Tobacco extraction using heated Ethanol

[Brad P]

It seems it is available at local liquor stores....but not in California. Our idiotic state legislature is "protecting" us from ourselves, we can only get the Everclear 151...woopee!

Yea, I'm in the same boat! I had to tap the shoulder of a friend who was going to lake Tahoe. They were able to find me some on the Nevada state line. There are other brands of 190 proof alcohol that may be a little cheeper. I don't think it matters for extraction purposes. (I should have gotten more)

 

[IDJoel]

.but not in California.

I don't have any idea how frequently you, or your friends, go out of state; but both Nevada, and Oregon sell 190 proof PGA.

 

[Fredman1]

(Pure Grain Alcohol) is available at local liquor stores.

Man I hope you people realise how lucky you are. To get that here (NZ) is a hell of a hassle...and expensive

 

[Str8vision]

It seems it is available at local liquor stores....but not in California. Our idiotic state legislature is "protecting" us from ourselves, we can only get the Everclear 151...woopee!

Unfortunately, many states in the U.S. prohibit the sale of 190 proof PGA. When you asked where I was able to get mine I feared you might live in one of the "drier" areas. Many people around the globe have informed me they don't have access to 190 proof, most can't even get 151. I do believe 151 would work just fine but haven't tried it myself. My curiosity is peaked so I'll use 151 proof PGA for my next extraction, we'll see what transpires....

There are other brands of 190 proof alcohol that may be a little cheeper. I don't think it matters for extraction purposes. (I should have gotten more)

Absolutely true, I use "Clear Springs" brand when available because it's usually 15% less expensive than "Everclear" and works exactly the same. I can't tell a difference between the brands when it comes to flavor extractions, ethanol is ethanol.

Man I hope you people realise how lucky you are. To get that here (NZ) is a hell of a hassle...and expensive

I do. Since starting this thread I've received PM's from dozens of people around the world telling me they don't have legal access to PGA. In those cases I usually recommend using 80/20 PG/VG solvent (cold soak) for their extractions. There are ways of distilling lower grades of drinking alcohol to dramatically increase the ethanol content but chances are it's illegal to do so in areas where PGA is prohibited so not worth the potential risk. The cost of 190 proof PGA is reasonable here, if it weren't, being somewhat of a rebel, I'd figure a way around it...

 

[PeterRamish]

Well, now that you opened this can of worms, where do you get 95% (190 proof) ethyl alcohol from?

You are making this much harder than it has to be. In any state in the USA (including California) it is 100% legal to buy pure Ethyl Alcohol for any purpose except to make alcoholic beverages.

I posted links to two very reliable sources that will UPS to your door.

About Stills:
Also in that posting is information about the use of "heads" or "foreshots" from grain mashes in reflux moonshine stills. If you want to make your own Ethyl Alcohol you must use pure sugar and specialized yeasts. Using grain mashes will not work. Supplies to do this at home are available here and dozens of other places on the web. Issues with grain mash chemistry is in my link posted above.

About Molecular Sieves:
If you want to turn your 150 Everclear or even 45 proof Vodka into 99.5% Ethyl Alcohol. all you need is a quart mason jar filled with these. Fill the jar with your everclear and put the entire thing in a cold water bath as the process liberates heat. Leave for 12hrs and pour off the pure alcohol. Then recharge the beads in a 275F oven for 12 hrs and reuse indefinitely. I have used this process to obtain the alcohol for many extractions.

What a Chemist would say:
Retired after 30 years in industrial chemistry I thought I would share this: The 3A sieves and sugar turbo yeast fermentation work like a charm, only if you do not value your personal time as worth anything. In the real world (professional vrs kitchen chemistry), buying precursor chemistry from companies that do that for a living is the way it is done. No chemist makes his own reagents. In your case buying USP Culinary Alcohol from one of the listed sources is cheaper in the long run if you calculate in you time and effort.

 

[brewbear]

You are making this much harder than it has to be. In any state in the USA (including California) it is 100% legal to buy pure Ethyl Alcohol for any purpose except to make alcoholic beverages.

I posted links to two very reliable sources that will UPS to your door.

About Stills:
Also in that posting is information about the use of "heads" or "foreshots" from grain mashes in relfux moonshine stills. If you want to make your own Ethyl Alcohol you must use pure sugar and specialized yeasts. Using grain mashes will not work. Supplies to do this at home are available here and dozens of other places on the web. Issues with grain mash chemistry is in my link posted above.

About Molecular Sieves:
If you want to turn your 150 Everclear or even 45 proof Vodka into 99.5% Ethyl Alcohol. all you need is a quart mason jar filled with these. Fill the jar with your everclear and put the entire thing in a cold water bath as the process liberates heat. Leave for 12hrs and pour off the pure alcohol. Then recharge the beads in a 275F oven for 12 hrs and reuse indefinitely. I have used this process to obtain the alcohol for many extractions.

What a Chemist would say:
Retired after 30 years in industrial chemistry I thought I would share this: The 3A sieves and sugar turbo yeast fermentation work like a charm, only if you do not value your personal time as worth anything. In the real world (professional vrs kitchen chemistry), buying precursor chemistry from companies that do that for a living is the way it is done. No chemist makes his own reagents. In your case buying USP Culinary Alcohol from one of the listed sources is cheaper in the long run if you calculate in you time and effort.

Would a toaster oven work for the beads regeneration?

 

[PeterRamish]

Would a toaster oven work for the beads regeneration?

It probably would, but there are a couple of issues with that: One is that the physical space is very limited in most toaster ovens, for an example of the space required, when I regenerate 1lb of beads I spread them out in a thin layer on 5ea 12" Dixie Paper plates and this takes up the entire top shelf in my standard home oven, which has a shelf dimension of approx 18"x21".

The other consideration is that some toaster ovens have a direct IR element above the shelf, this is a consideration because the beads should not be heated above 300C which can lead to an irreversible collapse of structure and a loss of adsorptive capacity. In industry, beads are dried in chambers that allow for carefully controlled heated gas flows. In our compromise of "kitchen chemistry", the best practice is to go slowly at low temperatures and let time to the work. Keep in mind, also, that you must vent the moist air as the beads release the water.

 

[brewbear]

It probably would, but there are a couple of issues with that: One is that the physical space is very limited in most toaster ovens, for an example of the space required, when I regenerate 1lb of beads I spread them out in a thin layer on 5ea 12" Dixie Paper plates and this takes up the entire top shelf in my standard home oven, which has a shelf dimension of approx 18"x21".

The other consideration is that some toaster ovens have a direct IR element above the shelf, this is a consideration because the beads should not be heated above 300C which can lead to an irreversible collapse of structure and a loss of adsorptive capacity. In industry, beads are dried in chambers that allow for carefully controlled heated gas flows. In our compromise of "kitchen chemistry", the best practice is to go slowly at low temperatures and let time to the work. Keep in mind, also, that you must vent the moist air as the beads release the water.

Thank you, that is really valuable information. My first thought was: Low and slow? I'll put them in my smoker! It heats to 220 deg.F so it will work! Smoky NET, I may be on to something!
I'm being silly, today has been a long week for me! Beads were ordered, planned a trip to my old hangout for a pound or three of my absolute favorite pipe tobacco (house blend) with a stop at Bevmo for a couple of bottles of Everclear 151.
As an aside, any of you folks squonk? Just curious of the type of gear used.

 

[Str8vision]

A year or two ago there was a discussion about the use of Molecular Sieves to concentrate ethanol by removing the water content. At the top of page 33 in this thread there's a link to an interesting video showing someone using 3A Molecular Sieves to do exactly that. I'll try to link to the video;

 

[Str8vision]

When it comes to extracting flavor from tobacco, of all the gadgets I've bought or built the most useful I possess is the one I found in my 100 year old house, a vintage 1950's "Busy Liz" aluminum canning funnel. What sets the Busy Liz apart from modern day canning funnels is a threaded accessory ring on the bottom. A 5.5cm paper lab filter fit inside the threaded ring perfectly, once installed the Busy Liz canning funnel becomes an effective filter holder that's capable of holding a large volume of extract. Because of its wide stance standard coffee filters fit inside the Busy Liz much like sitting in a filter basket. These occasionally pop up on eBay for $7 to $35 although you must pay close attention to the condition (dents or damage around the threading) and make sure the threaded ring is included.

 

[Str8vision]

The best way I've found to accurately control the temperature of a slow cooker (crock pot) is by using a temperature controller. There are many different temperature controllers that will work but for those who want a simplistic plug-n-play unit I like pre-wired digital units like this;

They cost around $25 to $35. Plug it in, calibrate the sensor, set the temperature parameters, set the crock pot on medium, plug the crock pot into the controller's heating output, drop temperature probe into the hot water bath and the controller does the rest. The controller turns the crock pot on and off in order to accurately maintain the set temperature. The controller can be programmed to maintain any temperature within its control range (-40F to 240F).

I use a PID temperature controller (works the same way) but it requires wiring, if I ever need to replace it I'll go with a pre-wired controller like the one pictured. Use of a temperature controller makes a 12 hour 165F heated extraction -a lot- easier.

 

[Brad P]

...a vintage 1950's "Busy Liz" aluminum canning funnel...

Str8vision was kind enough to steer me in the direction of one of these a few months ago! They are Wonderful; absolutly perfect for our extractions. If you can come across one of them, I would highly recomend them to anyone...

I got these
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B006H8WFQG/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

leftyandspanky,

It looks like I got the same lab filters as you did but I got the 5.5 cm diameter. I'm really happy with the way they preform. Its almost the weekend..., I'm excited for you!!! keep us posted.

 

[leftyandsparky]

Str8vision was kind enough to steer me in the direction of one of these a few months ago! They are Wonderful; absolutly perfect for our extractions. If you can come across one of them, I would highly recomend them to anyone...



leftyandspanky,

It looks like I got the same lab filters as you did but I got the 5.5 cm diameter. I'm really happy with the way they preform. Its almost the weekend..., I'm excited for you!!! keep us posted.

I will! Waiting on my husband to bring home the 190.
My filters will not be here until next week, so I will keep everything in the freezer until then.

 

[brewbear]

Molecular sieves - '
Half pound favorite pipe tobacco - ' (though I was stuck in traffic 1.5 hours each way, still worth it to me)
Tomorrow, trip to Bevmo, order wired temp. controller.

BTW, the little ' stands for "check"

 

[Fredman1]

Wow this is fantastic news for me. I've decided not to use the heads from my distilling friend. I'm afraid of the methanol factor...
What he can give me is 60% ethanol, and with molecular sieve I can up the percentage myself.
Question is how much can 60% be upped...?

 

[Str8vision]

Wow this is fantastic news for me. I've decided not to use the heads from my distilling friend. I'm afraid of the methanol factor...
What he can give me is 60% ethanol, and with molecular sieve I can up the percentage myself.
Question is how much can 60% be upped...?

Using 3A molecular sieves, 120 proof (60% ethanol) can supposedly be concentrated to 200 proof (100% ethanol). You'd end up with slightly less than 60% of the original volume once all the water has been removed. A liter of 60% ethanol should yield around 580ml of 100% ethanol minus any filtering loss if you plan to filter the reside (dust) out the sieves leave behind.

 

[Str8vision]

I will! Waiting on my husband to bring home the 190.
My filters will not be here until next week, so I will keep everything in the freezer until then.

I just started an extraction of C&D's "Old Joe Krantz" which has about the same weight per volume as Louisiana Red. I managed to fit close to 1.5 ounces of tobacco in a pint jar when filling it to the 10 ounce mark. This made me think about you and your 1.5 ounce tins of Louisiana Red. You might be able to fit a tin's worth of LR in a single pint jar.

I then poured in around 340ml of ethanol filling the jar to the 12 ounce mark.

From this I expect to recover somewhere between 9 and 10 ounces of extract (270 to 300ml).

 

[leftyandsparky]

Thanks! I’m going to get everything started this afternoon.

 

[leftyandsparky]

Starting

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Str8vision]

Thanks! I’m going to get everything started this afternoon.

When you begin the 12 hour hot extraction, don't start the clock until the water bath and macerated tobacco reach 160F. For my cheap ($25) Hamilton Beach slow cooker it takes nearly 45 minutes for everything to reach the target temperature. I miss my old one (90's model), don't remember what brand it was but it heated everything up much faster.