Nicotine not addictive? Yeah right!

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DC2

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alien Traveler" data-source="post: 14766151" class="bbCodeBlock bbCodeBlock--expandable bbCodeBlock--quote js-expandWatch">
alien Traveler said:
And thousands are afraid to leave their houses without spares to spares (in case they are. Are they not addicted?
How do we know if they are addicted to nicotine alone or not?

We certainly know that they have been brainwashed to feel that for certain they are.
And that will forever cloud their thinking, their judgments, and their actions.

But are they really?

The only way to know for sure is to stop using nicotine.
And some have done that, either on purpose or on accident.

The results generally show that some don't miss it at all, and some just might.


And also this too, for those that may have missed the nicotine...

They are FORMER SMOKERS. Why is that so hard to understand??? THEIR BRAINS ARE DIFFERENT FROM NEVER-SMOKERS.
 

bluecat

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I would say point on current tangent is that it is refutable.

I think a very important point, brought up in your question, and responded to with a question is:

Are people addicted to it (or things in general) and/or are substances addictive?

I asked in another thread (2 days ago) what substances wouldn't be addictive? As even I believe some substances are not inherently addictive, then that question is refutable by pointing out what those substances are. Yet, given the logic that says nicotine is inherently addictive, which is based on the idea that people do thus and so with regards to their use of nicotine, then I still am left to wonder if we could convince ourselves that arguably everything we use is addictive. May not be for you, but if it is for anyone, then it would follow that possibly all things are addictive. I mean, we know work/money can be addictive. We know food can be. I observe most people appear addicted to use of shelter. So, all the basics are (or can be). I think if we run down the list, we would find that all things can be. Even while some people, perhaps a majority, are clearly not addicted.

So, the addiction to nicotine becomes rather pointless to assert it in a way that says nicotine is addictive. Cause arguably all things are addictive. And I say arguably, because I believe that is refutable.

And because more people don't use (have addiction to) nicotine than do, then in general, it is easy to conclude it is not addictive (on the whole). Furthermore, in non users of nicotine, when they breathe in second hand smoke, wouldn't that be prime opportunity to gain an addiction if nicotine is inherently addictive? Wouldn't it be more likely that our society would secretly want second hand smoke around them as much as possible if nicotine were truly addictive? You know, cause they'd be inhaling it and after just a few breaths of this 'highly addictive substances' they could despise the smoke aspect of it, but because addiction generally signifies lack of control, they'd have no control over their desire to be around 2nd hand smoke. They'd crave it. They'd want people to smoke around them as much as possible to get their nicotine fix.

Oh, but wait, we don't live in that shared reality. People inhaling nicotine from 2nd hand smoke aren't telling us they crave that, even while nicotine is going into their bloodstream. So, hmmm, maybe it isn't inherently addictive.

Perhaps it is closer to reality that person has got to have a preference for it, find enjoyment with it, a desire to reinforce that enjoyment factor, and THAT serves as foundation for this concept of addiction that we still seem entirely unclear on even while we toss the concept around like we know exactly, precisely what we are talking about, yet can't readily respond to a question as simple as, "aren't all things inherently addictive?"

Some reason a scene from the Princess Bride went through my mind reading that.

Cheers mate.
 

Alien Traveler

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How do we know if they are addicted to nicotine alone or not?

It's good we do not know. Do we want to test it on new (never smoked) users? I hope no.

So, on any question from a fresh vaper about addictivity of nicotine I will answer "highly probable it is addictive".

Edit: Any other answer will be in line with politics of BT: get user hooked, sell more. Is it now politics of Big Vaping? I hope no, but I am not sure (especially when reading this thread).
 
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bluecat

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I have seen so many bad things that are now good for you that I take everything with a grain of salt anymore. Coconut oil, coffee, chocolate were all in there, now they are health foods. The only thing that seems constant is some corporation pushing their agenda for the almighty dollar or the gov trying to get their cut out of it. I truly believe that if the bottom line was high enough they'd be pushing the greenest of grasses.....oops they already are.

Colorado: 15% Excise, 10% state, 2.9% state sales tax, local sales tax use 3.5% for Denver. 15+10+2.9+3.5 = 31.4% tax on that which should not be named which happens to be illegal at the federal level still. :facepalm: It is even too sad to even laugh at.
 

bluecat

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It's good we do not know. Do we want to test it on new (never smoked) users? I hope no.

So, on any question from a fresh vaper about addictivity of nicotine I will answer "highly probable it is addictive".

Edit: Any other answer will be in line with politics of BT: get user hooked, sell more. If it is now politics of Big Vaping? I hope no, but I am not sure (especially when reading this thread).

Personally I don't give a crap if we do test it with on new users. What is the big deal? Is vaping harmless less harmful.. compared to what.. smoking, drinking.. drinking and smoking? Dang man... when people say nanny state... they aren't so far off.

I am addicted to watching The Amazing Race... maybe I should be put in a straight jacket and hauled away to Bellevue Mental Hospital...

I just don't get it.
 

Bernard Marx

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there is a significant difference between doublethink and inquiring about other possibilities than what we are lead to believe. You can say it is the exact opposite of doublethink. If you read andrias posts in this thread, you'll find one with links that may open your mind a little. If i kept thinking 'yes, nicotine is just as addictive as ......' after reading her posts, i would be doublethinking.

Nothing personal. Just can't let people get away with abusing 'nineteen eight-four'. :toast:



ignorance is strength
 

navigator2011

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I don't doubt that nicotine is addictive, based on my own personal experiences and those of people I know. But nicotine is not the sole ingredient in a cigarette. One very powerful ingredient in a smoked cigarette is carbon monoxide (CO), it actually is largely responsible for the "calming" effect of the cigarette. On one hand there's the nicotine, which reminds us of when to smoke and gives us some satisfaction when we add more nicotine, but on the other hand there's the CO which we interpret as a relaxed feeling that we get while smoking, and is especially useful when stressed out and angry. A lack of CO may be one reason why vaping sometimes appears to be "missing something."
 

WattWick

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ignorance is strength

Now that's trolling...

You are projecting your beliefs onto me. Some people treat information differently than others. Pieces of information is (to me) not necessarily the same as truths. They're just pieces that may or may not make up a bigger picture at some point.
 

Whitewolf2014

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I know I am addicted.
In my earlier years I went several months without inhaling anything dangerous into my lungs, then I looked out of the hole I was in and was scooped up, given a swift smack to my bottom and then it began.
I was hooked, there was no way to stop.

I became addicted to BREATHING. :p It's been all downhill since then.
 

Bernard Marx

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Now that's trolling...

You are projecting your beliefs onto me. Some people treat information differently than others. Pieces of information is (to me) not necessarily the same as truths. They're just pieces that may or may not make up a bigger picture at some point.

Shhh, I have to shut my door...I think my kids are eavesdropping!



(It's OK it was just DC)
 
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DC2

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It's good we do not know. Do we want to test it on new (never smoked) users? I hope no.
It has been tested...

At least with nicotine alone sans the inhalation of burning tobacco smoke.
Results tend to show no addiction potential for the most part.

I'd post the links again, but think I already did earlier in this thread.
:)
 

beckdg

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Do we want to test it on new (never smoked) users? I hope no.

YES!

I'd have much rather seen my brother vaping as a young boy than see what he went through on ritalin. That **** shouldn't be available for adults let alone to a large portion of the population of children.

I'd also rather seen my grandmother retain some cognizance in her later days.

Nicotine may be useful for treatment and vaping looks to be a healthier/safer alternative than anything that's on the market for ADD or alzheimers currently.

Sent from my device.
 

readeuler

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Yes, I do not like it also.
Results say one thing, statements - another.

Yes, we get it - you've already decided you don't like Dr Farsalinos, and will occasionally lash out against him; nothing new here.

I remember your thread in General Discussion which actually prompted a response from Dr F himself (which did nothing for you, if I recall), and I remember you attempting to spread misinformation in Media and General news to the point where SJ himself gave you an ultimatum.

I see absolutely no discrepancy between Dr F's important research, and his more general views and comments on vaping.
 

skoony

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It's good we do not know. Do we want to test it on new (never smoked) users? I hope no.

So, on any question from a fresh vaper about addictivity of nicotine I will answer "highly probable it is addictive".

Edit: Any other answer will be in line with politics of BT: get user hooked, sell more. Is it now politics of Big Vaping? I hope no, but I am not sure (especially when reading this thread).

if in fact non tobacco users show no dependency to nicotine all the
ensnaring new addicts politics goes out the window regardless from
which camp its coming from.
new users starting with vaping becomes a non-issue. its off the
table. this is very important as it removes one the key arguments
being used against us vapers in the ANTZ's crusade to regulate
and tax us like smokers.
:2c:
regards
mike
 

englishmick

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Some people treat information differently than others. Pieces of information is (to me) not necessarily the same as truths. They're just pieces that may or may not make up a bigger picture at some point.

Nicely put. It's like the bathtub full of 3000 factoids. Anyone can rummage through and pull out a couple that match what they already believe. Doesn't mean those 2 factoids are false, but they are part of a very big picture.

I heard a segment on the radio the other day about mindfulness. I was driving and most of it went in one ear and out the other, but one phrase stuck. It was a definition of the absence of mindfulness. "Often wrong, never in doubt". I'm fairly comfortable these days with not being sure. I've changed my opinion often enough over the years not to take my opinions too seriously. At least I think I don't.
 
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