Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[stols001]

Congress would have to make it a crime. Right now it's a civil infraction; shops would be in violation of a regulation, not a criminal law.

Is that good though? I mean, really? I have done some sort of edgy not crim-y things, like import a medication that was only manufactured in France. If you import no more than a 3 month supply if they catch you like, they send it back, and send you a letter about how that 's not okay, and you should stop.

But I imported plenty more packages of that medication without incident, heck, some places would ship it to you free of charge, if it got stopped. Enforcement was not FREQUENT is what I'm saying I don't think I was on a list or anything.

I will say, I imported a Class I medication (also for treatment as it happened.) The process was labyrinthine, it took me forever to figure out a) a legitimate source b) get it there c) it was 100 percent worth it (only because I did not get caught but it WORKED so there was that.)

I guess you'd have time to bail before regulation became enforceable action but I don't know how MUCH time, or in what specific circumstances.

I totally knew exactly what I was getting into with both circumstance, including the fact that importing a class I substance was a felony.

IDK I think importing Russian Wives should be a felony they are far more dangerous to mankind than like, the substance I was importing which was really pretty benign the government just didn't like it because it WORKS and yeah well a few addicts using it snuck off to get high and died.

I can say that because I am (partial Russian heritage) a Russian wife, but everything ecig is so murky. If I had a million dollars, I would buy me a vape shop but not a real vape shop that's cruel) bonus points to those who can identify that slightly adapted band lyric but like I would be FREAKING out but still in business for now but IDK. I do NOT know.

It's all as clear as mud to me, and I have done a lot of interesting things and my sister works for a judge on the 9th Federal court in a program so secret she can't tell us what it is. I am pretty sure she could not explain vape law coherently to me even if she put on her Lawyer Hat and started reading.... and reading...

Etc.

Anna

 

[AttyPops]

It's...like a prime time TV drama!

I am pretty sure she could not explain vape law coherently to me even if she put on her Lawyer Hat and started reading.... and reading...

Yeah, there are no coherent vape laws, there is only Zuul.

 

[NolaMel]

Guess that's the difference between a black market and a grey market. Plenty of people would be willing to operate in a grey market. They might be different people than operated in a completely legal market. They take a bit of a chance doing it, and their customers would have to take a chance too.

Unfortunately, there are likely to be plenty customers who don’t know it’s grey market. Open door/available products in a shop in a strip mall hardly screams illegal to uniformed people

 

[Brewdawg1181]

Guess that's the difference between a black market and a grey market. Plenty of people would be willing to operate in a grey market. They might be different people than operated in a completely legal market. They take a bit of a chance doing it, and their customers would have to take a chance too.

Years past, gray market meant a genuine, legal product that got diverted and sold thru unauthorized channels. Like say, authentic Pioneer speakers that were intended to be sold at Circuit City, but got diverted through distribution and ended up being sold at unauthorized retailers.

But I don't know what you'd call the market for all of these products that strictly speaking, aren't legal, but the government has deliberately turned a blind eye to for quite some time. I guess it could be called gray market....definitions do change. I'm not gay, but might've been 100 years ago.

 

[BigPappa]

One thing I just thought about concerning enforcement isn't just the "anti-vaping warriors" making complaints that I mentioned the other day, but also competitors making complains. It might be in a company that paid for PMTA best interest to blow people in. Or shops that are complying, reporting non-compliant shops.

 

[Rossum]

Or shops that are complying, reporting non-complaint shops.

I don't think there are going to be any FDA-compliant vape shops after May.

Of course there are no DEA-compliant MJ dispensaries either, so....

 

[BigPappa]

I don't think there are going to be any FDA-compliant vape shops after May.

Probably not... the only way they would be is if they only had items in their shop that had submitted a PMTA. A compliant shop would probably only have like 5 items. lol

 

[CaveFurby]

"IDK I think importing Russian Wives should be a felony they are far more dangerous to mankind".......LOLOLOL!

 

[Rossum]

Everyone should read this:
https://www.fda.gov/media/133880/download

I don't remember the exact date it was published, but it was sometime this month, so it can't be much more than 10 days old. I'm sure it's been linked here before, but I just got to reading it in its entirety this evening.

The FDA is now taking the attitude that every "deemed" tobacco product that hasn't had a PMTA approved is on the market illegally, and it's all a question of enforcement priorities. They're basically saying they can decide to enforce against any such product anytime they want, whether the PMTA submission deadline has passed or not.

But they also say that even after May 12, 2020, that,

FDA will make enforcement decisions on a case-by-case basis, recognizing that it is unable, as a practical matter, to take enforcement action against every illegally marketed tobacco product, and that it needs to make the best use of Agency resources.

So they're basically admitting that they can't really shut it all down due to a lack of resources.

Gray market indeed.

 

[CMD-Ky]

FDA will make enforcement decisions on a case-by-case basis,

"...case by case basis... We will enforce this as we choose to enforce this, we will call it "prosecutorial discretion".

 

[BigPappa]

Someone posted about this in different thread yesterday:
"aspirevapeco If you could vote on one product to be submitted for PMTA, which would you choose?"

I thought I read somewhere a couple months ago that some people interpreted the PMTA as needing the full device and liquid... i.e. not just a tank, it would need to be a fully functioning unit and that it had to be all proprietary... like not a 510 connection so it could not be used with something else. Was that interpretation incorrect?

 

[DPLongo22]

FDA will make enforcement decisions on a case-by-case basis,

"...case by case basis... We will enforce this as we choose to enforce this, we will call it "prosecutorial discretion".

 

[Bronze]

View attachment 862969

Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation

We have assumed control.
We have assumed control.
We have assumed control.

 

[DPLongo22]

Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation
Attention all Planets of the Solar Federation

We have assumed control.
We have assumed control.
We have assumed control.

Perfection, Sir Bronze.


"...and the trees were all kept equal, by hatchet, ax, and saw."

 

[AttyPops]

"...and the ones mother gives you, [Nanny state reference]
don't do anything at all.......
Go ask Alice..."

-Grace Slick (White Rabbit)

 

[somdcomputerguy]

"...and the ones mother gives you, [Nanny state reference]
don't do anything at all.......
Go ask Alice..."

-Grace Slick (White Rabbit)

 

[somdcomputerguy]

View attachment 862981

HookTube search​

 

[susieqz]

my fav song ever written,

 

[stols001]

Oh I'm in the mood for a melody....

Then I have to bathe and go to Walmart. So, I will again present the best song to represent vaping ever. I prefer the original version but like the video is so good, it's hard to not love both.



This song represents vaping as we know it now.

OMG! I just saw my search history. It contains the search term "Sex with animals!" What do I DO???????? Help. Think "The Deeper thoughts and inner wisdom thread."

That thread is gonna get me arrested. LOL

Anna​

 

[DPLongo22]

That thread is gonna get me arrested. LOL

Just THAT one, ya thinkin'?