Nicotine not addictive? Yeah right!

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Ryedan

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the reason i feel this debate is important is because of the coming
regulations.
if in fact it is true that if you have never used tobacco and then start
using nicotine in non tobacco form and it shows no addictive qualities
not even dependency than the whole ANTZ argument about enslaving
a whole new generation of chillin' goes right down the drain.

Very good point skoony. The problem IMO is that even if the research gets done and proves that vaping nic is not addictive, almost no-one would believe it because almost everyone 'knows' it is addictive.

It's sad how brainwashed people have become on this issue.
 

Ryedan

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well yes, dear, you do know that the anti-smoking activits masquerading as "experts" are not "scientists". Their blathering and ideology has nothing to do with "science". It is a belief. And they are preachers of the Church of Perfect Health - as Father Jack has said so well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omMrWw9dGUM

(If you do not know Father Jack, or are not religious - I am not religious either - do listen for a while. To find out what he is actually doing in this video :D )

Thank you Anja, that was just too funny, on so many levels. Always nice to get in a few good laughs :thumb:
 

Ryedan

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Maybe I'm brainwashed, but I would have a hard time believing after all the studies they have done about nicotine being addictive, they suddenly realize, "Oops, never mind."

Studies on nicotine alone, or on cigarette addiction?

If they are on nic alone, I would love to see them :)
 

AndriaD

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and when the patient dies, BT is at fault. BT just forwards the cost on to the consumers, so they don't care. it's a win, win for both of them.

No, they don't care at all -- caring is definitely not part of their business plan.

Actually, I should amend what I said earlier about helping people not being part of their business plan; it actually might be, but in the sense that the more they help, the more money they make -- notice what kind of robbery prices they charge for NRT? And Effexor? That stuff, last I checked, was about $120/mo, for a MINIMAL dosage. For that kind of money, when poverty was one of the causative factors in my depression, I'd just go on and kill myself and be done with it.

to me, i think (without proof either way) the more i get from the original product (tobacco), the more likely the danger is going to increase. after all, that's what i'm trying to minimize. originally for my kids. but i feel so much better now, that it's for me as well.

I felt this way to some extent, primarily that WTA would just help perpetuate the addiction, my first time around; other than some mild, short-term depression around the 3-wk and 3-mo points, I actually did pretty well without it. But the 2nd time around, with all those intestinal issues, without WTA I wouldn't have been able to remain smoke-free at all, so that kinda removed that particular thinking from the equation.

Andria
 

TheBikeGuy

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Studies on nicotine alone, or on cigarette addiction?

If they are on nic alone, I would love to see them :)

To be honest I don't remember. I'm as guilty as everybody else of after hearing something over and over for years it just seems like "common knowledge". I do see your point though. When I'm doing genealogy, I see all kinds of things that are common knowledge that are completely wrong. I do "feel" as though I'm addicted. I have nothing to back that up though. I just know vaping greatly diminishes my cravings for tobacco.
 

klynnn

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I can remember when I was smoking and I couldn't go 30 min without this overwhelming compulsion to smoke. It got worse in later years especially after I retired. Hell I was lighting one off the other. Sure a lot of that was boredom but you will never convince me that there is not something more in cigarettes than nicotene. It has to be something in the chemical soup they use. I don't have that compulsion after vaping. It is now more of a hobby and relaxation thing. I can go hours if need be, but couldn't with cigs.
 

tchavei

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This thread is curious. It seems that everyone of us reacts, experiences and deals with the transition from smoking to vaping differently. It also seems that tobacco and nicotine have different effects on us.

Back when I used to smoke, one of my friends smoked twice as much as myself. I smoked a pack and a half and he did three. We both were convinced he was probably twice as dependent as I was. The first time we switched to vaping, we soon realized we were using the same amount of eLiquid monthly (about 90ml of 24mg).

I thought it was curious as we seemed to need the same amount of nic to get along. However, I had bad cravings in the morning (sometimes I had to go up to 36mg or smoke a cig) but he didn't.
After a few years, we both returned to smoking and he went right back to smoking twice as much as myself.

This time when I decided to vape again, I actually managed to stay away from cigs for good. Nowadays devices seem to deliver the nic much better and I haven't felt the desire or need to even consider an analog. I still get urges in the morning but the cravings are for vaping, not smoking.

The cravings feel exactly the same as when you wake up and want a smoke. I believe that's why many confuse the feeling and think they are craving for a cig.

In my specific case, I'm craving for nicotine. If it is addictive or if I'm just imagining things, I don't know but I need to have my satisfaction in the morning, one way or the other.


Regards
Tony

Sent from my GT-I9195 through Tapatalk
 

skoony

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I've heard that. I've also heard caffeine is completely non addictive. I've also heard that nicotine addiction is on par with a {Moderated} addiction. I prefer to believe the latter. The former just makes me look weak.:unsure:

for some people the addiction to nicotine(or perhaps to nicotine in the smoke)
has been a harder habit to quit than .......
there is one subtle difference. i know no one whom has died of nicotine
withdrawal. the same can't be said for .......
:2c:
regards
mike
i see what you did there.the filters blocked my spelling.
 
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skoony

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Maybe I'm brainwashed, but I would have a hard time believing after all the studies they have done about nicotine being addictive, they suddenly realize, "Oops, never mind."

there never have been any studies of nicotine by itself with out
being in tobacco form using people whom have never used nicotine
or tobacco products.
there however been many clinical trails where nicotine by itself
was administered to test for its medicinal qualities for the treatment
of illnesses. in those trails never users showed no addictive attributes
to nicotine alone.
:2c:
regards
mike
 

supertrunker

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Perhaps it was a grammar checker and objected to 'whom have'.

The truth is that nicotine = smoking cigarettes in every report you ever read. Since disassociating nicotine from tobacco smoking would lose tax revenue, it's unlikely to be high on any government agenda to study properly.

T
 

Bernard Marx

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It was quite difficult to get the nicotine out of cigarettes in large quantities because the smoke would overwhelm you first. With vaping this isn't a problem.

I am sure I am ingesting way more nicotine than I ever did when I was smoking and because of this my residual level of it is quite high and lasts for much longer and so I don't crave a hit as often.

I'm pretty sure it is addictive.
 

DC2

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I am sure I am ingesting way more nicotine than I ever did when I was smoking and because of this my residual level of it is quite high and lasts for much longer and so I don't crave a hit as often.
Every study I've seen so far regarding the nicotine level of vapers has shown lower levels than smokers.

It should be mentioned that experienced vapers using high end equipment in some cases WERE able to approach the level of smokers.
And it also should be mentioned that these studies were done before sub-ohm vaping came around.

But in the past, having recognized that vapers generally did not get as much nicotine as smokers...
And given that history has shown us that a large percentage of vapers do become less addicted to vaping over time...

It has often been postulated that the fact that we were getting less nicotine was causing us to need less nicotine.
Which is kind of the opposite of what you feel is happening to you.

My opinion doesn't really coincide with either viewpoint.
:)
 

sub4me

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I sure know I've been awake many nights because I was vaping, the nicotine intake has often kept me up at night. Can't remember being kept awake from smoking.

Fact is its easy to just keeping puffing away on your ecig. I use 24mg and many times I will sit there watching TV for a few hours vaping and then try to go to bed lol, it's impossible to sleep. So in my opinion someone can easily take in a lot of nicotine. I know everyone is different and does things differently, but I never sat around smoking one after the other but with vaping it tastes so good its easy to vape a lot.
 

Jman8

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Maybe I'm brainwashed, but I would have a hard time believing after all the studies they have done about nicotine being addictive, they suddenly realize, "Oops, never mind."

I would say, emphatically, you (like the rest of us) have been brainwashed. This isn't a "oops, we realized otherwise" scenario. In 1 day of research, you would learn that it is a "cool, our agenda to convince them that smoking/vaping nicotine is highly addictive, and very harmful, is alive and well. And our agenda to control pharma nic and dispense it under our medical model of addiction will bring in lots of revenue for lots of (our) purposes. But remember everyone, we must absolutely stick to the plan that vaping/smoking nicotine is highly addictive and therefore a significant (medical) problem."

I don't see the "oops, never mind" scenario ever playing out unless science changes its game. And while that is a knock against science, there is, in reality the theoretical version of science that we can all find in a dictionary or what we were being taught in grade school, maybe even high school, and then there is the way science works in conjunction with big business and big government. Hence, the reason that scientists can be paid very handsomely for their contributions, even while THEIR contributions are often at odds with other scientists. It is very much like scientists have gotten into the dogma game and a lot like scientists have denominations to which they adhere their core principles to; and the theoretical version of science takes a backseat naivete to anyone who is only coming from that perspective.

Hence, putting our eggs in the basket of science, when overwhelming amount of anecdotal evidence shows otherwise, does strike me as foolish. And politically dumb to not realize that we are operating in a reality where brainwashed fools, who refuse to think critically on the issue, are part of (if not main reason) why the status quo of "nicotine is highly addictive" is the predominant meme.

The "nicotine is highly addictive" claim is really easy to challenge. Yet, when challenged, is often met with preposterous claims of "so just stop now if it isn't at all addictive" or "you must be a tobacco shill for there to be a disagreement with the righteous thinking I am conveying."

If every other product / good, was scrutinized like nicotine and tobacco are, society's growth would be severely stunted as we would be allowing molecules of 'danger' to prevent us from any innovation in any field. And yet, when we on the critical thinking side of things bring this up, it does work rhetorically to have people consider the topic beyond the superficial narrative being told, yet also just happens to have the nanny-state minded citizens say to themselves, "wow, we could do this with literally everything and ensure we have an income for our 'research' for a long long long time to come.
 

beckdg

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I sure know I've been awake many nights because I was vaping, the nicotine intake has often kept me up at night. Can't remember being kept awake from smoking.

Fact is its easy to just keeping puffing away on your ecig. I use 24mg and many times I will sit there watching TV for a few hours vaping and then try to go to bed lol, it's impossible to sleep. So in my opinion someone can easily take in a lot of nicotine. I know everyone is different and does things differently, but I never sat around smoking one after the other but with vaping it tastes so good its easy to vape a lot.

You know. You're not alone. Many of us (myself included) have experienced the same.

Though I can't help be curious if there's other factors involved. When I was doing the patch, the gum and smoking simultaneously, I didn't have that problem. And now that I'm vaping at levels I'd call inadvisable, my sleep hasn't been disturbed in any way I can attribute to vaping or nic.

I often ponder the possibility that I'm getting enough nic fast enough that it doesn't sneak up on me at night. Almost as if with lower nic, I was vaping like i stole it to get satisfied. Then 5 minutes later it was still elevating in my bloodstream causing night time tinnitus and insomnia.

And I chain smoked while on the patch and the gum. So this is VERY curious to me.

Sent from my device.
 

xena222

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I just see it as nicotine is addictive, if I didn't vape I would smoke - it can't be all nicotine however that kept me on smokes (I chainsmoked wearing the patch and probably almost gave myself a heart attack :( ) I am addicted to coffee too - no coffee=bad headache...nicotine however had a different response in withdrawal to me - no nicotine = I want to scream and hit things....
There are other things in cigarettes that help feed the addiction, the delivery method for one, yep...and vaping is nicotine delivered in a different way (which is why I still get cravings sometimes)
I just understand I am addicted to nicotine...I know I am...I have no plans of ever dropping down the nic....nicotine wasn't what the problem was with cigarettes to me - destroying my lungs and making me not able to breathe was the problem
 
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