Now they are talking about banning refillable systems.

[Myrany]

It sounds according to a poster below that they’re going to ban everything BUT pod systems. Which may explain why all we’ve been seeing from manufacturers IS pod systems lately.

Well look at it this way. Lets say someone wants to do a mod with a 510 connector. They would have to show the FDA that no one can create fubar with ANY 510 atty out there. That alone means a proprietary connection that only works with that mod and an atty to go on it.

Now at that point they have to show that any juice put in it isn't harmful. So realistically a non refillable pod is the only option. They would still have to do the work for any flavor pod they created but it is a finite set as opposed to infinite with open systems.

Closed proprietary pod systems are very likely the only thing that could get through the FDA.

 

[vaper1960]

Do you all remember when we had better things to talk about? All this doom and gloom is bringing me down
Also so sick of hearing about Trump and politics. I'm finding myself slipping a having a few smokes here and there. I need to shake this feeling and focus on positive thoughts again (and order some more nic)

 

[Georgia Boy]

Anyone who's not worried is deluding themselves, intentionally or by a lack of understanding the Political Mind. Where money is concerned nothing matters but securing that funding.

Everyone should be worried, everyone should be doing whatever they can, such as I have have said before:

• Calling the White, their Senators, their Representatives, tell them your story, tell them why their wrong, quote articles, give them options
• Get involved with various organisation, such CASAA, local ones too
• Those who can afford to donate to groups such as CASAA do so
• Preparing for the November Rally in DC if you can't go give what you can monetarily or support wise
• Getting on Twitter, retweet things, the more retweets things get the the better chance the person it's aimed will see it
• Educate people with the truth
• Go to local vape shops find out what they are doing even support them buying a bottle or two of juice if you can afford to

You get the idea. The people here are a big part of this, I've heard ECF mentioned in more than a few Videos lately. You are good people, being treated badly, don't stand for it, do what you can to change it. If we don't unite and stand together we only have ourselves to blame.

 

[Myrany]

curious as to the details on that one that number doesn’t sound impossible at all. How did the numbers turn out for the deeming as far as projections vs actuality went?

BT doesn’t actually make anything. All they’ve done is buy out of date systems from other manufacturers and make them in China to begin with.
As for “a couple of Chinese companies” I suspect the numbers will be surprisingly high there. A million dollars isn’t much for a lot of companies. It will cut out the bottom end though.

All the info including links to the deeming documents are here on ECF. I suggest you go read some of it for yourself. Its been 2 years, its a lengthy document. I am not going back to duke my way through it again. It took me nearly a week the first time.

 

[bombastinator]

Do you all remember when we had better things to talk about? All this doom and gloom is bringing me down
Also so sick of hearing about Trump and politics. I'm finding myself slipping a having a few smokes here and there. I need to shake this feeling and focus on positive thoughts again (and order some more nic)

Yep. The world sucks alright. You’ll need replacement hardware too. Someone made a persuasive argument that they’re going to ban the 510 connector. Proprietary super high cost closed pods only.

Me I use YouTube lolcats for stress relief and try to avoid all news.

 

[Myrany]

Do you all remember when we had better things to talk about? All this doom and gloom is bringing me down
Also so sick of hearing about Trump and politics. I'm finding myself slipping a having a few smokes here and there. I need to shake this feeling and focus on positive thoughts again (and order some more nic)

The deeming (back then potential deeming) and preparing for what was coming has been on ECF as long as I have. The only thing new now is we are at the final roundup.

It doesn't surprise me that people are focusing on it. Many of them never really thought it would happen and are unprepared/underprepared.

 

[wetclay]

Who thought we'll live in a world where the "herb" is legalized and vaping is being restricted to the point of becoming illegal.
Anti nicotine fanaticism!
We suffered from it as smokers and now it's coming to hit us back as vapers.
Coumo (refrased) : use gums, patches, champix. So what if they don't work. So what if some commit suicide while on champix?
Depressing!
ECF is a sad place now. Hopefully one day it will return to it's glory.

 

[mightymen]

And they're screaming about Trump taking over and they are the ones who are doing what ever they want and getting away with it.

 

[Horselady154]

I'm betting what we will end up with are closed pods and if anything else survives, nicotine e-liquid will be by prescription only.

 

[Georgia Boy]

A quote from Churchill fits Politicians involved in the Flavor Bans perfectly

"Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened."


"A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on."

 

[f1vefour]

curious as to the details on that one that number doesn’t sound impossible at all. How did the numbers turn out for the deeming as far as projections vs actuality went?

BT doesn’t actually make anything. All they’ve done is buy out of date systems from other manufacturers and make them in China to begin with.
As for “a couple of Chinese companies” I suspect the numbers will be surprisingly high there. A million dollars isn’t much for a lot of companies. It will cut out the bottom end though.

The thing is there is no guarantee the device will be approved, it's actually much more likely that it will be money down the tube. No sane company will risk this when they can simply supply the EU and other places that don't have this ridiculous process.

 

[bombastinator]

Who thought we'll live in a world where the "herb" is legalized and vaping is being restricted to the point of becoming illegal.
Anti nicotine fanaticism!
We suffered from it as smokers and now it's coming to hit us back as vapers.

not exactly. Back then it was an issue that cigarettes kill people horribly and slowly because of the OTHER things in cigarettes. E-cigarettes removed them. The call is now “nicotine is addictive!” While also true it is a totally different complaint. Same people of course, but the money has changed. Now you have BT throwing cash at government and media to bring the old killer cigarettes back, which it looks like they may succeed at, because it’s profitable for them. The irony is the people who were on the end of saving people are now on the end of helping kill them. The call is “save the children!” But the children aren’t being killed by e-cigarettes, they’re being killed by adulterated street drugs, and the people who wanted to save lives by ending tobacco are happily lying about it.

Coumo (refrased) : use gums, patches, champix. So what if they don't work. So what if some commit suicide while on champix?
Depressing!
ECF is a sad place now. Hopefully one day it will return to it's glory.

 

[Astron]

Hi everyone,

The flavor ban is bad enough but I can’t find any articles about the open system tanks being eliminated (pre 5/2020). I was just out buying more vape stuff and I get home and see this post. What am I missing?

 

[bombastinator]

The thing is there is no guarantee the device will be approved, it's actually much more likely that it will be money down the tube. No sane company will risk this when they can simply supply the EU and other places that don't have this ridiculous process.

This may be true. The US market is valuable though.

It seems that it’s purpose designed so only BT, for whom a million dollars is nothing, will be able to enter with whatever horribly abusive low quality piece of garbage they choose and take home the whole pot. And of course the there’s the stupendously profitable closed pod only thing that raises consumer costs at the very least ten fold or more while making it impossible to lower dosages enough to make actual quitting possible. That’s the trick the patch people played for years.

 

[bombastinator]

Hi everyone,

The flavor ban is bad enough but I can’t find any articles about the open system tanks being eliminated (pre 5/2020). I was just out buying more vape stuff and I get home and see this post. What am I missing?

Apparently it’s found when combining both the 2016 FDA stuff with the stuff the just released.

I haven’t confirmed it myself. It’s supposed to be something of a slog, and the people who have done it are so far unwilling to give details.
It does jive with a few things though such as how all the new designs coming out of China suddenly turned to proprietary pods only some months ago. There’s a good chance it’s true.

 

[sonicbomb]

It's all about the money. The politicians attacking vaping are merely doing their pay-masters bidding.

Old news I know, but I just found out the FDA's Scott Gottlieb has been appointed to Pfizers board of directors. A man who made it his mission to vilify vaping, now takes a cushy job with a drug company. Wow, pick the peanuts out of that complex web of intent and reward.

 

[Horselady154]

Old news I know, but I just found out the FDA's Scott Gottlieb has been appointed to Pfizers board of directors. A man who made it his mission to vilify vaping, now takes a cushy job with a drug company. Wow, pick the peanuts out of that complex web of intent and reward.

That's not true. If it wasn't for Gottlieb, vaping would have been shut down 2 years ago. And I have still seen him in recent interviews where he has stressed the need to separate Juul from what adults are using.

 

[Eskie]

Hi everyone,

The flavor ban is bad enough but I can’t find any articles about the open system tanks being eliminated (pre 5/2020). I was just out buying more vape stuff and I get home and see this post. What am I missing?

Hardware will be around until 5/20. Hardware who's manufacturers file a PMTA for get an extra 12 months unless their PMTA is rejected before then. You will be able to continue to buy hardware for another 8 months. The flavor ban is killing the juice manufacturers now. Your state may take action before 5.20, as NY and MI have done. That can be overcome with some short term stocking up of commercial juice if you really like a particular brand, or getting on the DIY train. You'll have to board sooner or later, and truth is, once you have recipes you like you'll be amazed how much you save over the commercial stuff you've been buying.

After 5/20, hardware will still be made. The US is not the only market, and while it's pretty damn large, some Chinese and European builders will remain in business. The question will be ordering from overseas for personal use Given customs still can't stop fentanyl coming in through the mail from China, I don't see vape hardware to an individual as high on their list.

Do you all remember when we had better things to talk about? All this doom and gloom is bringing me down
Also so sick of hearing about Trump and politics. I'm finding myself slipping a having a few smokes here and there. I need to shake this feeling and focus on positive thoughts again (and order some more nic)

Please, don't go back to smoking. It's only letting them achieve what they want, cigarette sales to hang around that much longer. Have good thoughts about buying nic and any hardware that looks cool and you can fit in your budget. It is a public health disaster they don't even see, or care about if they've been bought off, but always protect yourself first. Then you can be active to try and help others not fortunate enough to be able to transition before all this happens.

 

[stols001]

I just read all about Alcohol prohibition, I wanted to see what other social factors were going on at the time. It appears it all started with the ending of slavery and the ending of polygamy (I mean legally anyway) and etc.

The thread I am seeing is social unrest and resistance to change. I would say the shoe fits. I'm not going to get into all about why.

But, I do feel a sense of civil unrest in this country and kind of... Unusual factions developing in various areas.

IDK. It was an interesting read anyway.

Anna

 

[AngeNZ]

Also so sick of hearing about Trump and politics. I'm finding myself slipping a having a few smokes here and there

Let yourself win, by vaping By smoking, you are letting the big tobacco companies win. And they suck monkey balls