I agreeOn that note, we should probably change the subject or this thread will end up getting moved to the debate forums, lol!
FDA issues notice of intent to propose "deeming" regulation by April of 2013 for e-cigarettes and other tobacco products
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Spreading the wealth has been tried before, and any such system is very much flawed...
I may be using these terms too losely, but basically you can look at communism and socialism for examples.
Removing incentives for people to achieve wealth has the effect of stifling creativity and motivation.
In other words, it impedes progress.
And removing incentives for people to earn a decent living leads to a welfare state.
I'm not saying our system of government doesn't have problems.
But it seems to me to be better than any alternatives.
EDIT: In before thread closure
EDIT: Sorry, I believe I may the one that started this
I may be using these terms too losely, but basically you can look at communism and socialism for examples.
Removing incentives for people to achieve wealth has the effect of stifling creativity and motivation.
In other words, it impedes progress.
And removing incentives for people to earn a decent living leads to a welfare state.
I'm not saying our system of government doesn't have problems.
But it seems to me to be better than any alternatives.
EDIT: In before thread closure
EDIT: Sorry, I believe I may the one that started this
True that.If the working lower and middle class had the skills to make and save money then they would. People bashing the rich as greedy or life as unfair would switch places and have that wealth, power and privilege for themselves in a heartbeat. Any who deny it are liars. Bashing those who have earned a better lifestyle as greedy and to say the wealth should be spread is just another form of greed.
My husband sees it all of the time at work. He is a welder and works for a family- owned company that is non-union but pays the best wages, offers really good and cheaper (for employees) health benefits and flexible work schedules. Still, his coworkers (many my husband describes as lazy and/or produce poor quality work) complain that its not enough. This is a company that didn't lay off a single employee during rough times of the recession. They found their employees work to do even if it was sweeping floors. People like those co-workers are still offended that the owners and managers who got them through still make "too much" and its "not fair" and say those "rich owners" need to pay their "fair share" in taxes. Some have been talking about pulling in the union so they can squeeze even more out of the owners. It's people like that who I consider greedy "bottom feeders."
On that note, we should probably change the subject or this thread will end up getting moved to the debate forums, lol!
Looks like e liquid will be the new moonshine if things go south. Prohibition only breeds black ma rkets.
Gun control, much like the situation with vaping right now, is not about guns, it's about control.
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Good idea ...
However, Hollywood celebs risk future film roles if they oppose
the views of the government, agencies, and the Mainstream Media
not to speak of opposing the views of BP.
Charlie Sheen would do it - I'll give him a buzz...
I keep my Day-to-Day e-Liquids in 30ml Glass Dropper Bottles in my desk drawer. I also have no Young children wandering around the House regularly.
But my 100mg Nicotine Base I keep in a Locked Filing Cabinet.
Even though I don't have Young Children in the house, I still Secure the 100mg Nicotine. Maybe it is just a holdover from when there were Curious Hands in the House.
Warning: they come back, and often bring rugrats with them! (Especially if you nag them to for a decade or so!)
I'm confused by ''they could reg nicotine" but "they could never ban the sale of nicotine." Is what farmers use safe to vape? I see where Wizard Labs says you have to be a teacher or chemist to buy nic from them, I guess you just have to check a box that says you are, right? I don't know. I really do not know what the FDA has up it's sleeve nor how to prepare for something unknown. I wish I'd have spent the last two years learning DIY and stock piling. We've got 2 months too see what they intend. I'd love to hear a clear educated guess of what's gonna happen. But I don't think anyone really knows.
I have stockpiled a large quantity of nic solution .. it is the only item in the PV world that I am concerned about aquiring in the future .. and with proper storage, it has an indefinite lifespan ..
I hedged my bet by not only putting nic in the freezer but buy laying in extra cartos, atties, RBA's and mechanical mods. I have no idea what they are going to include in their 'deeming' but I wanted to be prepared for the worst.
There is nothing wrong with laying in stock. I don't give a fig if people think I'm simply paranoid. There is, however, NO EXCUSE for not being proactive in trying to stem the tide of the ANTZ and their slavering desire to CONTROL how everyone lives. Stay active, get active, write letters, make phone calls, watch for news of impending bans in your areas etc. If you don't fight you have no room to whine if it goes against us.
Maxwell Edison: The nic farmers use is not safe to vape, and Wizard only requires that for over 100mg nic. They will sell anyone 100mg, it's when the percentage of nic in solution goes higher that they require certification.
There is nothing wrong with laying in stock. I don't give a fig if people think I'm simply paranoid. There is, however, NO EXCUSE for not being proactive in trying to stem the tide of the ANTZ and their slavering desire to CONTROL how everyone lives. Stay active, get active, write letters, make phone calls, watch for news of impending bans in your areas etc. If you don't fight you have no room to whine if it goes against us.
Maxwell Edison: The nic farmers use is not safe to vape, and Wizard only requires that for over 100mg nic. They will sell anyone 100mg, it's when the percentage of nic in solution goes higher that they require certification.
This all just scares the crap out of me...I don't want to lose my right to vape. I am so healthy now because of it, no cough, no asthma, I dont smell of tobacco...this is not the 1st time this has happened and if they fail which I hope they do! They will keep trying. This is fricking nerve wracking though, I find myself spending alot extra these days just to stock up. I've even thought of buying some diy stuff cause I can stock up so much more without it costing as much. Diy is scary to me though....what other choice do I have though?
This is not thier 1st attempt at this though, I am deffinetlt taking it seriously, but does anyone think it will actually happen this time? Do we stand a chance?
This is not thier 1st attempt at this though, I am deffinetlt taking it seriously, but does anyone think it will actually happen this time? Do we stand a chance?
I feel the same way. Even if I tried to DIY I'm gonna need a cartomizer to put it in. From what I've gathered ejuice might be a thing of the past, nonrefillable ecig only. But who know for sure? I think they will propose certain regulation then get reactions, so I believe we have more time than April. But I expect the worse and hope for the best. I too have been over sprending to stock up. I did this 2 years ago too. But this is different, more serious. I've written the FDA, my state reps, donated to CASAA and I hope we all pull together and keep this a legit alternative to smoking. Hell, nonrefillable ecigs without flavor that could end up costing as much as a pack of cigs. It's all about money with this government. They don't care about our health, that's a joke.
Aint that the truth, they would rather have us smoking tobacco and six feet under, than see us vape. This just infuriates me. I read this stuff daily to keep up on it, and I'm doing what i can to help. But honestly i think i should take a break from ecf every few days, this .... is just stressing me out lol. And even with what I'm doing to try and help, it sucks to think they may not listen at all. Why are they not trying to shut down tobacco instead! That is the real killer!
Money and control, it has nothing to do with our health or safety. All of the "we are looking out for you" is a smoke screen.
Quick economics lesson for those having trouble understanding the issue with the FDA regulating eliquids
If the FDA limits the market by enacting such stringent legislation that only a handful of vendors even have a hope of complying then that will cause the demand to increase because there arent enough vendors left to satisfy it.
This means prices will skyrocket in response and there will be widespread shortages on liquids. They can in effect ban vaping by enacting those measures.
IMO this is the greatest danger here as eliquids containing nicotine are the only things that even fall under their jurisdiction. I cant even see a biased judge saying they have the ability to restrict the components of electronic cigarettes.
If the hammer falls thats where its going to fall the hardest.
If the FDA limits the market by enacting such stringent legislation that only a handful of vendors even have a hope of complying then that will cause the demand to increase because there arent enough vendors left to satisfy it.
This means prices will skyrocket in response and there will be widespread shortages on liquids. They can in effect ban vaping by enacting those measures.
IMO this is the greatest danger here as eliquids containing nicotine are the only things that even fall under their jurisdiction. I cant even see a biased judge saying they have the ability to restrict the components of electronic cigarettes.
If the hammer falls thats where its going to fall the hardest.
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Petrodus
However ... All FDA Approved drug commercials include
a long list of disclaimers including the possibility of death
if you swallow the FDA Approved poisons.[End Quote]
Yea,a arthritis pill tht cn cuse......arthritis. nerve pill that can cause suicidal ideation. a thinking person might....well.....think.....before taking one of these pills. Cognitive dissonance.
However ... All FDA Approved drug commercials include
a long list of disclaimers including the possibility of death
if you swallow the FDA Approved poisons.[End Quote]
Yea,a arthritis pill tht cn cuse......arthritis. nerve pill that can cause suicidal ideation. a thinking person might....well.....think.....before taking one of these pills. Cognitive dissonance.
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