Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[Mazinny]

To corner or gain leverage in the market for nicotine production for vaping maybe? The Canadian subsidiary of BAT, Imperial Tobacco just announced this week (hit the news today) that they are starting production of vaping products, and they are lobbying the Canadian Government to influence the vaping products regulations that are being drafted right now.

'Why aren't we allowed to sell a less harmful product?' Imperial Tobacco wants into e-cigarette market

I do not think that Imperial is a subsidiary of BAT. I was under the impression that the two are competitors, with BAT being the smaller of the two.

Not that i believe e-cigs are a factor in this proposed takeover, but

Imperial Tobacco and Imperial Tobacco Canada are not related. When Reynolds bought Lorillard a couple of years ago, Blu Ecigs ( which was owned by Lorillard ), along with some cigarette brands, was sold to Imperial Tobacco due to anti-trust concerns. Reynolds already had Vuse e-cigs.

Imperial Tobacco Canada is a wholly owned subsidiary of BAT and as far as i know does not have ecigs as part of their catalogue, although their parent company, BAT do have a couple of ecig products in their portfolio.

 

[Eskie]

How much Money did Reynolds lose last year?

Sorry, don't have the 2015 figures right off the bat, but for 2014 they made ~$1.4 Billion, which is pretty much on par with their performance for the 5 earlier years as well. They ain't losing money.

 

[sofarsogood]

When it comes to money, not even lives matter. I personally will never buy any item put out by a Tobacco company. Ever. It's the principle of it.

Then there are other people who would disagree with you. They might think the people who make their cigarettes know what they want in an ecig and may be the companies deliver and may be they don't. Other things being equal I don't mind if the tobacco companies offer ecig products but I'm unlikely to buy them.

Governments are frantic to preserve their tobacco tax money without looking like the drug dealing mass murders that they are if they stamp out ecigs. I think the tobacco company people enjoy watching governments' pain over this.

 

[Mazinny]

Sorry, don't have the 2015 figures right off the bat, but for 2014 they made ~$1.4 Billion, which is pretty much on par with their performance for the 5 earlier years as well. They ain't losing money.

They made a lot more in 2015 ( 3.2 B ). Not sure if this was a one off, or because income from Lorillard ( which they purchased in late 2014 ) was factored in. They are on track to make a lot more in 2016 as well, based on their TTM ( trailing twelve months ). Also note that these numbers are Net Income after income tax. Tobacco companies are still cash cows. BAT know exactly what they are buying ( They already own 42% of Reynolds )

Income Statement for Reynolds American Inc (RAI) from Morningstar.com

 

[Eskie]

They made a lot more in 2015 ( 3.2 B ). Not sure if this was a one off, or because income from Lorillard ( which they purchased in late 2014 ) was factored in. They are on track to make a lot more in 2016 as well, based on their TTM ( trailing twelve months ). Also note that these numbers are Net Income after income tax. Tobacco companies are still cash cows. BAT know exactly what they are buying ( They already own 42% of Reynolds )

Income Statement for Reynolds American Inc (RAI) from Morningstar.com

Good year for them. Would need to see their financials to see where that extra income came from in comparison to the prior years, but early Saturday morning limits my attentiveness to picking through the earnings of Darth Vader.

 

[seminolewind]

I think it would be a hoot to watch BT lose money or stock price over the next 2 years. That would certainly make a statement.

 

[seminolewind]

PM cigarette shipping volume down by 5.5% in 3rd quarter of this year.
That would be our fault.

They may end up selling off tobacco shares as they buy into other things so they are not so dependent on one thing. Unless they already do own a variety of companies, like Kraft.

 

[seminolewind]

Nevermind. Tobacco Companies

It's just utterly upsetting. Similar to what Walmart did to smaller shops in small towns. Very sad what money can do. I do believe these regulations are just another stall tactic for BT -until they are the leader in e-cigarettes.

 

[sofarsogood]

Nevermind. Tobacco Companies

It's just utterly upsetting. Similar to what Walmart did to smaller shops in small towns. Very sad what money can do. I do believe these regulations are just another stall tactic for BT -until they are the leader in e-cigarettes.

But what does it mean to be a leader in ecigarettes after all that easy money from tobacco? My vaping is costing a tiny fraction of what I spent to smoke. There is a bulge in spending right now but only because of stocking and the FDA, which is one time insurance money. If it wasn't for that I'd be a $100-200 a year vaper, a far cry from the $3,000 a year I spent on cigs.

May be the tobacco companies can come up with an expensive tobacco replacement that consumers want to buy but I'm certain I won't be one of them. The only hobby I can think of that's less expensive than my vape is chess.

 

[Rossum]

May be the tobacco companies can come up with an expensive tobacco replacement that consumers want to buy

They're trying to, with the Heat-not-Burn products like iQOS.

but I'm certain I won't be one of them.

That makes two of us.

The only hobby I can think of that's less expensive than my vape is chess.

Chess can be an expensive hobby too, if one starts collecting fancy, hand-made chess boards.

 

[Eskie]

Chess can be an expensive hobby too, if one starts collecting fancy, hand-made chess boards.

Sorta like those fancy, hand made mods? And authentic limited edition Eastern European tanks? And those gourmet juices that always sound so tempting in their descriptions?

But look at all the money I would have spent on cigarettes. I'm saving at least $100 a year by vaping compared to my old $6,000 cigarette habit. Maybe.

 

[Tee_Jay]

The only hobby I can think of that's less expensive than my vape is chess.

Hey, me too!

 

[oplholik]

I always envied the people that had the mental capacity to understand and successfully play chess. I had enough trouble with checkers. LOL!

 

[Tee_Jay]

I always envied the people that had the mental capacity to understand and successfully play chess. I had enough trouble with checkers. LOL!

Meh - Nonsense! There are grandmasters with very average IQ and Mensa members who couldn't beat a monkey in a game of chess! If you can figure out all of the ins and outs of vaping hardware, you have the mental capacity to play as well as the best of them. However, your time is probably better spent on the ins and outs of vaping because chess is even more of a waste of time than blowing clouds is!

 

[seminolewind]

Anticipating a nibble on your fishing pole is far more enjoyable than anticipating words from court.

 

[Bronze]

Anticipating a nibble on your fishing pole is far more enjoyable than anticipating words from court.

"Fishing (fish-ing)n: A Jerk on one end of the line waiting for a jerk on the other."

 

[seminolewind]

"Fishing (fish-ing)n: A Jerk on one end of the line waiting for a jerk on the other."

How insulting!

 

[zoiDman]

I always envied the people that had the mental capacity to understand and successfully play chess. I had enough trouble with checkers. LOL!

When you play Chess, you are Not playing a game. You are playing at least 2 games. And Good Players are playing 3 or More games.

Because Before I move my piece, I must consider what Your next move may/should be. And then consider what my Counter to Your move will be.

 

[Bronze]

How insulting!

Self deprecating. I'm a fisherman.

 

[rosesense]

Next step in the lawsuit:
Tobacco On Trial » Blog Archive » DOCKET for NICOPURE LABS v. FDA et al, Oct 17-26, 2016