Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!
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DIY'ers ain't dealers, they're manufactures.
You would think so. The law they tried to pass in Indiana would have left it OK to make your own juice, but by the literal wording of the bill even giving a bottle to a friend would have been a crime. Unless you mixed it in an accredited lab in your garage with 24 hour surveillance run by the favored security company owned by politicians and their buddies.
As long as buying the ingredients is legal I don't see how they could make mixing them together illegal. The only ingredient they could potentially cut off is nicotine. They obviously couldn't make it illegal but they could rule that only authorized manufacturers could buy it.
I don't think the "Black Market" for ecigs and ejuice is going to come from individuals on street corners hawking products and home brew ejuice. It's going to come from China, Canada and the EU, and they will be the same products we buy now and the new products introduced to the rest of the world. Yes there will be guys like me making ejuice for friends and family (and teaching them to make their own to be self sufficient), but that's not going to be the majority of vape stuff available and you won't have to txt your dealer to meet you at a remote parking lot to get new gear. There will be better ways to get your stuff. Like various places in Canada shipping to the US in plain packages. It would be impossible for usps to catch most of the packages from different places in the world shipping to users here, aside from China that will watched more closely... and even then only on large container type shipments. The small user shipments will mostly get through ok.
Joking just a bit here, but imagine our northern border being the vape smuggling major distribution route for the US. We would need to reallocate most of the southern border security forces where we have minor issues with things like fentanyl and other lesser problems entering the US for the much larger danger of vaping products being smuggled in. And I bet congress would vote to build a wall on the northern border for this existential threat before vaping ruins the very fabric of our society. /s
Joking just a bit here, but imagine our northern border being the vape smuggling major distribution route for the US. We would need to reallocate most of the southern border security forces where we have minor issues with things like fentanyl and other lesser problems entering the US for the much larger danger of vaping products being smuggled in. And I bet congress would vote to build a wall on the northern border for this existential threat before vaping ruins the very fabric of our society. /s
I'm not sure if I'm near the right border, I hear Mexico is like, really evil about vaping. That sort of makes me think when I go through Border patrol the wrong direction (toward Mexico?) Maybe I should hide my vapes.
I ALSO got told that like if you live within a certain distance of a border, you are ONLY subject to Federal laws, not state laws. That can't be true, is it? I mean, does that mean we will not have too pay state tax? I mean, I sincerely doubt it.
Also if the wall I mean fence goes through I am here to tell you Douglas gonna get exciting and stuff. I am afraid that our visitors are not going to take kindly to climbing a fence.
Also, less steel for Mexico to steal (you know they are gonna) and the only way I see this working is if they electrify the fence with the kind of electricity that THROWS you from the fence and causes you to decide if you believe in the afterlife after your near death experience.
I'm unfazed by all this. Not the ecig part but other stuff. From what I've seen of the fence it looks like one of those things where... It's all patched and crumbly and like, it has ISSUES.
Anna
I ALSO got told that like if you live within a certain distance of a border, you are ONLY subject to Federal laws, not state laws. That can't be true, is it? I mean, does that mean we will not have too pay state tax? I mean, I sincerely doubt it.
Also if the wall I mean fence goes through I am here to tell you Douglas gonna get exciting and stuff. I am afraid that our visitors are not going to take kindly to climbing a fence.
Also, less steel for Mexico to steal (you know they are gonna) and the only way I see this working is if they electrify the fence with the kind of electricity that THROWS you from the fence and causes you to decide if you believe in the afterlife after your near death experience.
I'm unfazed by all this. Not the ecig part but other stuff. From what I've seen of the fence it looks like one of those things where... It's all patched and crumbly and like, it has ISSUES.
Anna
Angry rant by PBusardo after Scott Gottlieb announces his plan of action before exitting his post. WARNING: FOUL LANGUAGE.
Great rant! Prohibition is tyranny, our forefathers came up with a great solution to tyranny back in 1776 
Sadly, they started imposing tyranny themselves in 1791.Great rant! Prohibition is tyranny, our forefathers came up with a great solution to tyranny back in 1776
Here in Michigan sale of weed for recreational use, probably sometime next year. A war on vaping would be surreal.
I'm sure I would not go back to smoking. Cigs taste awful. Another reason is Snus (I recommend skoal mint. It can be bought in vacuum pack of, I believe, 5 cans). It's very economical for me and takes the sting out of not being able to vape on the shop floor where I work. I have a life time supply of vape stuff. If and as the threat level increases I'll probably buy a bit more hardware. I'm a tiny bit concerned about the shelf life of my regulated mods so anything additional will be protected but unregulated.
It will look very bad if vape stuff is unobtainable but cigarettes remain for sale the same as always. And may be legal challenges will delay draconian rules for more years to come. I've written over and over, I wish ecigs had been around when I was a kid. What we are witnessing there is the kids putting and end to the tobacco age. It will be tragic if they succeed in snuffing that out.
I'm sure I would not go back to smoking. Cigs taste awful. Another reason is Snus (I recommend skoal mint. It can be bought in vacuum pack of, I believe, 5 cans). It's very economical for me and takes the sting out of not being able to vape on the shop floor where I work. I have a life time supply of vape stuff. If and as the threat level increases I'll probably buy a bit more hardware. I'm a tiny bit concerned about the shelf life of my regulated mods so anything additional will be protected but unregulated.
It will look very bad if vape stuff is unobtainable but cigarettes remain for sale the same as always. And may be legal challenges will delay draconian rules for more years to come. I've written over and over, I wish ecigs had been around when I was a kid. What we are witnessing there is the kids putting and end to the tobacco age. It will be tragic if they succeed in snuffing that out.
It's not the kids that are influencing anything...it is the over reaction and politicizing of "the kiddos" in an unethical campaign against vaping. Them bastids should tarred and feathered.
The grownups are using the kids for ends not related to the best interests of the kids. Regardless, I'm told by an 18 year old that the view of that age group is, vaping is vaping, smoking is not cool. The evil grownups should be deleriously happy about that. Of course they are not. Follow the money.
My daughter (a non-smoker, non-vaper) in college tells me the same thing. She know others her age who vape, but none that smoke. Smoking tobacco is considered uncool/uncouth.
For non smokers, which is most people, vaping is easier to be around so it's predictable they would be approving. That is social support. If my personal experience is a guide, eventually vaping is a superior experience. Vaping can be, should be, less expensive but most former smokers can buy a lot of vape toys with their cigarette budget. But what seems to be happening is the mainstream is going for pods. I always prefer my traditional gear but a Justfog Minifit is so discrete I can take a puff just about anywhere and not provoke a reaction. The harder they come down on vaping the more lifelong smokers they create. They must know that. Evil I say, evil they are.
P.S. I listened to Pbusardo above. He's right of course. It's been obvious to me for the last 4 years that the government is indifferent about my health. Gottlieb said it out loud and Phil calls him out for it. Gottlieb has lost perspective. To much discretion over vaping has corrupted him.
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When you declare that something is dangerous or "just as dangerous" as something else that we know kills, you need to provide the background information that brought you to that conclusion. I don't see any of that in Gottlieb's comment.
Sadly, It's still all about tax revenue from cigarettes that's driving the government to choose between fewer deaths and "the money" that smoking pours into the tax coffers. It's apparent to me that smoking deaths are OK because they bring in billions of dollars in tax revenue while the user is alive.
If it was about the health of smokers and vapers instead of tax revenue, vaping would win hands down and smoking would be on the chopping block.
Sadly, It's still all about tax revenue from cigarettes that's driving the government to choose between fewer deaths and "the money" that smoking pours into the tax coffers. It's apparent to me that smoking deaths are OK because they bring in billions of dollars in tax revenue while the user is alive.
If it was about the health of smokers and vapers instead of tax revenue, vaping would win hands down and smoking would be on the chopping block.
If I could ban evreything with "no redeeming public health value" I would start with everything in the center isles of grocery stores, virtually everything on TV, especially the so-called news shows and don't forget football games. I'd ban patents on new medical products. I'd ban fast food businesses and most of the slow food places. Given more time to think about it and I would find a lot more things that don't meet my personal standards for redeeming public health value. Gottlleb is applying his personal standards so I can do the same.
If posession by minors was outlawed the police would bust more vapers than smokers because cigarettes pay taxes and ecigs don't. Almost all the State and local restrictions apply to providing vape gear but not posessing it. I wonder if this applies to parents providing vape gear to their own kids. Have you noticed whether the coming Federal regulations make it illegal for a parent to provide vape gear to their children? That would produce some fascination legal contests.
P.S. I like to run a quit smoking banner on my posts. A while back the one that expressed time in years disappeared in favor of days only. Check the banner below. FYI a years counter is available again.
No problem with it working for alcohol. If a parent is found supplying underage minors or their own kids with alcoholic beverages they are busted. Obviously it occurs when you allow your 16 year old to throw a party and the cops are called for all the noise. If the kids are standing around holding a beer that adult parent is leaving in cuffs.
It is illegal in Ohio for parents to purchase or provide vape gear for their underage children. Penalties can include both a fine and jail time. So I don't know about federal law, but state laws may apply. What's that saying, "Possession is 9/10's of the law"? I don't think even a bad lawyer would touch this.
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I have no particular problem with that, including possession by a minor period. I do feel it should be an administrative summons thing, with a fine large enough to piss off the parent, but not a criminal thing. I don't think a kid caught with a Juul deserves a criminal record over it, as they wouldn't if found with a pack of cigarettes. Parents who allow their kids to have a glass of wine or beer at home in a family setting I have no issues with doing. But I will say a parent (s) that allow an alcoholic house party are acting in a pretty negligent manner, especially if the kids have to drive home. And with all the talk of designated drivers, while encouraged, still isn't a solid solution for a car with another 5 drunk 16 year olds in it. That's when people potentially die, and that deserves handling as a criminal manner.
I'm a realist. With an age requirement of 21 there are grey areas. When my daughter was in college, it was a "wet" campus. They had a policy that anyone who needed assistance due to alcohol who was underage would receive it without fear of disciplinary action so they wouldn't be afraid to reach out for emergency campus medical services, but if an of age over 21 year old was identified as the source, they were subject to disciplinary action. So when I visited, I would buy her a few bottles of white wine for her refrigerator because I felt better about that than her using the fake ID I knew she must have possessed. But I also knew and trusted that it was for her personal use and as she was on campus and there was no driving.
But she was also the kind of kid who on more than one occasion was out with friends, felt the "designated driver" wasn't exactly sober, and had no problem making them drop her at a public location like a gas station or whatever and have one of us pick her up.She wasn't the cowed by the not being a cool kid and feel peer pressure to just go along. I was and am always grateful she's still that way even today.
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