FDA says it intends to propose deeming regulation this summer, to track all tobacco ads (including e-cigarettes)

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bnrkwest

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Gee it does sound like a good idea to get some nic base in the freezer, I just checked and I have 60 nic level to work with and a bunch of 14 that needs cut in half as well since I am at 6-7 nic right now for vaping. I am also finding I really like to vape zero-3 at night, so nic lasts along time for me! I probably have enough for 5 yrs. LOL bnrk
 

t9c

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It's the vendors that need to get their act together .. this industry is still nothing more than a quick cash grab until the next Sham Wow comes along ..

Exactly! We ECF'ers seem to be in general agreement that the e-liquid vendors have the most to lose with increased taxing & regulation of nicotine. It's past due time for them to get an office in DC for their trade lobbyist group to get working on their behalf. Lobbying is an essential piece of "doing business" these days for any business and everyone of them needs to be in a trade organization that deals with legislators & regulators. Sadly, it's all about how much money you can throw on a legislators/regulators desk as to how they will vote/enact on bills and regulations concerning the industry.

I wish there was at least one lobby group in process of forming, then at least we vapers could demand participation from our vendors.
 

Stubby

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Bill, I asked this on the other thread .. and welcome anyone elses answer as well ..

What is the likely out come if it's "deemed" .. ?? Should we consider stocking up on liquid with nic .. ?? What is an expected timeframe .. ??

I'm not up on all the details of what would happen but there is one big thing that would be almost as bad as the FDA banning e-cigs.

Part of the Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act states that any tobacco product not on the market before February 15, 2007, will not be grandfathered. It will have to go through a different type of regulation and approval process, and I'm really not up on what exactly that entails.

Bottom line is the FDA could essentially ban all current e-cigs on the market. I have no clue as to if they can ban the hardware or just the liquid. I also don't know what was on the US market before February 15, 2007. It certainly wasn't much, if any.

Someone else is going to have to fill in the details.
 

Bill Godshall

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Uncle Willie inquired:

What is the likely out come if it's "deemed" .. ?? Should we consider stocking up on liquid with nic .. ?? What is an expected timeframe .. ??

I not only think it wise for folks to begin stocking up on e-liquid and perhaps other e-cigarette products that the FDA might ban or unjustifiably regulate, but I suspect that sales of e-liquid will skyrocket in the US this year, especially if/when the FDA formally proposes a deeming regulation for unregulated tobacco products (as the agency claims it plans to do).

If/when the FDA formally proposes the deeming regulation, the FDA will have to include (in the deeming regulation) specific definitions for all of the currently unregulated tobacco products, including e-cigarettes, which will at least let the public know what specific e-cigarette products the FDA is proposing to regulate just e-liquid and cartridges with e-liquid, or if the FDA also proposes regulation e-cigarettes hardware, electronics, batteries, etc.

It appears that the FDA may also be planning to propose additional regulations for currently unregulated tobacco products (beyond what a deeming regulation for Chapter IX would require), perhaps including banning sales of unregulated tobacco to minors, banning various flavorings in various unregulated tobacco products, restricting the amount/concentration of nicotine in e-cigs and e-liquid, etc.

But it is unknown if the FDA plans to include any additional regulations along with the actual deeming regulation (as every additional regulation the agency proposes will generate additional opposition from those who are negatively impacted). The political reality is that the White House simply won't allow the FDA to propose a contraversial regulation that pisses off tens of millions of undecided voters several months before the November election. The White House would tell FDA either water down the proposed regulations, or wait until after the election before proposing them (the latter of which has been my goal, and may end up being reality).

If/when the agency officially proposes the deeming regulation (with or without additional regs), the agency has already stated that there would be a public comment period (which could be 45, 60, 90 or 120 days, and could also be extended further by the agency).

After the public comment period ends, it would likely take the agency at least another several months (probably at least 6 months) before they could issue a Final Rule. So the FDA won't be regulating e-cigarettes before 2013.

For the past year, my goal has been to prevent the FDA from formally proposing a deeming regulation for e-cigs by exposing the many negative ramifications Chapter IX of the FSPTCA would have on the e-cigarette industry (e.g. Section 910 would effectively ban e-cig sales).

But if/when the FDA formally proposes a deeming regulation for e-cigarettes, my next goal will be to prevent the FDA from ever issuing a Final Rule for those regulations and/or to at least amend the proposed regulations to remove regulations that would ban and/or unjustifiably restrict/regulate e-cigarettes.
 
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markodes

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As stated in :

Rulemaking - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Public comment. Once a proposed rule is published in the Federal Register, a public comment period begins, allowing the public to submit written comments to the agency. Most agencies are required to respond to every issue raised in the comments. Depending on the complexity of the rule, comment periods may last for 30 to even 180 days.


Judicial review. In some cases, members of the public or regulated parties file a lawsuit alleging that the rulemaking is improper. While courts generally offer significant deference to the agency's technical expertise, they do review closely whether the regulation exceeds the rulemaking authority granted by the authorizing legislation and whether the agency properly followed the process for public notice and comment.
 

Bill Godshall

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I've been involved with two federal regulatory processes in the past.

After Congress enacted the Synar amendment (in 1991 or 1992) to require states to enforce their laws prohibiting tobacco sales to minors (or else lose federal block grant funding), the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Service Administration (SAMHSA) didn't formally propose the regulations until the beginning of 1994, then held a public comment period in 1994, but didn't issue the Final Rule until July of 1996.

Also, in 1994 the Occupational Safety and Health Administration (OSHA) proposed a regulation to ban smoking in all workplaces except restaurants and bars. But after the public comment period was extended and then ended, OSHA never issued a Final Rule for that proposed regulation and never issued an explanation why the agency decided to scrap the regulation.

So even if the FDA proposes a deeming regulation, holds a public comment period, and then decides to scrap the regulation (because our comments convince the agency that its a stupid idea), the FDA will never acknowledge that occurred. Instead, the agency will just stop talking about the deeming regulation, and move on to other things.
 
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NorthOfAtlanta

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...............................
So even if the FDA proposes a deeming regulation, holds a public comment period, and then decides to scrap the regulation (because our comments convince the agency that its a stupid idea), the FDA will never acknowledge that occurred. Instead, the agency will just stop talking about the deeming regulation, and move on to other things.

Typical bureaucrats, can't admit a mistake, congress might reduce their funding.

:facepalm::vapor::vapor::vapor::vapor::vapor::laugh:
 

Bill Godshall

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I forgot to mention that the US DOT proposed a regulation to ban e-cigarette use in all airlines last year. That public comment period ended in either November or December (5 or 6 months ago), and DOT has not yet issued a Final Rule on that proposed regulation.

And hopefully, we'll never hear anything more from the US DOT regarding that regulation, which would mean that we successfully convinced the agency to scrap the regulation. But DOT will never acknowledge if the agency decides to (or has already decided to) kill its own regulation.
 

TomCatt

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....

So even if the FDA proposes a deeming regulation, holds a public comment period, and then decides to scrap the regulation (because our comments convince the agency that its a stupid idea), the FDA will never acknowledge that occurred. Instead, the agency will just stop talking about the deeming regulation, and move on to other things.

That would work for me, and I'd not have a single problem with them not acknowledging. Heck, I'd even bake them a cake :D.
 

Luisa

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Yo Bill if you can stall them till after the election we just might have a chance. I say this because this officially confirms that obama is NOT going to get re-elected http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...1501761.html?ref=elections-2012&ncid=webmail1
Squirl1,you need to contact your Senator-Roy Blunt-and THANK Him for not voting for this proposed Bill from the Approriations Committee. Write a letter telling him your story about quitting smoking with the help of SmokeFreEcigs and if you have time visit a staffer at his District Office. You would be surprised how effective a "thank you" can be. Maybe some of your fellow Missourian Vapors might be encouraged to do the same. You might also mention the 2009 FDA study that left out the complete findings in their infamous press release.
 

sqirl1

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Squirl1,you need to contact your Senator-Roy Blunt-and THANK Him for not voting for this proposed Bill from the Approriations Committee. Write a letter telling him your story about quitting smoking with the help of SmokeFreEcigs and if you have time visit a staffer at his District Office. You would be surprised how effective a "thank you" can be. Maybe some of your fellow Missourian Vapors might be encouraged to do the same. You might also mention the 2009 FDA study that left out the complete findings in their infamous press release.

problem is I didn't smoke before; however my use of nicotine does have a purpose. I've seen various studies that nicotine is effective for treating ADD and autism, which I have both of. Of course this isn't recognized by the medical community obviously so I just kind of lay low about my vaping except for here. and for the record I only vape 4-8mg juice once or twice a day or maybe sneek a pouch of snus at work where even vaping (and smokeless tobacco for that matter, "all use of any tobacco products") is a big no no. But trust me I'm not the person CASAA wants to be vocal to congress, if they're concerned with PR that is.
 

TennDave

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So what ever happened with this?

Any New News?
Seems I read somewhere (Elaine post it??) that this decision was coming or at least an announcement about it around 6/24 so it's just a day or two wait to see what's transpiring. In my opinion though, the longer that they wait, the better for everyone.... the vaping community has become so large now that they will have a lot to deal with dealing with all the fall-out.
 

zoiDman

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Seems I read somewhere (Elaine post it??) that this decision was coming or at least an announcement about it around 6/24 so it's just a day or two wait to see what's transpiring. In my opinion though, the longer that they wait, the better for everyone.... the vaping community has become so large now that they will have a lot to deal with dealing with all the fall-out.

Thank you Dave.

I've been out of the loop lately ECF wise.
 

Vocalek

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Seems I read somewhere (Elaine post it??) that this decision was coming or at least an announcement about it around 6/24 so it's just a day or two wait to see what's transpiring. In my opinion though, the longer that they wait, the better for everyone.... the vaping community has become so large now that they will have a lot to deal with dealing with all the fall-out.


No news is Good News.
 

Saint57

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Dr. Margaret Ann Hamburg is the current FDA commissioner. She is a Chicago Democrat appointed by Barack Obama. Do you really believe she gives a rip about what the ecig community thinks? To a progressive, things like public opinion, common sense and facts don't matter. Progressives believe that they are smarter than the masses and know what's best for us. In fact, they believe you should thank them for making these decisions for you because clearly you couldn't possibly weigh the risks and decide for yourself. The enormous volume of new federal regulations is one of the reasons why this economy is still in recession. If President Obama is reelected,..well, I just can't even go there, it's too depressing.


Seems I read somewhere (Elaine post it??) that this decision was coming or at least an announcement about it around 6/24 so it's just a day or two wait to see what's transpiring. In my opinion though, the longer that they wait, the better for everyone.... the vaping community has become so large now that they will have a lot to deal with dealing with all the fall-out.
 

TennDave

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Dr. Margaret Ann Hamburg is the current FDA commissioner. She is a Chicago Democrat appointed by Barack Obama. Do you really believe she gives a rip about what the ecig community thinks? To a progressive, things like public opinion, common sense and facts don't matter. Progressives believe that they are smarter than the masses and know what's best for us. In fact, they believe you should thank them for making these decisions for you because clearly you couldn't possibly weigh the risks and decide for yourself. The enormous volume of new federal regulations is one of the reasons why this economy is still in recession. If President Obama is reelected,..well, I just can't even go there, it's too depressing.
I wasn't saying they care about our opinions- what I am saying is that we are a force they will have to contend with. Certainly they will have the upper hand but I can see droves of folks putting information out regarding the truth and those who have sat idle may finally wake up and do something... I just think that if they restrict us too much, people will take notice.
 
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