Throwing this out to the vaping wizards....
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Ok, so you are using a DIY 6mg liquid at 20 watts. Since you are just starting you should consider doubling the nic level to 12mg to see and you'll probably at least start to feel it. If you are doing mouth to lung (MTL) style vaping (sucking into your mouth first, then inhaling), close down the airflow to get an air resistance you feel comfortable with. If you are doing direct to lung style (DTL), then open up the airflow and perhaps push up the wattage to 30-35w (though I can't say if your coil/wicking will hold up to higher wattage vaping).
@jtbje I would agree with @Letitia above and bump it up. The one you have made is around 19 pg and 81 for vg. That will definitely feel airy so to speak. The PG will add more of a throat hit some smokers like to feel.
Bumping Nic up to 12mg would be 3.6 ml of Nic, 6.9 ml of PG, 17.4 ml of VG and 2.1 ml (7%)of flavoring if you are making a 30 ml bottle. That would give you 12mg 30pg/70vg final mix.
Hope this helps.
Bumping Nic up to 12mg would be 3.6 ml of Nic, 6.9 ml of PG, 17.4 ml of VG and 2.1 ml (7%)of flavoring if you are making a 30 ml bottle. That would give you 12mg 30pg/70vg final mix.
Hope this helps.
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What was your Total Flavoring Percentage? 5% ?
Not sure what type of Flavoring you are using? But that might need to be Increased.
That, and how long has the Mix sat/aged before you tried it?
As long as you are blowing out lots of vapor then your problem is throat hit and nicotine level. As others have said go with more PG for increased throat hit and up the nicotine. You are at 6mg’s, when I started vaping I used 36mg’s albeit with different equipment but when I started using a similar setup to yours I only dropped down to 25mg’s and I vape at 50% PG 50% VG. I think if you up your nicotine to 20-25mg’s you will get more satisfaction. My theory is get so much nicotine you don’t want anymore thus won’t want a cigarette. Blowing out thru your nose will increase nicotine absorption as well. Don’t be afraid to go way up in nicotine it won’t hurt you. I occasionally vape 30-35mg salt nicotine juice with a subohm setup with no issue. Good luck to you and with our guidance and your determination WE WILL BEAT THIS ADDICTION!!! See all caps so we ain’t F—ing around, but for real when you get the throat hit and nicotine level you need it’s gonna be easier then you think. Then when you get a flavor you love cigarettes are gonna taste so nasty you won’t remember what you ever saw in them. Looking forward to your success
Buy an Innokin Kroma with a Zenith tank.
They come with a 0.5 ohm coil and a 1.2 ohm coil. Try one then the other. Decide which you prefer and buy a 10 pack of those.
Kangor was once one of the better options but the Zenith set up demolishes the Kanger flavor-wise. Their coils last a good long time too. And the Kroma makes life simple.
Kangortech was one I used early on when I began vaping with modular devices (called mods around here), but when I tried the Zenith tank the Kangor stuff got put away.
Best regards.
They come with a 0.5 ohm coil and a 1.2 ohm coil. Try one then the other. Decide which you prefer and buy a 10 pack of those.
Kangor was once one of the better options but the Zenith set up demolishes the Kanger flavor-wise. Their coils last a good long time too. And the Kroma makes life simple.
Kangortech was one I used early on when I began vaping with modular devices (called mods around here), but when I tried the Zenith tank the Kangor stuff got put away.
Best regards.
Look up MacTechvpr and Baditude on here, both have some very useful blogs. I think your problem is the coil build and possibly wicking if you are using the RBA.
As Opinionated said, 20 watts may not be enough for the .4 ohm coil you are using, it might be as simple as boosting the watts up. Give that a try first, worst case you'll burn the wick a little, then you'll get some flavor, not good flavor, but flavor none the less
I vape using 26 gauge Kanthal at 1.2 ohms running around 12 watts for a cool vape, so a .4 ohm coil will easily be able to be vaped at a higher wattage than 20..
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If using the rba head in the Kanger the Zenith is not as flavorful. Drop in coils for the Zenith are better I admit.
jtbje said:
Baditude's Blogs | E-Cigarette Forum Pay particular attention to Good Starter Setups for a Beginner Vaper.
The problem of the OP in this thread is too complicated to give a simple single solution. Vaping issues are often best solved by trial and error.
I must say that it appears the OP is placing herself under unnecessary stress with an unreasonable deadline to achieve perfect results.
Hardware factors aside, picking e-liquid flavors you'll like is an extremely personal and individual preference. What I like you probably won't, and vice versa. Starting out with DIY flavors just complicates the entire new vaper scenario. Even with a great recipe, the right flavor and nicotine concentrates at the correct measurements the chances of liking the end product are probably only 50/50%. After learning to DIY to protect myself from a possible future vape appocalypse, I only had a success rate of maybe 30%, and to this day am still using commercially prepared e-liquids exclusively.
We won't generally know what flavors we like until we first try them. I love chocolate, but I've yet to find a chocolate vape flavor that doesn't taste like chalk. I don't like to eat, taste or smell coconut, but one of my favorite e-liquid flavors has coconut in it.
One must consider the OP has vaper's tongue.
Vaper's Tongue: What is it and what can be done?
The Dreaded Vaper’s Tongue: What is it, what causes it and how to cure it
We should consider inhale/exhale technique and understand that our tongue has taste buds that can distinguish between sweet and sour, bitterness and salty. Beyond that, we depend upon our sense of smell to assist our sense of taste. We often need to exhale our vapor through our nose so that the over 4000 smell sensors located in the nose can help the brain to determine specific flavors.
The Dreaded Vaper’s Tongue: What is it, what causes it and how to cure it
We should consider inhale/exhale technique and understand that our tongue has taste buds that can distinguish between sweet and sour, bitterness and salty. Beyond that, we depend upon our sense of smell to assist our sense of taste. We often need to exhale our vapor through our nose so that the over 4000 smell sensors located in the nose can help the brain to determine specific flavors.
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Not to confuse the issue, but I tend to agree with the other advice. Change your PG/VG ratio to about 40/60 (and be prepared to go higher if you're still not getting the throat hit you want).
Try doubling your nic percentage for a batch or two, and see what that does for you (being aware, over time, that you'll probably want to reduce it again after you are firmly off the sticks.)
Try doubling your flavor percentage, see what that does. You should be able to taste green apple, it's pretty powerful.
Mix in small batches until you get something close to what you want. Remember vaping is a journey, not a destination. If you're like most of us you'll be fiddling with it and trying new things for the rest of your life. That's perfectly normal
Get a small roll of 28 gauge wire (and if financing is not an issue) even a small roll of 32ga to go along with it. 20W is really too low for the 26, no matter how big the coil. The ramp time (the time it takes cold wire to heat up to vape temperature) is too long. Your problem may be you push the button and your lungs may be half full before you get any vapor. Try chain-vaping three hits in a row; if you find you are getting better vapor on the third than the first, a cold coil is at least part of your problem.
Steam Engine is my favorite coil calculator and I am glad to hear you're using it. But you absolutely have to know the diameter of the mandrel on which you wind your coil in order to make it work. Take a look at a coil kit, all of which will have a selection of mandrels of different size, as well as an ohmmeter, a tool I highly recommend for safety prior to mounting and firing your coil. I personally don't like any of the coil winding tools like the Coil-Master, but may people do. My favorite coil tool is a simple stainless steel hexagon bar step-turned down to diameters from 3.5 to 1 or 1.5mm. Drill bits, which have a known diameter, are a fine substitute, if perhaps a bit expensive for a large selection.
Note the "heat flux" section below the answer box in Steam Engine:
The depiction of 200 in the box is a measure of radiated power from the surface of the coil wire, using the coil depicted in the calculator, at whatever wattage is shown on the line below. A broad hint is also offered by the color of the flame icon to the left. This is a really useful tool. Once you find a power setting you like-- I prefer between 150-200-- you can use that box to determine how a proposed new coil will vape or, alternatively, where to set the mod power level to get you the warmth of vape you like. Changing the coil build, or the mod wattage, will move the number around. Therefore you can "experiment" with coil builds and get a pretty good idea how they will vape before you actually make the coil.
Part of the problem you and all new vapers face is there are a lot of variables involved and they are interdependent; change one thing and a lot of stuff moves around. This is simply part of the journey; everybody has to deal with it. Getting another mod is a good idea because you can drop it and break it (ask me how I know...). Not having a backup when your mod breaks is the fastest way I know to start smoking again. But there isn't anything actually wrong with your Kanger setup. If it isn't satisfying you it's far more likely you don't have it dialed in yet than that something is actually wrong with it. I won't offer a suggestion for different kit as I am not too well acquainted with gear in the beginner regimen; but others here are and you will get all the recommendations you need, I feel sure. The best way I know how to get dialed in is to try to limit your changes to one thing at a time. You can start immediately, using the juice you have, just by raising the wattage a bit to see if this helps you.
When you go to the store, they may have a "juice tasting" bar. If they do, use it. You might find a new flavor you like. If you can get one that is acceptable, try to buy a small quantity of the same flavor in several different nic strengths. That should help you determine where your nic level should be. Once you have that, then wiggle the PG/VG ratio to get the throat hit/vapor production balance you like.
The key is don't give up. Understand and accept it's going to take some time to find what you like, and that nobody can really help you with this; it's too individual because you're dealing with personal preferences. There is no "wrong" way to do vaping. If it's keeping you off the sticks, you're doing it right. Period. No matter what anyone else says.
Good luck and keep asking questions. We'll be here for you.
PS: if you can find a small quantity of rayon wick, or beg 6" of it from somebody hanging around the shop, give it a try. I like it a lot better than any kind of cotton.
Try doubling your nic percentage for a batch or two, and see what that does for you (being aware, over time, that you'll probably want to reduce it again after you are firmly off the sticks.)
Try doubling your flavor percentage, see what that does. You should be able to taste green apple, it's pretty powerful.
Mix in small batches until you get something close to what you want. Remember vaping is a journey, not a destination. If you're like most of us you'll be fiddling with it and trying new things for the rest of your life. That's perfectly normal
Get a small roll of 28 gauge wire (and if financing is not an issue) even a small roll of 32ga to go along with it. 20W is really too low for the 26, no matter how big the coil. The ramp time (the time it takes cold wire to heat up to vape temperature) is too long. Your problem may be you push the button and your lungs may be half full before you get any vapor. Try chain-vaping three hits in a row; if you find you are getting better vapor on the third than the first, a cold coil is at least part of your problem.
Steam Engine is my favorite coil calculator and I am glad to hear you're using it. But you absolutely have to know the diameter of the mandrel on which you wind your coil in order to make it work. Take a look at a coil kit, all of which will have a selection of mandrels of different size, as well as an ohmmeter, a tool I highly recommend for safety prior to mounting and firing your coil. I personally don't like any of the coil winding tools like the Coil-Master, but may people do. My favorite coil tool is a simple stainless steel hexagon bar step-turned down to diameters from 3.5 to 1 or 1.5mm. Drill bits, which have a known diameter, are a fine substitute, if perhaps a bit expensive for a large selection.
Note the "heat flux" section below the answer box in Steam Engine:
The depiction of 200 in the box is a measure of radiated power from the surface of the coil wire, using the coil depicted in the calculator, at whatever wattage is shown on the line below. A broad hint is also offered by the color of the flame icon to the left. This is a really useful tool. Once you find a power setting you like-- I prefer between 150-200-- you can use that box to determine how a proposed new coil will vape or, alternatively, where to set the mod power level to get you the warmth of vape you like. Changing the coil build, or the mod wattage, will move the number around. Therefore you can "experiment" with coil builds and get a pretty good idea how they will vape before you actually make the coil.
Part of the problem you and all new vapers face is there are a lot of variables involved and they are interdependent; change one thing and a lot of stuff moves around. This is simply part of the journey; everybody has to deal with it. Getting another mod is a good idea because you can drop it and break it (ask me how I know...). Not having a backup when your mod breaks is the fastest way I know to start smoking again. But there isn't anything actually wrong with your Kanger setup. If it isn't satisfying you it's far more likely you don't have it dialed in yet than that something is actually wrong with it. I won't offer a suggestion for different kit as I am not too well acquainted with gear in the beginner regimen; but others here are and you will get all the recommendations you need, I feel sure. The best way I know how to get dialed in is to try to limit your changes to one thing at a time. You can start immediately, using the juice you have, just by raising the wattage a bit to see if this helps you.
When you go to the store, they may have a "juice tasting" bar. If they do, use it. You might find a new flavor you like. If you can get one that is acceptable, try to buy a small quantity of the same flavor in several different nic strengths. That should help you determine where your nic level should be. Once you have that, then wiggle the PG/VG ratio to get the throat hit/vapor production balance you like.
The key is don't give up. Understand and accept it's going to take some time to find what you like, and that nobody can really help you with this; it's too individual because you're dealing with personal preferences. There is no "wrong" way to do vaping. If it's keeping you off the sticks, you're doing it right. Period. No matter what anyone else says.
Good luck and keep asking questions. We'll be here for you.
PS: if you can find a small quantity of rayon wick, or beg 6" of it from somebody hanging around the shop, give it a try. I like it a lot better than any kind of cotton.
Right...
So, it's great you're trying to get G'ma off the stinkies, it's never too late.
You've tried to do too much too soon, I don't know of anyone who jumped straight into making their own juice and coils.
Plan of action:
We need to start ruling things out whilst keeping things simple for ol' G'maw.
Go to a vape shop explain the situation. As money is not a primary consideration here lets get her a tank or 'RTA' with ready made coils. As she's just starting out go for high resistance coils, 0.8 ohm and above. 1.0 Ohm or 1.2 would be better (I'm not sure what they make these days).
This will give her something she can just screw into the atomiser (top tank section), then she can fill it with liquid and she's good to go.
On to the liquid or 'juice'. Let's go simple again, go for ready made liquid. Again, as she's just starting out higher is better. People used to start on 18/24mg juice, if they sell 12mg then that should be fine too.
Being a current smoker her natural reaction will be something called MTL, or mouth to lung. This is an action similar to smoking where you draw the vapor into your mouth first then breathe it in. A high resistance coil and high nic liquid will work well for this.
One thing you can do is have a play with the airflow on the new tank you'll be buying. There'll be a ring that restricts the amount of air going through the tank. You'll want to close that down a bit or reduce the airflow. That should help.
Beyond this everything escalates, you get into 'sub-ohm', low nic liquids with a different inhale style called DTL where it's essentially like breathing in through a straw. But that's for later and it takes time to learn what works.
Maybe some others can suggest a good tank with premade coils, I'm out the loop as I do it all myself.
Start simple and good luck!
So, it's great you're trying to get G'ma off the stinkies, it's never too late.
You've tried to do too much too soon, I don't know of anyone who jumped straight into making their own juice and coils.
Plan of action:
We need to start ruling things out whilst keeping things simple for ol' G'maw.
Go to a vape shop explain the situation. As money is not a primary consideration here lets get her a tank or 'RTA' with ready made coils. As she's just starting out go for high resistance coils, 0.8 ohm and above. 1.0 Ohm or 1.2 would be better (I'm not sure what they make these days).
This will give her something she can just screw into the atomiser (top tank section), then she can fill it with liquid and she's good to go.
On to the liquid or 'juice'. Let's go simple again, go for ready made liquid. Again, as she's just starting out higher is better. People used to start on 18/24mg juice, if they sell 12mg then that should be fine too.
Being a current smoker her natural reaction will be something called MTL, or mouth to lung. This is an action similar to smoking where you draw the vapor into your mouth first then breathe it in. A high resistance coil and high nic liquid will work well for this.
One thing you can do is have a play with the airflow on the new tank you'll be buying. There'll be a ring that restricts the amount of air going through the tank. You'll want to close that down a bit or reduce the airflow. That should help.
Beyond this everything escalates, you get into 'sub-ohm', low nic liquids with a different inhale style called DTL where it's essentially like breathing in through a straw. But that's for later and it takes time to learn what works.
Maybe some others can suggest a good tank with premade coils, I'm out the loop as I do it all myself.
Start simple and good luck!
Innokin Zenith clearomizer tank would be tops on the list. Very popular and available in most vape shops everywhere.
OMG! Talk about jumping in to the deep end, without knowing how to swim! @Baditude and @Schlinky are right - there are just too many variables, and you don't have enough experience yet to quickly narrow down which will really help you.
I don't mean this as a criticism @jtbje - we all began knowing virtually nothing about vaping. But it honestly scares me to know that you're making diy juice without even knowing the strength of the nic you're using, and having a non-vaping person make your coils. All the above is great advice, but....a LOT of info.
If I were you, I'd go back to the starting line. You've tried an airy, direct to lung setup, and it's not doing it for you. I'd get a simple mouth to lung (the way cigarettes are typically inhaled) setup that uses drop-in coils - preferably one that offers multiple coil types. The Zenith/Kroma kit that @United States recommended would likely be a good choice - it comes with a .8 and 1.6 ohm coil. Buy a couple of small samples of ready made juice flavors you like, in different strengths. Typical smokers would need 12-18mg nicotine to be satisfied.
And @Baditude can give you his link on How to Inhale, so you can narrow down what will satisfy you. But I'd definitely start simple, and slowly improve the parts that don't quite satisfy you. Be careful, and safe!
How about we help her get the existing gear functional first before she "steps up" to the next purchase?
Most all this gear will function to one degree or another.
She's having juice issues, hardware issues, or both at the same time. She should be able to work here and at least get a few decent puffs before she has to go buy something new. She has 100mg nic, VG, PG and flavoring and stock hardware. Right?
Most all this gear will function to one degree or another.
She's having juice issues, hardware issues, or both at the same time. She should be able to work here and at least get a few decent puffs before she has to go buy something new. She has 100mg nic, VG, PG and flavoring and stock hardware. Right?
How about we help her get the existing gear functional first before she "steps up" to the next purchase?
Most all this gear will function to one degree or another.
She's having juice issues, hardware issues, or both at the same time. She should be able to work here and at least get a few decent puffs before she has to go buy something new. She has 100mg nic, VG, PG and flavoring and stock hardware. Right?
Well they already said cost isn't the primary driver, getting started on the road is more important. All the kit they've already bought isn't going anywhere so they can come back to it when the time is right. Put the nic in the freezer and it'll be fine.
Spending another $100 is cheap compared to getting confused with too many variables and giving up trying to vape.
Yes, I considered that but....I consider going to a drop-in coil not a step up, but a step back.How about we help her get the existing gear functional first before she "steps up" to the next purchase?
Most all this gear will function to one degree or another.
She's having juice issues, hardware issues, or both at the same time. She should be able to work here and at least get a few decent puffs before she has to go buy something new. She has 100mg nic, VG, PG and flavoring and stock hardware. Right?
Her complaint was: "The set up and juice I have now is like air." And said "finances not an issue"
We're all different, but for me - no amount of tweaking would make a DTL setup satisfying for my MTL style.
edit: I also considered suggesting buying an atty only, since the Kanger Mod isn't the issue. But then remembered she didn't have a backup yet.
How about we help her get the existing gear functional first before she "steps up" to the next purchase?
Most all this gear will function to one degree or another.
She's having juice issues, hardware issues, or both at the same time. She should be able to work here and at least get a few decent puffs before she has to go buy something new. She has 100mg nic, VG, PG and flavoring and stock hardware. Right?
Really have to agree with this.
Because if someone New posted in the DIY Section about a New Recipe they made and said they were "Unimpressed", the Usual Replies would be to let it Steep a tad Longer and or consider Increasing the Flavoring Percentage. Not to rush out and Buy a New set-up.
5% of Capella Green Apple probably Isn't going to Knock the Socks Off most people. Just as many are going to want a Few Drops of a Sweetener in that Mix. Or maybe a Drop of Pineapple or 2 to give it some Zing.
Could fill in your location, it may help you in obtaining location specific information (such as knowledgeable B&M vape shops) to your question(s).
On the top right hand corner of this post you will find --"your name" next to "Inbox and Alerts"
Place the mouse pointer on your name. You will get a drop down and on the left hand side of this drop down you will find "Personal Details". Click Personal Details.
In Personal Details, in middle of screen in gray, you will find "Location" Could fill that box line in.
re: New users - Put your location in your Profile...
You should do just fine if you put a little effort in reading about vaping before you listen to a salesman.
The information below may help you to obtain a good foundation of vaping knowledge.
Might like to read:
Learn About Vaping Here - Everything Ecigs - From Beginner To Advanced
Learn What Vaping is and How to Inhale Properly - Vaping360
https://spinfuel.com/new-vapers-start/
ECigarette Academy: Essential Need to Know for New Vapers
Beginner Archives - Guide To Vaping
Vaping 101: An Ultimate Guide Focusing on Basics for Beginners
6 Quick & Useful Vaping Tips for Beginners
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...up-the-vaping-ladder-with-egos-and-mods.5058/
https://www.e-cigarette-forum.com/f...nk-or-what-a-guide-to-juice-attachments.3230/
One other suggestion to be clear, it's all about the atomizer, the mod and juice will take care of themselves for awhile. Both juice and battery service the atomizer.
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