Deeming Regulations have been released!!!!

[Bronze]

I honestly feel like they targeted the vaping industry so specifically, that the surveys we've been filling out are bought and paid for by the FDA or BT.

We thought we were helping our cause and each other, but we were giving them the blueprints of our own doom.

You might think it's impossible, but the FDA regs are a VERY clear indication that money talks.

Anyone who thinks BT/BP didn't write those regs are naive.

 

[zoiDman]

Not giving up hope, ...

Good, because I still believe there is Hope that we can Effect a level of Change in all this.

 

[classwife]

I honestly feel like they targeted the vaping industry so specifically, that the surveys we've been filling out are bought and paid for by the FDA or BT.

We thought we were helping our cause and each other, but we were giving them the blueprints of our own doom.

You might think it's impossible, but the FDA regs are a VERY clear indication that money talks.

and I think that the "leaked" regs wasn't an accident...I think it was a fishing expedition

 

[MyMagicMist]

Others have had similar thoughts before:

“There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws.”
-- Ayn Rand

Kind of points toward government's irrelevance then as well. Government has nothing to do so needs to create criminals and bogey men to show itself attempting to do something. "Look, we got important stuff to do." Meanwhile, they go into their offices and nap knowing there is really nothing to do. Take into account the Hegelian Dialectic & it seems fairly summed to me. We ought to start Chicken Littles out as Chicken Littles, spades as spades. Then, just laugh as they tell you the sky is falling but only they have the best plan on how to save us all, children first.

"Excuse me but no, I'm not interested in your solution for your problem that you created in order to sell me, your solution. I no longer consent to playing your silly game. Thanks, have a good one."

 

[GunMonkeyINTL]

I haven't seen this angle discussed anywhere yet, so I'll throw it out there.

I think all pretty well realize that, despite what the FDA is claiming it can do, they can't enforce any of this against 0mg juice, and the equipment for *exclusive* use with it any more than the DEA can regulate water pipes that are designated for tobbaco use.

That leaves us with the sole problem of nicotine. But I don't think even that nut is uncrackable.

Two words:

Indian Reservations.

At the very least, they are already immune to the taxation tactics the government might use, but they are also currently in battle with the FDA, specifically, over regulation of produce production and distribution rules.

THEY'RE CURRENTLY FIGHTING FOR EXEMPTION FROM THE FDA'S REGULATION AUTHORITY.

If they make ground there, which the two previous administrations have given them legal ammunition for, getting nicotine to supplement your 0mg vaping habit could be as simple as a trip to your local res.

All it would take is one creative NA entrepreneur, and we could totally remove the FDA from any say in any segment of vaping other than the BT product category.

 

[crxess]

I wouldn't even mention a thing about nicotine...nada...total separation.




NOT ANOTHER DIME !
NOT ONE DIME !

Your Avi is Breaking my heart

they basically want vaping products that are successful with helping folks quit smoking ... off the market.

it's not the children they are trying to protect ... it is their smoking customers they are trying to keep smoking.

the regs are as simple and straight forward as that

Quoted to my FB page for Truth to Perfection!!!

* Fell and struck my head against my Safe while getting up from bed. Not focused to discuss anything quite yet
Feeling kind of

 

[KODIAK (TM)]

Anyone who thinks BT/BP didn't write those regs are naive.

Nonsense. BT actually supports the Cole-Bishop amendment.

 

[DPLongo22]

I haven't seen this angle discussed anywhere yet, so I'll throw it out there.

I think all pretty well realize that, despite what the FDA is claiming it can do, they can't enforce any of this against 0mg juice, and the equipment for *exclusive* use with it any more than the DEA can regulate water pipes that are designated for tobbaco use.

That leaves us with the sole problem of nicotine. But I don't think even that nut is uncrackable.

Two words:

Indian Reservations.

At the very least, they are already immune to the taxation tactics the government might use, but they are also currently in battle with the FDA, specifically, over regulation of produce production and distribution rules.

THEY'RE CURRENTLY FIGHTING FOR EXEMPTION FROM THE FDA'S REGULATION AUTHORITY.

If they make ground there, which the two previous administrations have given them legal ammunition for, getting nicotine to supplement your 0mg vaping habit could be as simple as a trip to your local res.

All it would take is one creative NA entrepreneur, and we could totally remove the FDA from any say in any segment of vaping other than the BT product category.

If you recall, many moons ago, they began selling cigs that way (MEGA cheap). The feds cracked down on them, then everyone who purchased that way (myself included) received massive tax-owed notices, that we were literally forced to pay.

It may be a solution, but it won't last. Good thought though - I like the fact that we're thinking...

Don't stop believing, and all that-there.

 

[DPLongo22]

* Fell and struck my head against my Safe while getting up from bed. Not focused to discuss anything quite yet
Feeling kind of

I do hope you're not serious.

 

[mpols]

Slightly off topic. I need some help on an article on kids and vaping. I posted it here, but thought to ask here also since there is more people reading this thread.

 

[zoiDman]

...

* Fell and struck my head against my Safe while getting up from bed. Not focused to discuss anything quite yet
Feeling kind of

Man... I hope you are OK.

 

[coldgin96]

FDA-funded study concludes e-cigs may not be so bad after all

 

[DPLongo22]

Slightly off topic. I need some help on an article on kids and vaping. I posted it here, but thought to ask here also since there is more people reading this thread.

Please forgive my cynicism, and understand that I hope you are being totally sincere, but many of us are concerned about federal "plants" trying to find information that may help them shut down the industry.

If I may be so bold, would you be willing to provide some credentials, so we might feel more comfortable with the issue? We are, by nature, a helpful group of people, and would like nothing more than to assist with such an endeavor as you present here.

But we're all a bit "stunned" right now. Please understand that, and forgive us for it. If we're able to help, and there's defined validity, you've come to the right place.

Thank you for understanding.

 

[classwife]

* Fell and struck my head against my Safe while getting up from bed. Not focused to discuss anything quite yet
Feeling kind of

You have someone home there with you ??

 

[DC2]

I honestly feel like they targeted the vaping industry so specifically, that the surveys we've been filling out are bought and paid for by the FDA or BT.

I don't see why they would bother with such an effort.
They can get all the info they want for free right here in this forum.

I'll still be taking every survey supported by those I trust.

 

[zoiDman]

FDA-funded study concludes e-cigs may not be so bad after all

Also from the Site you linked to...

Nicotine inhaler doubles chances of quitting smoking, study finds

Funny how if you Inhale Nicotine from a BP Sold device that it Doubles your chances of Quitting Smoking. But if you Inhale Nicotine from a Non-BP Device, an e-Cigarette, it Doesn't Work.

 

[Eskie]

I haven't seen this angle discussed anywhere yet, so I'll throw it out there.

I think all pretty well realize that, despite what the FDA is claiming it can do, they can't enforce any of this against 0mg juice, and the equipment for *exclusive* use with it any more than the DEA can regulate water pipes that are designated for tobbaco use.

You are correct, the DEA has no authority on regulating water pipes/hookahs. The deeming regulations give the FDA that authority now. And the FDA is going after vaping hardware, not just juice. However, a 0% nic juice that was not in any way derived from tobacco could be sold. They just don't want you to have any way to vape it.

Then again, there's always this coil set for dripping if worse comes to worse

Only $20 at Sears. Not sure the ohms on those coils. But 1,500W should give a nice cloud.........

 

[DC2]

You mean, like taking a thriving industry that would have been so easily brought into the tax scheme, and decimate it via ridiculously impossible to comply with regulations. It's actually kind of laughable if you look at it in those terms. One hand of government wanting so badly to tax a growing industry, and the other hand of government off on a zealous quest killing that same thriving industry.

My personal opinion...

They are not killing off the industry the want so badly to tax.
They are handing it over to Big Tobacco and making it MUCH easier to tax.

No free-roaming liquid, only closed systems with liquid inside.
Taxing would be much simpler and easier.

 

[mudram99]

I haven't seen this angle discussed anywhere yet, so I'll throw it out there.

I think all pretty well realize that, despite what the FDA is claiming it can do, they can't enforce any of this against 0mg juice, and the equipment for *exclusive* use with it any more than the DEA can regulate water pipes that are designated for tobbaco use.

That leaves us with the sole problem of nicotine. But I don't think even that nut is uncrackable.

Two words:

Indian Reservations.

At the very least, they are already immune to the taxation tactics the government might use, but they are also currently in battle with the FDA, specifically, over regulation of produce production and distribution rules.

THEY'RE CURRENTLY FIGHTING FOR EXEMPTION FROM THE FDA'S REGULATION AUTHORITY.

If they make ground there, which the two previous administrations have given them legal ammunition for, getting nicotine to supplement your 0mg vaping habit could be as simple as a trip to your local res.

All it would take is one creative NA entrepreneur, and we could totally remove the FDA from any say in any segment of vaping other than the BT product category.

Kewl, from here out please refer to me as Chief blowing what outta my what?????

 

[ENAUD]

If you recall, many moons ago, they began selling cigs that way (MEGA cheap). The feds cracked down on them, then everyone who purchased that way (myself included) received massive tax-owed notices, that we were literally forced to pay.

It may be a solution, but it won't last. Good thought though - I like the fact that we're thinking...

Don't stop believing, and all that-there.

I gots to ask, how did they get the info to know who to send the tax bills to? I am thinking ahead to when they will demonize and criminalize the possession of high % solutions of nicotine...