.
I did not move here as a grown adult, and I don't remember feeling particularly "safe."
Nor does the government EVER make me feel that way. I've known cops and military folks I have LIKED as human beings, but I have never, ever, ever been made to feel "safe" with one around in uniform. It usually means a few things a) speeding ticket b) natural disaster of some shooting type that I have been unlucky enough to be near c) framed, if I'm really lucky. Etc.
The government doesn't make me feel safe at ALL and I lived in Baltimore and never once voluntarily ENTERED a government building and when I did it usually sssuuuuuckckkked.
I don't know who here feels SAFE instead of FREE, but it sure as hell is NOT ME.
Anna
I did not move here as a grown adult, and I don't remember feeling particularly "safe."
Nor does the government EVER make me feel that way. I've known cops and military folks I have LIKED as human beings, but I have never, ever, ever been made to feel "safe" with one around in uniform. It usually means a few things a) speeding ticket b) natural disaster of some shooting type that I have been unlucky enough to be near c) framed, if I'm really lucky. Etc.
The government doesn't make me feel safe at ALL and I lived in Baltimore and never once voluntarily ENTERED a government building and when I did it usually sssuuuuuckckkked.
I don't know who here feels SAFE instead of FREE, but it sure as hell is NOT ME.
Anna
I think what he was talking about is that we as the American people have for a very long time ceded more and more of our liberty to the government, in return for what we hoped would be more safety or security. Thing is, like Benjamin Franklin warned us if we did this, we would have neither; liberty nor safety.
I may be in the minority but we already have some good organizations such as CASAA and they need more resources including people involvement so rather than writing letters and such, why not support them? See what they need help with. They have had letter writing and surveys in the past.
I hate to be negative re letter writing but having worked in government and seeing how things are done, I doubt your letters will have an impact or even make it to the top. The ones reading letters, if they are even read, are looking for key words and pro vaping isn't likely to be those key words.
I hate to be negative re letter writing but having worked in government and seeing how things are done, I doubt your letters will have an impact or even make it to the top. The ones reading letters, if they are even read, are looking for key words and pro vaping isn't likely to be those key words.
Ok, Rose. I'll just join everyone else and just sit here on my ... then. Trump does do his own tweets, but I guess we shouldn't try that either.
Yes, @Horselady154 got it on the nose. I was in fact hoping to alliterate that quote of Benjamin Franklin.
It seems since 9/11/2001 all we've been doing is giving away our liberties so that we as a society can allegedly have safety, security. In that regard terrorism has won because it has altered the whole system.
Many far wiser than myself have said as much. Once they prohibit vaping, making it against the law, I'll be an outlaw. In fact I'm likely already something of an outlaw. I'm free though because I do not view what I do as morally, ethically not lawful. Yes, there's a difference between lawful and legal. I'll hold to what is lawful. Legality can change at whims, the Law does not.
Meanwhile back in the real world.
I couldn't find any more about this but it's a safe bet that vaping products won't be included in the list of cessation products covered.
This is why BP doesn't like us.
"INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — Two state agencies are taking steps to make it easier and cheaper for Indiana residents to quit smoking.
The policy changes were announced Monday by the State Department of Health and Indiana's Family and Social Services Administration.
State health Commissioner Dr. Kris Box says she's issued an order effective Aug. 1 to allow Hoosiers to buy tobacco cessation products at pharmacies without a prescription. That's expected to make those products less expensive and easier to obtain.
FSSA Secretary Dr. Jennifer Walthall says Indiana Medicaid will also begin reimbursing health care providers for tobacco cessation counseling for expectant mothers who want to quit smoking or using other tobacco products.
Walthall says Indiana Medicaid will also remove copayments for tobacco cessation products for pregnant women and those who've given birth within one year."
I couldn't find any more about this but it's a safe bet that vaping products won't be included in the list of cessation products covered.
This is why BP doesn't like us.
"INDIANAPOLIS (AP) — Two state agencies are taking steps to make it easier and cheaper for Indiana residents to quit smoking.
The policy changes were announced Monday by the State Department of Health and Indiana's Family and Social Services Administration.
State health Commissioner Dr. Kris Box says she's issued an order effective Aug. 1 to allow Hoosiers to buy tobacco cessation products at pharmacies without a prescription. That's expected to make those products less expensive and easier to obtain.
FSSA Secretary Dr. Jennifer Walthall says Indiana Medicaid will also begin reimbursing health care providers for tobacco cessation counseling for expectant mothers who want to quit smoking or using other tobacco products.
Walthall says Indiana Medicaid will also remove copayments for tobacco cessation products for pregnant women and those who've given birth within one year."
When smoking finally dies completely, then vaping will be more respected as the tobacco tax shifts over in some form to your vape.
CASSA has printable material on vaping available.
Free Graphics, Printable Materials
Vaping Facts
They used to have much more material available but many of the subcategories are "under construction".
Free Graphics, Printable Materials
Vaping Facts
They used to have much more material available but many of the subcategories are "under construction".
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Bear with me until the end please...
My fear for the vaping industry is that it doesn't have that essentially single minded USA corporate interest behind it to lobby for laws that allow people to vape. Heck, even nicotine replacement therapy (NRT) products are backed by USA corporate interests (pharmaceutical products!)
Great article here on the NRT conflict of interests...
Tobacco Industry Research on Nicotine Replacement Therapy: “If Anyone Is Going to Take Away Our Business It Should Be Us”
The vaping industry though is mostly made up of small companies producing e-juice, and most devices being designed, built, and sold out of China to small vape shops in the USA (or online dealers). Not that I like it, but sadly, without that level of corporate interest... sigh, there are the way things work, and the way we wished it worked.
It's also why I am not entirely opposed to companies like Juul, the majority of employees headquartered in San Francisco, working to main-stream vaping. I know, I know, it feels hypocritical on some level, but if vaping remains a USA garage business and China-driven industry, I really do fear that personal petitions alone won't be sufficient to avoid a FDA kill.
My fear for the vaping industry is that it doesn't have that essentially single minded USA corporate interest behind it to lobby for laws that allow people to vape. Heck, even nicotine replacement therapy (NRT) products are backed by USA corporate interests (pharmaceutical products!)
Great article here on the NRT conflict of interests...
Tobacco Industry Research on Nicotine Replacement Therapy: “If Anyone Is Going to Take Away Our Business It Should Be Us”
The vaping industry though is mostly made up of small companies producing e-juice, and most devices being designed, built, and sold out of China to small vape shops in the USA (or online dealers). Not that I like it, but sadly, without that level of corporate interest... sigh, there are the way things work, and the way we wished it worked.
It's also why I am not entirely opposed to companies like Juul, the majority of employees headquartered in San Francisco, working to main-stream vaping. I know, I know, it feels hypocritical on some level, but if vaping remains a USA garage business and China-driven industry, I really do fear that personal petitions alone won't be sufficient to avoid a FDA kill.
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