FDA says today's Wall St. Journal article is wrong

[aikanae1]

Buy they're still trying to classify our juice, which contains exactly 0% tobacco, as a tobacco product?

For some it's all about vapor. The radical anti-smokers want smoking *include vapor* "denormalized" so that it's not "cool" or common to see. I don't think they care what it is; tobacco, some other combustionable, vapor, etc.

Then take a look at the defeat of Calif's 648. That was done with the help of the local NORML group - LOL! I guess they like our ego batteries. The ecig business has dropped some prices of equip down from $50 to $6 that's modifiable to their useage.

Earlier this year, I saw a Groupon for a "dry herb atomizer" which was a 650mah ego battery and a CE4 with charger for a low, low price special of $70 (extra battery not included). Explain that. It's pretty mixed up.

One thing fairly obvious is that this has nothing to do with public health and safety when everything they seem to be concerned with is marketplace controls and limitations.

 

[AgentAnia]

Commentary by Klaus Kneale, Can The FDA Actually Ban Online E-Cig Sales? | Ecig Advanced News

Interesting read...

 

[zoiDman]

China...

The Actual Answer I was Looking for was your Postman.

But China is Close Enough.

 

[zoiDman]

Commentary by Klaus Kneale, Can The FDA Actually Ban Online E-Cig Sales? | Ecig Advanced News

Interesting read...

TY for Posting that Link.

There are some Other Interesting Reads on that site.

 

[AgentAnia]

There are some Other Interesting Reads on that site.

Agreed. This is one of my everyday reads.

 

[patkin]

Banning net sales can still happen on the local level. Someone correct me if I'm wrong but didn't Electronicstix relocate their warehouse from Utah to Idaho to ship from there right after Utah tried (or did) implement just this?

 

[platinum321]

FDA won't do anything....
I'm soooo somewhat upset about all else that's going on with our country.
Like the madness is Syria. Possibly being led into another war. Where I read we now have CIA operatives
on the ground along with military. Yes we always must fight for our right to vape and our freedoms.
But this is all a smoke screen....
Jus mho

The United States is a fascist government now and they will do everything in their power to control the individual their money and where they get anything. Bet your sweet arssse they want control of where your money goes to quench your nicotine addiction. The corporations run our government control the Wall Street journal and are vying to control all media so you only hear what they want you to hear. The comment in a earlier post that the Wall Street journal would not lie is laughable. That's all they do. Ever read an article on there that speaks of economic recovery? Yes? Well there ya go then.

So it is not a matter of if but when they (the corporations) get control.

“They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.”
― Benjamin Franklin

 

[Shekinahsgroom]

The comment in a earlier post that the Wall Street journal would not lie is laughable. That's all they do.

Becareful who you insult here....

 

[house mouse]

Where does the Nicotine come From?

What nicotine? I use 0mg. How is that a tobacco product? What do you think the chances are of the government leaving that alone in their sin taxing? Personally, I think slim and none. I stopped giving tobacco sin taxes to the government 3 years ago. I won't be contributing anymore. Good thing I DIY.

 

[zoiDman]

What nicotine? I use 0mg. How is that a tobacco product? What do you think the chances are of the government leaving that alone in their sin taxing? Personally, I think slim and none. I stopped giving tobacco sin taxes to the government 3 years ago. I won't be contributing anymore. Good thing I DIY.

I believe that there Isn't going to be a big Impact on PV's/Mods. There Isn't a Viable Way for the FDA to regulate them.

And if you are using 0mg, I don't see that the FDA could impact you much. PG,VG and Flavorings were around Way Before e-Cigarettes were.

Cartos and Clearo? I dunno. That seems that might be kinda a Grey Area. Hard to tell what the FDA/Customs could attempt on them. Probably not Much.

So for someone like yourself, I don't think the coming FDA Regulations are going to have much change on You.

BUT.

What does concern me is the Next Generation of People who could make the Switch from Smoking Cigarettes to use an e-Cigarette. that is what the Fight is about for Many of Us.

 

[zoiDman]

What nicotine? I use 0mg. How is that a tobacco product? What do you think the chances are of the government leaving that alone in their sin taxing? Personally, I think slim and none. I stopped giving tobacco sin taxes to the government 3 years ago. I won't be contributing anymore. Good thing I DIY.

BTW - Do you use RBA's?

 

[house mouse]

I believe that there Isn't going to be a big Impact on PV's/Mods. There Isn't a Viable Way for the FDA to regulate them.

And if you are using 0mg, I don't see that the FDA could impact you much. PG,VG and Flavorings were around Way Before e-Cigarettes were.

Cartos and Clearo? I dunno. That seems that might be kinda a Grey Area. Hard to tell what the FDA/Customs could attempt on them. Probably not Much.

So for someone like yourself, I don't think the coming FDA Regulations are going to have much change on You.

BUT.

What does concern me is the Next Generation of People who could make the Switch from Smoking Cigarettes to use an e-Cigarette. that is what the Fight is about for Many of Us.

Agree. I don't want to see them screw it up for anyone regardless of whether they use nicotine or not. But I was really referring to purchased 0mg juice. There is one that I still buy because I like it and can't replicate it. I was just making an observation that I don't think the government will make a distinction between 0mg juice and nicotine juice. I think they'll label(and tax) it all as a tobacco product whether it has any in it or not. And it is going to royally suck for people that haven't had the time to adjust to the learning curve to stock up on supplies needed to protect themselves.

 

[Uma]

The last substance they demoralized and outlawed, even though it was a booming business and life saving at that, was to stop the passivists from protesting the war, get angry enough to go to war, and to increase underground sells income.
I have a strong feeling we better start stockpiling more than just ecig stuff. Got beans?

 

[zoiDman]

Agree. I don't want to see them screw it up for anyone regardless of whether they use nicotine or not. But I was really referring to purchased 0mg juice. There is one that I still buy because I like it and can't replicate it. I was just making an observation that I don't think the government will make a distinction between 0mg juice and nicotine juice. I think they'll label(and tax) it all as a tobacco product whether it has any in it or not. And it is going to royally suck for people that haven't had the time to adjust to the learning curve to stock up on supplies needed to protect themselves.

If an e-Liquid doesn't have Nicotine in it, then I don't see how the FDA would have Jurisdiction over it. Or how it could be Taxed more than just Sales Tax.

I wonder if the Company you are getting it from will be around though when after have to Comply with all the Fed, State, County and City Requirements to sell a Tobacco Product.

And that is Given that Liquid e-Liquids are going to be Allowed to sold Anyway.

 

[house mouse]

BTW - Do you use RBA's?

Absolutely.

 

[zoiDman]

Absolutely.

0mg and RBA's = FDA Proof

 

[house mouse]

If an e-Liquid doesn't have Nicotine in it, then I don't see how the FDA would have Jurisdiction over it. Or how it could be Taxed more than just Sales Tax.

I wonder if the Company you are getting it from will be around though when after have to Comply with all the Fed, State, County and City Requirements to sell a Tobacco Product.

And that is Given that Liquid e-Liquids are going to be Allowed to sold Anyway.

I just know how ridiculous this government can get and I wouldn't put it past them to try. The company I buy from does have some B&M's in a couple of states. Theoretically I could take a road trip and combine it into a vacation/stock up run. Realistically, I probably wouldn't. I can live without the juice if I have to and keep on vaping. I'd just miss it.

EDIT: You know, the more I think about it, it's this whole crazy world of never knowing what new thing is coming around the block that I'd miss. Watching the innovation dry up.

 

[Bill Godshall]

I posted the two following comments (on the ECF thread started by Smokey Joe) cautioning folks about the unsubstantiated claims by unnamed sources in Friday's Wall St. Journal several hours before the FDA issued its correction/clarification.

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...es-electronic-cigarettes-10.html#post10474515

http://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/fo...es-electronic-cigarettes-11.html#post10474652

While I certainly don't trust the FDA to propose reasonable regulations for e-cigarettes, I agreed with FDA's statements on Friday afternoon about the claims made in the Wall St. Jrnl article.

Since 2009, I've been urging the FDA to issue a correction/clarification for all of the agency's false and misleading fear mongering claims about e-cigarettes, which the agency has refused to do.

zoiDman wrote:

You do understand that when an e-Liquid becomes a "Tobacco Product" that anyone selling e-Liquid in Arizona is going to have to Comply with ALL State, County and City Laws/Regulations regarding Tobacco Products.

This statement is NOT true, as FDA regulations for e-cigarettes will have no direct impact on existing state or local laws on e-cigarettes or tobacco products.

If/when the FDA imposes the "deeming" regulation and other regs for e-cigs (pursuant to the FSPTCA) as tobacco products, some state/local politicians will be emboldened to propose even more onerous state/local laws on e-cigs, but existing state/local statutes cannot be reinterpreted to mean or do something that they don't currently mean or do.

 

[zoiDman]

...

This statement is NOT true, as FDA regulations for e-cigarettes will have no direct impact on existing state or local laws on e-cigarettes or tobacco products.

If/when the FDA imposes the "deeming" regulation and other regs for e-cigs (pursuant to the FSPTCA) as tobacco products, some state/local politicians will be emboldened to propose even more onerous state/local laws on e-cigs, but existing state/local statutes cannot be reinterpreted to mean or do something that they don't currently mean or do.

Perhaps you can Clarify this for me.

If an e-Liquid Contains Nicotine, and the FDA Does classified it as a Tobacco Product, then are you saying that Each State would need to included e-Liquids to their definition of a Tobacco Product? Or does this Happen Automatically on the State Level?

And if a State does need to Included e-Liquids which contains Nicotine as a Tobacco Product, and the FDA has done so Already, it would seem that it would be a mere Procedural Issue and would be Hard to Oppose.

 

[Projectguy]

I'd also like to add that I've talked to indian reservation's (Mckellips and Indian Bend) and they are NOT interested in ecigs (they do sell one, Crown 7). I've talked to several independent smoke shops and the response has been cool at best. Not interested. Most are PRO regulation, saying that stores mixing liquids etc is "dangerous", "don't know what's in that stuff" and pretty much what you'd expect to hear, line by line, from BT. They are believing it hook, line and sinker. Kinda sad since they are small business too.

Stay tuned vaping is coming to a reservation near you the minute government starts to tax our products to the same level as analogs.