Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[NolaMel]

So many people are always complaining "SOMETHING HAS TO BE DONE" and then when something is done the other side says "WHY ARE THEY DOING THAT". It's the proverbial rock and the hard spot. At this point really all we can do is wait and see what happens. There will be lawsuits after May 2020. You can try to change the FDA up until that point but you can't file a lawsuit for something that hasn't happened yet.

I think some people want to believe that there MUST be something that can be done to change the path this appears to be taking, because doing something seems more proactive than just waiting. Some positive has come from that...the calls to the White House, senators, representatives, the rallies have let us be seen and heard. We’re NOT as invisible as we were in 2016. But, it’s pointless right now to do more than make it known that we are far larger in numbers and comprised of waaaaay more adults than they assumed, and that businesses and employees lives will be ruined if they totally shut down vaping. They have to take an action before we can counteract. Right now they seem to be shadowboxing in the corner of the ring trying to decide what to do. Frustrating, irritating...

 

[Astron]

I am having a heck of a time trying to figure out if the Vandy vape Pulse X mod takes any of the replacement squonk bottles I’m seeing on FT.
$3.72 Authentic Vandy Vape Squonk Bottle for Pulse BF Mod - 8ml / silicone at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

 

[NolaMel]

I am having a heck of a time trying to figure out if the Vandy Vape Pulse X mod takes any of the replacement squonk bottles I’m seeing on FT.
$3.72 Authentic Vandy Vape Squonk Bottle for Pulse BF Mod - 8ml / silicone at FastTech - Worldwide Free Shipping

Those fit my mech pulse (the original). Ask over on the shinyitis thread.... a bunch of them have the different models.

 

[Astron]

Those fit my mech pulse (the original). Ask over on the shinyitis thread.... a bunch of them have the different models.

Thank you!

omg I’m so embarrassed. I thought I was posting in Stock Up. Oops and sorry!

 

[Bronze]

These govt agencies (incl. the FDA) are in the executive presumably run by the president. But the fact is, these agencies are run by career bureaucrats and all have goals and objectives of their own. They’re supposed to be carrying out the president’s policies but in reality they carry out their own.

 

[AttyPops]

These govt agencies (incl. the FDA) are in the executive presumably run by the president. But the fact is, these agencies are run by career bureaucrats and all have goals and objectives of their own. They’re supposed to be carrying out the president’s policies but in reality they carry out their own.

I'd alter that to say they carry out the agendas of the hidden-influential others. (Olgarchy). BT, BP, other well-meaning people paving the road to hell with ignorance and fear.

The really SAD thing is that in modern times we should have, or could create, reasonable scientific models to show the optimal results. Think weather forecasting, but with health variables (after all, it all gets back to health and addiction as a rationale). We should be able to use some combination of rational scientific methods AND compassion/freedom/options. That's why e-cigs were invented.

But we're being treated like mushrooms and it's all the agenda and influence that ticks me off the most. And I don't think career bureaucrats have much of a personal agenda at all, unless they represent "other forces". They're more like the [very important] cogs in the machine, but they aren't turning the crank.

I think it is about BT, BP and some combination of congress critters and all those anti-smoking groups CASAA's video detailed...

And I don't think the POTUS has time to deal with these details, he only "knows" what his handlers tell him.

Just

 

[englishmick]

I'd alter that to say they carry out the agendas of the hidden-influential others. (Olgarchy). BT, BP, other well-meaning people paving the road to hell with ignorance and fear.

The really SAD thing is that in modern times we should have, or could create, reasonable scientific models to show the optimal results. Think weather forecasting, but with health variables (after all, it all gets back to health and addiction as a rationale). We should be able to use some combination of rational scientific methods AND compassion/freedom/options. That's why e-cigs were invented.

But we're being treated like mushrooms and it's all the agenda and influence that ticks me off the most. And I don't think career bureaucrats have much of a personal agenda at all, unless they represent "other forces". They're more like the [very important] cogs in the machine, but they aren't turning the crank.

I think it is about BT, BP and some combination of congress critters and all those anti-smoking groups CASAA's video detailed...

And I don't think the POTUS has time to deal with these details, he only "knows" what his handlers tell him.

Just

I saw some graphs showing long term economic trends, like decreasing real wages for most of us and the movement of wealth to the top tiers. They were almost straight lines for several decades, the comings and goings of Presidents hardly made a ripple.

Some things do change with administrations, namely things that don't matter to the rich and powerful. The things they use to divide and control us.

I agree about POTUS. There's a lot of stuff going on in the world, can't really see him sitting for hours with his cabinet debating the issues around vaping. We do know he's been getting briefed. Comments he made about job losses and so forth. And we heard some sensible comments from one of his senior advisors a few days ago. We all yelled at him on the phone line when it seemed he was getting ready to sink our ship. If it turns out he throws us a lifeline we should make some more calls and tell him how great he is, he likes that. Praise him a bit and he might help us out next spring.

Or we could wait a year for President Bloomberg to save us.

 

[Bronze]

Or we could wait a year for President Bloomberg to save us.

LMAO!! The guy who took Big Gulps away from us. Vaping doesn't stand a chance!!

 

[AttyPops]

LMAO!! The guy who took Big Gulps away from us. Vaping doesn't stand a chance!!

Fortunately, neither does Bloomberg!

 

[Astron]

Morning. Hope this information is a little more helpful per the theme of the thread.

POTUS says he’s going to meet with vaping industry.

 

[Sloth Tonight]

"Dilemma"

Only dilemma I see is a bunch of state bans and a ticking timebomb called the deeming (should be a horror movie title).

 

[Horselady154]

I hope it's not Juul that he's invited.

 

[Bronze]

"Dilemma"

Only dilemma I see is a bunch of state bans and a ticking timebomb called the deeming (should be a horror movie title).

The Deeming regs have always been the biggest threat to vaping. By far! All this stuff about flavor bans, taxation, age limits, warning labels, etc. is meaningless when the Deeming regs will effectively end vaping as we know it anyway.

 

[zoiDman]

Morning. Hope this information is a little more helpful per the theme of the thread.

POTUS says he’s going to meet with vaping industry.

That's good.

I hope we can get a Clearer Understanding as to what this Proposed Rule is all about...

OIRA Conclusion of EO 12866 Regulatory Review

 

[AttyPops]

That's good.

I hope we can get a Clearer Understanding as to what this Proposed Rule is all about...

OIRA Conclusion of EO 12866 Regulatory Review

Huh, three meetings.
With:
1) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Turning Point Brands, Inc ( TPB.N - Turning Point Brands Inc Profile | Reuters )
2) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Coalition of Independent Tobacco Manufacturers of America (CITMA)
3) Truth Initiative & Not client but also attending: American Academy of Pediatrics, American Cancer Society Cancer Action Network, American Heart Association, American Lung Association, Campaign for Tobacco Free Kids

Law Firm Office Information for Kleinfeld, Kaplan and Becker, LLP - Martindale.com

 

[Astron]

Huh, three meetings.
With:
1) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Turning Point Brands, Inc ( TPB.N - Turning Point Brands Inc Profile | Reuters )
2) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Coalition of Independent Tobacco Manufacturers of America (CITMA)
3) Truth Initiative & Not client but also attending: American Academy of Pediatrics, American Cancer Society Cancer Action Network, American Heart Association, American Lung Association, Campaign for Tobacco Free Kids

Law Firm Office Information for Kleinfeld, Kaplan and Becker, LLP - Martindale.com

Hm.

 

[Astron]

Huh, three meetings.
With:
1) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Turning Point Brands, Inc ( TPB.N - Turning Point Brands Inc Profile | Reuters )
2) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Coalition of Independent Tobacco Manufacturers of America (CITMA)
3) Truth Initiative & Not client but also attending: American Academy of Pediatrics, American Cancer Society Cancer Action Network, American Heart Association, American Lung Association, Campaign for Tobacco Free Kids

Law Firm Office Information for Kleinfeld, Kaplan and Becker, LLP - Martindale.com

May I ask how you found out who is in the meeting? I ask so I may help myself in the future.

 

[zoiDman]

Huh, three meetings.
With:
1) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Turning Point Brands, Inc ( TPB.N - Turning Point Brands Inc Profile | Reuters )
2) Kleinfeld Kaplan and Becker LLP & Coalition of Independent Tobacco Manufacturers of America (CITMA)
3) Truth Initiative & Not client but also attending: American Academy of Pediatrics, American Cancer Society Cancer Action Network, American Heart Association, American Lung Association, Campaign for Tobacco Free Kids

Law Firm Office Information for Kleinfeld, Kaplan and Becker, LLP - Martindale.com

Yeah...?

That's what the Record shows.

 

[AttyPops]

And the EO 12866 info is here:
So since 1993 there's this review process....https://www.archives.gov/files/federal-register/executive-orders/pdf/12866.pdf

This was interesting:

Sec. 8. Publication. Except to the extent required by law, an agency shallnot publish in the Federal Register or otherwise issue to the public anyregulatory action that is subject to review under section 6 of this Executiveorder until (1) the Administrator of OIRA notifies the agency that OIRAhas waived its review of the action or has completed its review withoutany requests for further consideration, or (2) the applicable time periodin section 6(b)(2) expires without OIRA having notified the agency thatit is returning the regulatory action for further consideration under section6(b)(3), whichever occurs first. If the terms of the preceding sentence havenot been satisfied and an agency wants to publish or otherwise issue a regulatory action, the head of that agency may request Presidential consider-ation through the Vice President, as provided under section 7 of this order.Upon receipt of this request, the Vice President shall notify OIRA andthe Advisors. The guidelines and time period set forth in section 7 shallapply to the publication of regulatory actions for which Presidential consider-ation has been sought.

https://www.archives.gov/files/federal-register/executive-orders/pdf/12866.pdf

So it's all process and procedure. BUT FOR WHAT? ....
Like Zoid said...wonder what this is, specifically.

What's interesting is that it progressed this far, is getting reviewed, has had industry insider and various "organizations" meeting, meanwhile the POTUS is promising more meetings with vaping industry. Lip service? Or change?

 

[AttyPops]

Yeah...?

That's what the Record shows.

Yeah, I'm just discussing that. Which is why I quoted you.